Is you actually a female?
Anyway I always found any honda , mower or car , to be good . There's room for in the belly of ...
Survival ATVs and you, page 1
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Topic started on 19-10-2011 @ 02:09 PM by Evolutionsend
I've noticed that some people here in the survival forum are either interested in an ATV for survival, or might fall into the category of an ATV
buyer. I have a lot of experience with ATVs in pretty dismal terrain because everyone where I grew up owned one, and they all put them through hell,
for lack of a better description. Some made it, and some were junk after a few years. Some are still in the trenches, steadily fighting, since about
1991. Some of these machines are good enough to last for twenty years in conditions that most would consider unreasonable for a vehicle to survive
in.
Why an ATV?
The reason that an ATV is a desirable survival vehicle is because they're tough, some of the better brand/models can take abuse, and never complain. They're also good on gas. A smaller displacement ATV can go for a few hundred miles on one tank of gas, provided it's in good operating condition. They're capable in any terrain, mud, sand, snow, water, climbing. I've driven ATVs up roads that were so steep walking without a tow rope was nearly impossible. They're quick, and they're quiet. An ATV can accelerate very quickly, almost as fast as a motorcycle, and with a stock muffler can be somewhat stealthy. They can cover a lot of ground quickly over rough terrain, if you push the machine to it's limits. Most of the normal non-performance oriented ATVs will run on low grade gasoline, or even stale gasoline. It's not recommended, but they're resilient in the fuel area as well.
Which one to buy
When shopping for an ATV for survival purposes, you need to consider a few things about the machine. Durability, reliability, gas mileage, off road capability, and "foolproof design". Most of those are self explanatory, except for the "fool proof design" factor. What that means, is how well is the machine protected from stupidity. Does it have a raised intake snorkel? Does it have strong steel skid plates? What kind of transmission does it have? How many "quick fix" buttons does it have on it? A quick fix button is something that's built into the vehicle, to fix a small but common issue quickly, like a back up kick starter, or a fuel primer. For all of the above factors, imo, no one has it more right than Honda. I've heard that the newer Honda's are not as good as the old ones, but I have no basis for comparison because everyone that I know that rides Honda, is still using a 1990s model because they have had no reason to buy another ATV. One thing that I really like about Honda, is their waterproofing system. They have an intake and system of lines raised beyond the water level of a floating ATV. This means, that as long as you do not flip the vehicle in water, it can float across as much water as you're comfortable trying. The only downside is, that after about 5 feet when the machine can no longer touch bottom at all, it's nearly impossible to keep it right side up. The gyroscopic effect from the wheels churning the water will flip it over.
That ATV has nothing other than the factory intake setup. I've heard that little feat referred to as, "the 300 trick", and it does work. In certain situations having a machine built this well, can be the only way out.
The other guys.
The heavy ATV sunk straight to the bottom, and the air intake wasn't high enough. Bigger is often a bad thing in the ATV
world.
Another fool proof area to look over, is the transmission. A constant velocity transmission looks good to a potential buyer, but they're not a good choice for survival because even a small amount of water finding it's way past the cover, will strand you and your ATV.
Wet CVT belt. Notice the smoke coming from around the engine, and the lack of 4wd. He probably destroyed the belt.
The best transmission options for a stout survival ATV is to find one with a semi-automatic. It works like any other manual, except the clutch is more like a torque converter on an automatic transmission for a car. You do not use a clutch for shifting. A sport utility is the only type of ATV that's likely to meet all of your requirements for a woods/survival vehicle. The sport models do not have the same foolproof design or off road capabilities as the sport utility 4x4s.
Accessorize!
Yes, everyone's favorite part of survival, finding the cool things that hopefully serve a purpose. After you've chosen an ATV, you're going to want to add a few items to any model. The most important area, is the tires. Most factory style tires are only 2 ply, and may be destroyed by a sharp rock. The easiest way to fix the problem, is to upgrade to some aftermarket 6 or 8ply all terrain tires. This will give you improved flat resistance, an increase in wheel weight, and better all around traction. The weight of this tires is substantially higher than the stock tires, so remain within the factory sizing for the best reliability. Here's one that's been around for a while, and that many people like:
Gbc Dirt Devil
There are many options for tires, so don't be afraid to shop around.
Another good item to get, is additional fuel capacity.
These are an old
product that can be stacked on your ATVs racks, or mounted with the brackets out of the way. They can increase your fuel capacity by 20 gallons or
more if you're only using the racks to carry fuel. If you're a hunter, you may enjoy my Dad's favorite accessory, the
handle bar gun carrier. It keeps
your gun or bow in an easy spot for quick access. The last thing that you need to think about, is a
winch, if you're traveling solo. If you're
traveling with more than one ATV, it's not needed. There are many accessories to choose from, but these are the ones that most survivalists will get
the most use from.
Test it!
Yes, many people will enjoy an ATV in a non-survival situation, so take yours out and see what it's made of. If it's going to break, now is the time to break it. Remember to always wear a helmet and take whatever drivers course your manufacturer offers!
Why an ATV?
The reason that an ATV is a desirable survival vehicle is because they're tough, some of the better brand/models can take abuse, and never complain. They're also good on gas. A smaller displacement ATV can go for a few hundred miles on one tank of gas, provided it's in good operating condition. They're capable in any terrain, mud, sand, snow, water, climbing. I've driven ATVs up roads that were so steep walking without a tow rope was nearly impossible. They're quick, and they're quiet. An ATV can accelerate very quickly, almost as fast as a motorcycle, and with a stock muffler can be somewhat stealthy. They can cover a lot of ground quickly over rough terrain, if you push the machine to it's limits. Most of the normal non-performance oriented ATVs will run on low grade gasoline, or even stale gasoline. It's not recommended, but they're resilient in the fuel area as well.
Which one to buy
When shopping for an ATV for survival purposes, you need to consider a few things about the machine. Durability, reliability, gas mileage, off road capability, and "foolproof design". Most of those are self explanatory, except for the "fool proof design" factor. What that means, is how well is the machine protected from stupidity. Does it have a raised intake snorkel? Does it have strong steel skid plates? What kind of transmission does it have? How many "quick fix" buttons does it have on it? A quick fix button is something that's built into the vehicle, to fix a small but common issue quickly, like a back up kick starter, or a fuel primer. For all of the above factors, imo, no one has it more right than Honda. I've heard that the newer Honda's are not as good as the old ones, but I have no basis for comparison because everyone that I know that rides Honda, is still using a 1990s model because they have had no reason to buy another ATV. One thing that I really like about Honda, is their waterproofing system. They have an intake and system of lines raised beyond the water level of a floating ATV. This means, that as long as you do not flip the vehicle in water, it can float across as much water as you're comfortable trying. The only downside is, that after about 5 feet when the machine can no longer touch bottom at all, it's nearly impossible to keep it right side up. The gyroscopic effect from the wheels churning the water will flip it over.
That ATV has nothing other than the factory intake setup. I've heard that little feat referred to as, "the 300 trick", and it does work. In certain situations having a machine built this well, can be the only way out.
The other guys.
The heavy ATV sunk straight to the bottom, and the air intake wasn't high enough. Bigger is often a bad thing in the ATV
world. Another fool proof area to look over, is the transmission. A constant velocity transmission looks good to a potential buyer, but they're not a good choice for survival because even a small amount of water finding it's way past the cover, will strand you and your ATV.
Wet CVT belt. Notice the smoke coming from around the engine, and the lack of 4wd. He probably destroyed the belt.
The best transmission options for a stout survival ATV is to find one with a semi-automatic. It works like any other manual, except the clutch is more like a torque converter on an automatic transmission for a car. You do not use a clutch for shifting. A sport utility is the only type of ATV that's likely to meet all of your requirements for a woods/survival vehicle. The sport models do not have the same foolproof design or off road capabilities as the sport utility 4x4s.
Accessorize!
Yes, everyone's favorite part of survival, finding the cool things that hopefully serve a purpose. After you've chosen an ATV, you're going to want to add a few items to any model. The most important area, is the tires. Most factory style tires are only 2 ply, and may be destroyed by a sharp rock. The easiest way to fix the problem, is to upgrade to some aftermarket 6 or 8ply all terrain tires. This will give you improved flat resistance, an increase in wheel weight, and better all around traction. The weight of this tires is substantially higher than the stock tires, so remain within the factory sizing for the best reliability. Here's one that's been around for a while, and that many people like:
Gbc Dirt Devil
There are many options for tires, so don't be afraid to shop around.
Another good item to get, is additional fuel capacity.
These are an old
product that can be stacked on your ATVs racks, or mounted with the brackets out of the way. They can increase your fuel capacity by 20 gallons or
more if you're only using the racks to carry fuel. If you're a hunter, you may enjoy my Dad's favorite accessory, the
handle bar gun carrier. It keeps
your gun or bow in an easy spot for quick access. The last thing that you need to think about, is a
winch, if you're traveling solo. If you're
traveling with more than one ATV, it's not needed. There are many accessories to choose from, but these are the ones that most survivalists will get
the most use from. Test it!
Yes, many people will enjoy an ATV in a non-survival situation, so take yours out and see what it's made of. If it's going to break, now is the time to break it. Remember to always wear a helmet and take whatever drivers course your manufacturer offers!
reply posted on 19-10-2011 @ 04:27 PM by watchdog8110
Would you go 8, 6 ,or 4 wheel ?
Personally , my choice would be for 6 or 8 wheel . Simple matter of if one goes flat you can still get there on the 5 or 7 remaining .
www.argoatv.com...
www.unusuallocomotion.com...
Personally , my choice would be for 6 or 8 wheel . Simple matter of if one goes flat you can still get there on the 5 or 7 remaining .
www.argoatv.com...
www.unusuallocomotion.com...
reply posted on 19-10-2011 @ 04:35 PM by Evolutionsend
reply to post by watchdog8110
6, 8wheel and amphibious vehicles are great, if you never intend to leave a swamp. They're slow and fragile on dry ground. They're also dangerous in any water that's moving fast. Most people would not want one. If you live in Louisiana or another state with a lot of marshland, then it might be good for you.
The Argo amphibious types have no suspension, and when bouncing over bumps at their slow 20-25 mph top speed the axles and drivetrain tend to be problematic.
6, 8wheel and amphibious vehicles are great, if you never intend to leave a swamp. They're slow and fragile on dry ground. They're also dangerous in any water that's moving fast. Most people would not want one. If you live in Louisiana or another state with a lot of marshland, then it might be good for you.
The Argo amphibious types have no suspension, and when bouncing over bumps at their slow 20-25 mph top speed the axles and drivetrain tend to be problematic.
edit on 19-10-2011 by Evolutionsend because: (no reason given)
reply posted on 19-10-2011 @ 06:21 PM by ScottishBiker420
reply to post by Evolutionsend
Another fool proof area to look over, is the transmission. A constant velocity transmission looks good to a potential buyer, but they're not a good choice for survival because even a small amount of water finding it's way past the cover, will strand you and your ATV.
I would strongly advise against cvt type power-trains,cheaper ones tend to slip rather annoyingly when placed under load,also are heavier on petrol(Gas to the yankee-types).plus a manual is faster,more versatile over gradients,and if this were to be used in a SHTF scenario where fuel is a commodity wasting it is the last thing you need!
Another fool proof area to look over, is the transmission. A constant velocity transmission looks good to a potential buyer, but they're not a good choice for survival because even a small amount of water finding it's way past the cover, will strand you and your ATV.
I would strongly advise against cvt type power-trains,cheaper ones tend to slip rather annoyingly when placed under load,also are heavier on petrol(Gas to the yankee-types).plus a manual is faster,more versatile over gradients,and if this were to be used in a SHTF scenario where fuel is a commodity wasting it is the last thing you need!
reply posted on 19-10-2011 @ 07:12 PM by Evolutionsend
reply to post by ScottishBiker420
That was my point about CVT, they stink. Semi-automatic is the best transmission option for sport utility 4x4s. A semi-automatic is the name for a manual transmission without a clutch. You shift it with a foot lever like any other manual cycle, but it has an automatic clutch. It's the most reliable you can get on a sport utility 4x4. I've never heard of a 4x4 with a full manual with a clutch before.
reply to post by Rebel21
I kid you not, my uncle bought an Arctic Cat 400 in 2005, and by 2008 it had blown a head gasket and was pulled to the main road by a 1991 Honda 300 4x4. He bought the ATV when my Dad was riding an already old bike, and the Honda outlasted it.
reply to post by ScottishBiker420
I remember reading about an interview a publication conducted with a Honda test rider a long time ago. They asked him, what was the silliest thing you've ever had to do in testing. His answer, was to ride around on a Honda in first gear with the throttle wide open until it ran out of gas. He said it took 22 hours, and it did it without a hiccup.
reply to post by neo96
They don't really break. I've never seen my favorite model break down. You could try throwing it off a cliff, or maybe rolling it around in a river a while. That might break it. Oh wait, my uncle flipped the '91 Honda 300 and sent it down a nearly vertical hill without a rider for a couple hundred feet. It didn't break, but it did bend the front bumper when it finally stopped. Okay, so maybe rolling it upside down under the water might break it. I'll provide pictures of the damage tomorrow. It's still at my Dad's being used.
My Dad's friend that lives next door on a horse ranch, says that his Honda is more reliable than his horse, and he loves his horse. He has a Honda Foreman 4x4 for ranch duty.
The only diesel ATVs I've ever seen have been released by less than reputable manufacturers. Do you really need to go watch the Polaris video again?
It won't matter what it burns if it can't even turn all 4 tires in 4 wheel drive. Any brand that would rather buy engines from KTM for their
flagship sport ATV, than produce their own, is not a manufacturer that I'm buying from.
Sure, it uses gas, but it uses a lot less gas than a deuce and a half.
That was my point about CVT, they stink. Semi-automatic is the best transmission option for sport utility 4x4s. A semi-automatic is the name for a manual transmission without a clutch. You shift it with a foot lever like any other manual cycle, but it has an automatic clutch. It's the most reliable you can get on a sport utility 4x4. I've never heard of a 4x4 with a full manual with a clutch before.
reply to post by Rebel21
I kid you not, my uncle bought an Arctic Cat 400 in 2005, and by 2008 it had blown a head gasket and was pulled to the main road by a 1991 Honda 300 4x4. He bought the ATV when my Dad was riding an already old bike, and the Honda outlasted it.
reply to post by ScottishBiker420
I remember reading about an interview a publication conducted with a Honda test rider a long time ago. They asked him, what was the silliest thing you've ever had to do in testing. His answer, was to ride around on a Honda in first gear with the throttle wide open until it ran out of gas. He said it took 22 hours, and it did it without a hiccup.
reply to post by neo96
They don't really break. I've never seen my favorite model break down. You could try throwing it off a cliff, or maybe rolling it around in a river a while. That might break it. Oh wait, my uncle flipped the '91 Honda 300 and sent it down a nearly vertical hill without a rider for a couple hundred feet. It didn't break, but it did bend the front bumper when it finally stopped. Okay, so maybe rolling it upside down under the water might break it.
I'll provide pictures of the damage tomorrow. It's still at my Dad's being used. My Dad's friend that lives next door on a horse ranch, says that his Honda is more reliable than his horse, and he loves his horse. He has a Honda Foreman 4x4 for ranch duty.
The only diesel ATVs I've ever seen have been released by less than reputable manufacturers. Do you really need to go watch the Polaris video again?
It won't matter what it burns if it can't even turn all 4 tires in 4 wheel drive. Any brand that would rather buy engines from KTM for their
flagship sport ATV, than produce their own, is not a manufacturer that I'm buying from. Sure, it uses gas, but it uses a lot less gas than a deuce and a half.
edit on 19-10-2011 by Evolutionsend because: (no reason given)
reply posted on 19-10-2011 @ 08:14 PM by ScottishBiker420
reply to post by Evolutionsend
I am not knockin ktm as a manufacturer but ROTAX,who supplies their engines,may also be the case for some polaris machines IIRC,are generally poorer than some of the manufacturers that create their own engines,Hondas just never cease to amaze me tho,have had the privilege of owning a few honda motorcycles,id struggle to accept any other manufacturer,even other japanese manufacturers
I am not knockin ktm as a manufacturer but ROTAX,who supplies their engines,may also be the case for some polaris machines IIRC,are generally poorer than some of the manufacturers that create their own engines,Hondas just never cease to amaze me tho,have had the privilege of owning a few honda motorcycles,id struggle to accept any other manufacturer,even other japanese manufacturers
reply posted on 19-10-2011 @ 08:14 PM by ScottishBiker420
reply to post by Evolutionsend
I am not knockin ktm as a manufacturer but ROTAX,who supplies their engines,may also be the case for some polaris machines IIRC,are generally poorer than some of the manufacturers that create their own engines,Hondas just never cease to amaze me tho,have had the privilege of owning a few honda motorcycles,id struggle to accept any other manufacturer,even other japanese manufacturers
I am not knockin ktm as a manufacturer but ROTAX,who supplies their engines,may also be the case for some polaris machines IIRC,are generally poorer than some of the manufacturers that create their own engines,Hondas just never cease to amaze me tho,have had the privilege of owning a few honda motorcycles,id struggle to accept any other manufacturer,even other japanese manufacturers
reply posted on 19-10-2011 @ 08:16 PM by ScottishBiker420
reply to post by Evolutionsend
I am not knockin ktm as a manufacturer but ROTAX,who supplies their engines,may also be the case for some polaris machines IIRC,are generally poorer than some of the manufacturers that create their own engines,Hondas just never cease to amaze me tho,have had the privilege of owning a few honda motorcycles,id struggle to accept any other manufacturer,even other japanese manufacturers
I am not knockin ktm as a manufacturer but ROTAX,who supplies their engines,may also be the case for some polaris machines IIRC,are generally poorer than some of the manufacturers that create their own engines,Hondas just never cease to amaze me tho,have had the privilege of owning a few honda motorcycles,id struggle to accept any other manufacturer,even other japanese manufacturers
reply posted on 19-10-2011 @ 08:33 PM by Evolutionsend
reply to post by ScottishBiker420
I know a lot of them do. That's why I would never buy from the manufacturer that does that. If they do not have faith in their product, then neither do I. Polaris has been building engines for a long time, they just aren't very good at it, so they would rather buy them from someone else. That's a triple post btw. I've never seen that here. Something wrong with your computer?
I know a lot of them do. That's why I would never buy from the manufacturer that does that. If they do not have faith in their product, then neither do I. Polaris has been building engines for a long time, they just aren't very good at it, so they would rather buy them from someone else. That's a triple post btw. I've never seen that here. Something wrong with your computer?
reply posted on 19-10-2011 @ 08:57 PM by ScottishBiker420
reply to post by Evolutionsend
Yeah,apologies for that,internet was freezing,making it look like i hadent sent the reply
Perhaps TPTB have spotted me looking at too much conspiracy theories and are trying to screwme around so i log off HAHA
*adjusts tinfoil hat*
Yeah,apologies for that,internet was freezing,making it look like i hadent sent the reply
Perhaps TPTB have spotted me looking at too much conspiracy theories and are trying to screwme around so i log off HAHA
*adjusts tinfoil hat*
reply posted on 19-10-2011 @ 09:53 PM by Evolutionsend
reply to post by Smurfwicked
I think we've got three for Honda and a few undecideds. I'm in the Honda camp. ATVs cost a lot and having a new one with issues is a real sinking feeling. Make sure you take your time and get something good.
I think we've got three for Honda and a few undecideds. I'm in the Honda camp. ATVs cost a lot and having a new one with issues is a real sinking feeling. Make sure you take your time and get something good.
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