Total Society Breakdown - OCCUPY Oakland Reduced to Flash Bang Bombs & Tear Gas

"Total society Breakdown?"
Hardly. Protests go on all over the world all the time, even with rubber bullets and tear gas involved.
We have them often in France.
Society goes on.

The police draw first blood why am I not surprised. So now the people can't have a peaceful assembly because they're met with flash bangs, tear gas, rubber bullets. This Looks like a different person not sure, but he definitely has a wound in need of a few stitches.

Link

Originally posted by watcher3339
Can we all at least be honest about the fact that there are two distinctly separate groups that support Occupy?
Group One: Wants change. Is frustrated by the foreclosures, the bailout, the burden of student loans when they are unable to get a job paying more than 8 bucks an hour, the unemployed, and the severly underemployed. They are also agitated by the "let them eat cake" attitude of many at the top who do not seem to understand that real standard of living in this country has declined for most of the people who live here.

I get it. I hear them. I even think many of their complaints are valid and that change is needed though I am not convinced that this is the way to achieve it.

Group Two: Wants anarchy for some reason of their own that is beyond my capacity to understand. They want to toss the baby with the bath water. They have a limited ability to process cause and effect and look at the long term ramifications of actions. For some of them this caused them to make choices that they now want to blame on others. They have not improved their understanding of long term ramifications of actions since making those bad decisions so now they make an even worse decision to sign on for anarchy or socialism because they don't actually get the ramifications of that either. Some of them are just super bitter. Some are in a misguided attempt to recapture their protest filled youth, and some are just so alone in a society that has failed them in terms of family and community that they just desperately want to be a part of SOMETHING.

Group One would have a better chance having their legitimate concerns listened to and addressed if Group Two wasn't a part of the equation. Sure, group two ads numbers, but htey also add al the wrong kind of press. And how many numbers have they cost the movement? They are the reason I am not backing it, that much I know for sure.

I fear the economy is beyond repair, that hitting rock bottom and wiping the slate clean is the only way out of this sink hole of corruption. This is like a farmer trying to desperately save his crop from a swarm of locusts devouring everything. The only fix is to burn it down, till it under and start over.

reply to post by sean


Problem is, in this case, if you "burn it down and till it over", you won't have Anything to "start over" With.

We're not talking about seed crops here, we're talking about the whole Global Economic structure.

Destroy that, even with the best of intentions, and you'll have not only "burned the crops", but salted the fields as well.


Rock and an very hard place I'm afraid.


We can't afford (pardon the pun) to tear down the whole world's economic system without risking the total breakdown of the whole world's society.


And yet, unless we "reset" the economic structure of the entire world, we cannot begin to hope for any real, lasting, and mutally beneficial change.

reply to post by sean

I really do understand the frustrations and the problems facing many people. It IS unacceptable that people who want to work to pay their way in life are unable to find work. Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong. That must be fixed right away and I almost don't even care if they use the means of the right or the left to do it so long as it gets done.

But, most people in this country are able to obtain the requirements of life. Food, shelter, and clothing. I know that there are people slipping through the cracks and they do need to be caught but there is no way that our country is bad/wrong on scale of the Arab Spring.

We already have the system in place that works. We, as a people, have failed to be watchful to be certain that our system is not corrupted. It is corrupted. But we need antibiotics to get rid of the infection, not a fire for the field.

Setting fire to the field will only allow those who currently have the most resources (the one percent) to set themselves up as Lords in Fact instead of just in practice. THeywill be able to recreate any system they want because they will be the ones with the means to do so. Then you and I will become serfs of some sort. And while right now I sometimes feel like a cog in a machine, and it sometimes chafes, I would rather be a cog than a serf.

Use the system.
If this much energy could go into how to elect politicians without huge corporate dollars, to enforce the will of the people via elected representatives, and, into have a real conversations (where nobody shouts, too much shouting all the way around these days, it just isn't productive) about what the American people want, then I think we will have improvement.

I will give this to Occupy. While it worries me and I don't like the many ways in which it could go very wrong, it has started the conversation at a different level. I will totally give them credit for that, but they have to not let a handful of people or ideas, or a lack of cohesive ideals due to their attempt to be so inclusive, buck the majority of people in the country.

There is a new silent majority in this country. We are very middle of the road. We want social security kept. We want 40ish hour work weeks. We want to not get work calls past 11pm if we work day and aren't contractually agreed to be on call. We want our politicians to stop lying to us all the time. And we want to stop feeling like poverty has moved in down the street and been eyeing OUR house. We want to see our neighbors go to work in the morning instead of either milking the system or spending yet another day looking for a real job and not finding one.

Speak to those concerns in a way that is inside the system and you'll have more people ready to help than you know what to do with.

reply to post by watcher3339


Perfect post, perfect way of summing all this up, eloquent, direct, and realistic. You are a great writer, and I agree 100%

If we tear apart our nation, it will be chaos and isn't that the main goal for tptb? "order out of chaos"

God only knows what kind of "order" we'd be left with by the time the blood is washed off the streets......

The protesters wanting radical change better be careful what they are wishing for they just may not like what they get.......

Scott Olsen is in a "critical condition", in Highland hospital, a spokesman for the hospital has just confirmed to me.

(We already knew he was there from the accounts below, but this is the first official confirmation).

from;

www.guardian.co.uk...

reply to post by Bhadhidar


I know that was a rough figure of speech to use, but I think everyone would agree that there is a LOT of things that need to be scrapped in our system including elected officials that don't do their jobs. Their solution is always adjusting taxes. Lets lower tax, no no no let's raise taxes, no no no let's tax everyone the same. They refuse to look at government spending. Spending is easy though when you got the IRS skinning all the sheep and the Federal Reserve down in the basement printing their counterfeit money.

Originally posted by spacedoubt

I think the real problem, and the excuse to go in, is the sanitation problem.

strict anti-litter laws they have there

Originally posted by shogu666

Originally posted by JohnySeagull
Few months the occupy movements will be gone and forgotten.

Just tell how this can happen within perpetual economical decline, corrupted government, and fraud that rules financial world.
??????
Get you head out of the clouds, it can olny go worse from now on if nothing changes.

Yup, thats what i mean by total breakdown. cuz if you look at a graph of the dollar value in the past 100 year,

then look at how consumerist Americans have become,

without money, and buying power, sooner or later Americans will act up, riot, and loot, and attack, and be killed.

our government is seasoned in making the victim look like the terrorist, and i think now all these rioters as they rise up in cities and the attitude gets contagious are now looked at as threat to the government, as far as human species including society, our days our numbered. society will go extinct first, then the race itself.

reply to post by ignant


I agree in that I feel that many of the protestors themselves believe our society to be broken and are at heart questioning the very core of what we value.

Originally posted by intrptr

Originally posted by ignant
in America, nobody wants to work anymore, they just want to protest, get high, and bring the world down with someone to blame for it all.

Actually it is America who is bringing "the world" down. And you are blaming these guys for that? At least they have the courage to stand up and face "their world".

NO your both wrong. It is the ELITE who caused all this in the first place. Who are still causing the hell now. The same people who we talk about here on a.t.s.

Originally posted by cloaked4u
It is the ELITE who caused all this in the first place. Who are still causing the hell now. The same people who we talk about here on a.t.s.

Same same. I agree. I just tend to call it America. Thats how the rest of the world sees it. They don't distinguish as much as we do between the people of America, and the leaders of the Corporations, Military and the Government. After all it is the citizens who work and pay taxes that pay for their control of us.

Look at WWII to see how sympathetic we were towards German and Japanese cities. The Allies carpet bombed, firebombed and Nuked millions of civilians in an effort to shorten the war. The rest of the world shall have no alternative to but do the same to us if we don't get our act together and take back this country. 911 was but a warning, a prelude of things to come if "America" continues on her present course.

Originally posted by JohnySeagull
Its not really a total society breakdown. Its small numbers. People aren't eating the young. Its a scuffle.Its not a total breakdown in society.

Few months the occupy movements will be gone and forgotten.

I agree, but wonder what is next. "When people lose everything, they lose it..." Everyday more and more people do not have anything else to do but "occupy" somewhere because the bank seized the house>

reply to post by ignant


Ignant...how many threads are you gonna start on this Occupy Oakland topic today?

reply to post by ignant

our government is seasoned in making the victim look like the terrorist, and i think now all these rioters as they rise up in cities and the attitude gets contagious are now looked at as threat to the government, as far as human species including society, our days our numbered. society will go extinct first, then the race itself.

And the Oscar nomination for best actor in a dramatic role is.........