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Midget subs sunk at Pearl Harbor. Base still not put on Alert?

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posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 11:23 PM
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Most people here realize there are fishy things about world war two. It seems there were midget subs sunk at the entrance of Pearl Harbor one hour and 15 minutes before the attack began. Maybe this has been talked about here sorry if it has.




The discovery of the midget submarine confirms the account radioed to naval command at Pearl Harbor at 6:45 am on Dec. 7, 1941 . A Japanese submarine was shot through the conning tower and then depth charged trying to enter Pearl Harbor behind the USS Antares. The crew of the attacking USS Ward , an older style four stack destroyer, saw the midget sub lifted out of the water by depth charges after firing the fatal shot from its four inch side gun. The Ward's crew were Naval reservists from St. Paul, Minnesota. Unfortunately, Naval command in Pearl Harbor ignored the Ward's report and the aerial attack began at 8 am. At the Pearl Harbor investigation, some question was made of the accuracy of the Ward's report. The Ward is now vindicated. The Ward itself was later targeted by the Japanese and sunk in a kamikaze attack, ironically on Dec. 7, 1944, in the Philippines.


www.soest.hawaii.edu...
edit on 7-12-2011 by mayabong because: (no reason given)




posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 12:10 AM
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It's very easy to look at things with hindsight and make all sorts of judgments.

At the time it probably looked like they had sunk a sub that was spying. America wasn't in the war at that time. Sinking one midget sub in NO way predicted the coming attack.

I find it more interesting that Japan's "warning" (if it existed?) was lost. Think about how little communication occurs between branches of law enforcement, government, and military TODAY - and how it could have prevented many disasters - and imagine what it was like in the age before computers. Even if there were warning signs, lack of communication may have caused those signs to be missed.



posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 12:45 AM
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Pearl Harbour was a sacrifice to get America into the war.


The US was warned by, at least, the governments of Britain, Netherlands, Australia, Peru, Korea and the Soviet Union that a surprise attack on Pearl Harbor was coming. All important Japanese codes were broken.



From traffic analysis, HI (Hawaii) reported that the carrier force was at sea and in the North. THE MOST AMAZING FACT is that in reply to that report, MacArthur's command sent a series of three messages, Nov 26, 29, Dec 2, to HI lying about the location of the carrier fleet - saying it was in the South China Sea. This false information, which the NSA calls inexplicable, was the true reason that HI was caught unawares. Duane Whitlock, who sadly passed away in 2005, sent those messages.


This is a link to a site that explains it all in great detail

www.whatreallyhappened.com

Enjoy the read



posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 12:51 AM
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The fact is that the U.S. was in fact engaging German subs in the Atlantic.

Before DEC 7, 1941.

To assume communications were thin is absurd.

The U.S. HAD to have been on some kind of standing alert at Pearl.

The diplomatic negotiations were ongoing also, right up to the attack.


On the morning of September 4, 1941, destroyer USS Greer (DD 145) was en route from Newfoundland to Iceland when she picked up sonar contact with a German sub. A British patrol plane had warned Greer that the U-boat was lurking in her path earlier. The destroyer made and held contact uneventfully for nearly 3 1/2 hours, when suddenly, a torpedo was spotted heading for the ship. Greer turned sharply, avoiding the torpedo, and let loose a salvo of depth charges. Again, a sharp turn and another torpedo charged by the destroyer, which was followed by a salvo of depth charges from Greer. By late afternoon, Greer lost contact and after a three-hour search, she continued on to Iceland. Apparently, the sub had dropped the fight, but the attack prompted President Roosevelt to issue orders to "shoot on sight" any warships within "our defensive waters."

The destroyer USS Kearny (DD 432) was commissioned on Friday, September 13, 1940. Thirteen months later, Kearny, in company of destroyers Plunkett (DD 429) , Livermore (DD 431), and Decatur (DD 341), was dispatched on an emergency mission 350 miles south of Reyjavik, Iceland. A Canadian convoy was being attacked by German submarines. In the late afternoon of October 16, 1941, the four U.S. destroyers took up station as a screen around the Canadian merchantmen. The wolfpack which was followed by a salvo of torpedoes had temporarily withdrawn, shortly before midnight a merchantman suddenly went up in a ball of flame. The Germans had returned. Kearny and the other DDs rushed to the attack, but the U-boats broke off the engagement.

Minutes passed. Suddenly, two more merchant ships were ripped apart by German torpedoes, and the fight was on again. Near 2 a.m., Kearny had to cut her speed to avoid ramming a Canadian corvette. In the glow of the burning merchant ships, Kearny became a virtual sitting duck and one German submarine skipper took advantage of the situation, firing three torpedoes at the destroyer. Two missed, but the third tore a jagged hole in Kearny's starboard side, thus making her the first U.S. destroyer damaged in World War II. Kearny, which by the extent of the damage should have gone down, managed to limp into Iceland for repairs and continued fighting throughout the war. Greyhounds of the Sea
...read the article for more examples.


and why did the U.S. carriers leave Pearl Harbor ahead of time? Hmmmm.



Officer mistook radar warning of Pearl Harbor raid

Tyler was the Army Air Forces' first lieutenant on temporary duty at Fort Shafter's radar information center on the morning of Dec. 7, 1941, when a radar operator on the northern tip of the island reported that he and another private were seeing an unusually large "blip" on their radar screen, indicating a large number of aircraft about 132 miles away and fast approaching.

"Don't worry about it," Tyler told the radar operator, thinking it was a flight of U.S. B-17 bombers that was due in from the mainland.




• When Japanese Commander Mitsuo Fuchida called out, "Tora! Tora! Tora!" ("Tiger! Tiger! Tiger!") upon flying over Pearl Harbor, it was a message to the entire Japanese navy telling them they had caught the Americans totally by surprise.


There is a different interpretation.
Inside sources say that when FDR was notified of radar contact before the attack, he was told the radio frequencies were filled with people yelling "Tora ! Tora ! Tora !".......
FDR said; "never mind, they must be friends of ours!"





Pearl Harbor advance-knowledge conspiracy theory

where did those mini subs come from?
Did they said all the way from Japan?
how did they refuel?



posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 01:18 AM
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The Honolulu Advertiser dated November 30th 1941

The week before the Pearl Harbour attack, they seem to have known plenty





posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 09:59 AM
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I posted few links yesterday on another thread related to Pearl Harbor and the Midget UBOATS.

ATS Link



posted on Dec, 7 2014 @ 10:13 PM
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Today I am especially mindful of Pearl Harbor Day, as it again falls on a Sunday and the years are transposed (41 and 14). Luckily the weather was nice enough to put the flag out. The last World War Two vets just left Congress recently...end of an era!

Thinking of the two inexperienced guys on duty blamed for Pearl Harbor being as bad as it was. The second guy, who was expecting some American planes, infamously said, "Don't worry about it," and received angry letters for years afterwards. He died at 96 in 2010. If the first guy would have told him how many planes, he'd have known something was up for sure. But the first guy, who died at 90 in 2012, was also new and didn't know! warstoriesandveteranshistories.wordpress.com...

I attended church for years with a Pearl Harbor survivor but don't believe I heard his story until it was read at his funeral. It was quite fascinating if anyone wants to hear it. I was going to tell it to the pastor (who's been here only a few years and didn't know him) after church at coffee hour, but there was a church bazaar, so no coffee hour.



posted on Dec, 7 2014 @ 10:44 PM
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The public wouldn't accept getting involved in another conflict after WW1..something had to happen to get john q public onside. It was inevitable some kind of attack by Japan.



posted on Dec, 8 2014 @ 12:12 AM
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A british MI6 agent warned FBI Director HOOVER about the invasion. THE officail story is Hoover didn't tell the president because of the agent's ethnicity.
I say they knew.



posted on Dec, 8 2014 @ 12:58 AM
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a reply to: cavtrooper7

Oh yeah. They knew! They planned for the Japanese to attack Pearl Harbour. They just needed the right strategy to create the Pearl Harbour False Flag!

Just look at weirdguy's link!

It's all the same sorry people killing strategies to make loads of money and gain more power.

Same as the Lusitania sinking to get into WW1, same as the Gulf of Tonkin fake incident to get into the Vietnam War and the same as 9/11 to get into the Middle East Resource and land Grab!



posted on Dec, 8 2014 @ 02:56 AM
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a reply to: weirdguy

The Netherlands was occupied by Nazi Germany at the time..



posted on Dec, 8 2014 @ 04:01 AM
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originally posted by: biggilo
a reply to: weirdguy

The Netherlands was occupied by Nazi Germany at the time..


Plus Korea had been occupied by the Japanese since 1910. No way that the Korean Government could send a warning. Not without being shot. A couple of important facts for you all. 1) The USA was still on a peacetime footing. The armed forces were expanding rapidly but that does NOT mean that they were on a war footing. Mistakes were inevitable - the delay in reporting the sinking of the midget subs was down to disbelief and a sclerotic chain of command. The radar evidence is a case in point. The radar station at Opana Point wasn't supposed to be on 24/7 it was on at certain times of the day because they were still getting used to the system. The plotting room that they sent the report to consisted of men who were so green that they had grass growing on them. 2) Much is made of the carriers being missing. At that time the teeth of the fleet was seen to be the battleships and not the carriers, which regarded as being mostly the eyes of the fleet - they'd scout around the battle line, they might even damage some of the enemy if they found them, but the main threat to battleships was seen as other battleships (such as what happened to the Bismarck). The USN had only just started to absorb the results of the raid on Taranto, so carriers were not seen as being vital. 3) The Philippines were seen as being more at risk than Hawaii.



posted on Dec, 8 2014 @ 04:48 AM
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originally posted by: Deveron
Oh yeah. They knew! They planned for the Japanese to attack Pearl Harbour. They just needed the right strategy to create the Pearl Harbour False Flag!

Same as the Lusitania sinking to get into WW1, same as the Gulf of Tonkin fake incident to get into the Vietnam War and the same as 9/11 to get into the Middle East Resource and land Grab!



How old is this story that Roosevelt knew? I remember hearing it in school, no later than college in the early 1980s, but assume it started after his death. I did wonder how they got such awesome footage of the event which made great propaganda but it's not out of the question that they kept cameras handy just in case.

The Lusitania seems to have been an accident blamed on the enemy, lucky for people anxious to enter the war. I did find it odd that in that case and the Gulf of Tonkin, much ado was made over only one ship, while in World War II they had to sink an entire fleet before anyone said boo about it. Have you heard of a ship called the good Reuben James?

This recording is essential due to the intro. Notice how this happened over a month before the U. S. entered the war? Yet if a famous musician had not written this song, no one nowadays would know anything about it! www.youtube.com...

This video is nothing short of awesome! www.youtube.com... It includes not only a picture of the ship, but the names of all 95 sailors lost in the attack, following the original intention of the writer, Woody Guthrie. It was Pete Seeger who suggested that was maybe a few too many names to list in a song and wrote the chorus used ever since.
edit on 8-12-2014 by CoriSCapnSkip because: Add song links.



posted on Dec, 8 2014 @ 05:13 AM
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originally posted by: Deveron
a reply to: cavtrooper7

Oh yeah. They knew! They planned for the Japanese to attack Pearl Harbour. They just needed the right strategy to create the Pearl Harbour False Flag!

Just look at weirdguy's link!

It's all the same sorry people killing strategies to make loads of money and gain more power.

Same as the Lusitania sinking to get into WW1, same as the Gulf of Tonkin fake incident to get into the Vietnam War and the same as 9/11 to get into the Middle East Resource and land Grab!



The sinking of the Lusitania did not get the US into the First World War. She was sunk in 1915. The Zimmermann Telegram in 1917 had a far greater impact.
edit on 8-12-2014 by AngryCymraeg because: Typo



posted on Dec, 8 2014 @ 05:17 AM
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a reply to: Schkeptick



Sinking one midget sub in NO way predicted the coming attack.

well no, but was protocol followed. should some state of security not have been entered into. should some kind of reconnaissance not have been actioned.
and as for the age of computers comment that is a reach if i ever read one.



posted on Dec, 8 2014 @ 05:30 AM
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originally posted by: PLAYERONE01
a reply to: Schkeptick



Sinking one midget sub in NO way predicted the coming attack.

well no, but was protocol followed. should some state of security not have been entered into. should some kind of reconnaissance not have been actioned.
and as for the age of computers comment that is a reach if i ever read one.


The USS Ward, which sunk that minisub radioed the sinking in, it just took a long time to get passed on up the chain of command. It was the captain's third day on the job (he was appointed to take command of the ship on December 5th) and it was his first command, so the next bloke up the chain of command wanted the report verified. Of course by the time it made it to Kimmel it was too late to do anything - he was in his quarters getting dressed to head into his office when the attack started.



posted on Dec, 8 2014 @ 08:24 AM
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The USA knew all too well that an attack was imminent, and that the attack would be the cataclysmic "something" needed to drag the US into WWII..so it had to happen.

Just as they knew the Lusitania would be sunk. The Germans had warned them months before they would do it, but once again, they need an excuse to enter WWI, which, made the USA some millionaires..



posted on Dec, 8 2014 @ 08:28 AM
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originally posted by: andy1972
The USA knew all too well that an attack was imminent, and that the attack would be the cataclysmic "something" needed to drag the US into WWII..so it had to happen.

Just as they knew the Lusitania would be sunk. The Germans had warned them months before they would do it, but once again, they need an excuse to enter WWI, which, made the USA some millionaires..


Once again, the sinking of the Lusitania did not get the USA into the war. The ship was torpedoed in 1915. The USA declared war in 1917, after the folly that was the Zimmerman Telegram.



posted on Dec, 8 2014 @ 08:31 AM
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originally posted by: AngryCymraeg

originally posted by: andy1972
The USA knew all too well that an attack was imminent, and that the attack would be the cataclysmic "something" needed to drag the US into WWII..so it had to happen.

Just as they knew the Lusitania would be sunk. The Germans had warned them months before they would do it, but once again, they need an excuse to enter WWI, which, made the USA some millionaires..


Once again, the sinking of the Lusitania did not get the USA into the war. The ship was torpedoed in 1915. The USA declared war in 1917, after the folly that was the Zimmerman Telegram.


The sinking of the Lusitania was the 9/11 of its day.

It gave the governemnt the anti German propaganda necessary to take the US into the war with the backing of the people...It suceeded in drawing world support largely in favour of the allies.

1) The Lusitania did not fly flags designating it as a civilian ship
2) The name Lusitania was hidden on the ships side and the Treasure Quest team did prove this when they found where the ships name was located.
3) The Lusitania's sister ship, the Mauretania, was stripped down and turned into a military vessel which was made widely know and by concealing the Lusitania's identity, the Germans would have had no knowledge it wasn't the Mauretania
4) The ship manifest included things which made no sense like hundreds of large containers of butter kept in "non refrigerated" where they would quickly ruin.

She was running arms to Britain, Germany knew it and warned the US..but she kept on keeping on..with the desired effect..
edit on AM1Mon20141972 by andy1972 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 8 2014 @ 08:52 AM
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a reply to: andy1972

No, she had a flag forrard, but not one aft. Non flagged vessels approaching the British Isles tended to attract the Royal Navy! The sailing of the Lusitania was well advertised and as for being confused for the Mauretania that was completely impossible as she was a) still in civilian service and b) laid up in Liverpool due to a lack of passengers! Mauretania wasn't requisitioned for the Royal Navy until later that year, when she was used as a troopship for the badly run Gallipoli campaign. As for the butter, there was also lard in there and it was going to a weapons testing establishment, so presumably it was to be used as grease. Two final things. First, she had small arms ammunition and unfilled shell cases in her hold, which believe it or not was perfectly legal and in keeping with the Hague Convention. Second she was sunk TWO YEARS before the US declared war. The Zimmermann Telegram and the start of unrestricted submarine warfare had a far larger impact on the US - especially the former!




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