It spreads. The 99% scatter outward.

Originally posted by DrumsRfun
reply to post by Wide-Eyes

 

The trader is NOT a trader or insider.
He is one of the YES MEN.
It was a joke.
Whether its true or not...it was a joke.

See this is the same guy hoaxing another interview.

That's not one of the yes men. could you please send me a link to you claim. Thanks

Originally posted by zigguratvertigo
I think the most worrying part of the BBC interview with the trader, is that it shocked people. A lot of people thought it was a hoax and/or the guy was an impostor. Then they try to discredit him by saying, weeeelll, he is only a private trader - what does he know. Personally, I stopped watching television 7 or 8 years ago because it was manipulative, biased trash. You finally get somebody on TV, who is unscripted and not in somebody's pocket telling it how it is... and people can't handle it.

I totally agree with you on this. There was nothing that trader said that was so shocking ... well, to members of ATS maybe.

The most surprising to me was that a BBC journalist was so surprised at this. Her exact words were "jaws have collectively dropped at what you just said".

Surely she isn't that naive? Or was she just shocked that he said what he did with such candor? Which begs the question - was this a live interview?

China is going to lead the world as they took advantage of the economic conditions.

More to come.

This is the first year I ever had to work side by side with 2 students from China. Guess what, we made them mad and they both quit the job,

The biggest change most of us have ever seen is the internet. The effects of this self organizing organic nervous system cannot be overlooked. This is a great uniter for the whole of humanity.

It is our job, and especially that of the youth, to transcend the centuries old ideas about what government actually is. Capitalism, Communism, I say good riddance to these ideas. Let's bring in Logic'ism, or Watson'ism and let our machines play a role in a fundamentally different type of government.

A government that is above all fair and reasonable.

S & F OP,

Thought about gathering information about this as well, but here are a few good links to support this global movement.

Occupy Wall Street
This is the main website for NYC. The team that started it all.

Occupy Together
This website is spreading the occupation, every major city in the US is starting to implement strategies of their own to occupy banks, buildings, etc. in their area. For example, Indianapolis is starting on October 8th and has gained over 1000 followers in three days online.

Twitter Feed

Inaction has plagued this great nation of the US for too long. I encourage each of you to join your local cities organizing efforts for this cause and start the occupation in your town. If your fearful, scared, or too lazy to join the fight, then at least tell people and share this information with them. Many people simply do not know this is going on.

Day 11 recap - notice how pilots joined for the day.

Kind regards.

WE ARE ANONYMOUS, WE ARE 99%, EXPECT US!

Naysayers still think we are just a bunch of scrip kiddies?

reply to post by TheOneElectric


While there is a great deal to be pissed at, the "youth" are being coopted by socialists and anarchists.

the "youth" are useful idiots to a large extent. As a 40+ year old, I've met precious few "young" people that could competently poor piss out of a boot. A large portion seem to want everything given to them. Give them a flag to rally behind and they march like happy sheep with dreams of the hippie 60's in their minds.

Remember that many of those hippies are now in power.

The class warfare is another wedge to destroy our society.

So you want a revolution? Are you sure that it will end the way you think it will?

Be careful for what you ask for.

If the revolution did/does happen, there will be an immense political void. The current "revolutionaries" have neither the education , common sense, nor the moral compass to guide them in such a void. I can not take any bunch serious that while wearing "Che" shirts, they couldnt identify a picture of George Patton or give even a cursory history of either world war.

I am with you OneElectric - I am going to remain an observer for now. Perhaps it is cowardice, but I just can't see these protests ending well.

Even if they are entirely peaceful, all it would take is a planted bomb to go off amoungst a line of Police, or a planted person in the crowd to throw a molotov cocktail and then the whole thing gets messy really fast. They can then use that to justify violence against the crowd, which will of course cause them to react violently and before you know it, Marshal Law is justified. Its pretty much game over if that happens.

IMO what we need to do, is just walk away. The people with the power now will have nothing without servants in the Military, Police etc to do their dirty work for them. At some point the humans in those roles have to realise that what they are doing doesn't feel right. But that can't happen until we have viable alternatives for survival in terms of food, water, shelter outside of the current corporate/capitalist system.

I am still undecided on Anonymous - I really, really want to believe they are on "our" side, but its entirely possible they aren't who they say they are and are basically leading people into a slaughter. At the very least, there are people out there using the Anonymous mask to cause chaos - though as other posters said, you can usually tell if they are inciting violence that they aren't on the level.

But then again, perhaps its all just fear. I don't want to be afraid anymore. I'm tired of it.

I am just trying to focus on the eventual positive outcome of all of this, but its easy to lose sight of amoungst the chaos and confusion!

Originally posted by felonius
reply to post by TheOneElectric

 

If the revolution did/does happen, there will be an immense political void. The current "revolutionaries" have neither the education , common sense, nor the moral compass to guide them in such a void. I can not take any bunch serious that while wearing "Che" shirts, they couldnt identify a picture of George Patton or give even a cursory history of either world war.

And it is only those images of history that the elite want us to remember- war. We always break up our history by the wars- never by the periods of peace. The time for elevating war leaders and the wars themselves is past. We do not need another set of leaders like them.

Passive noncompliance will get you farther than any conflict imaginable. The old way fighting our way out of everything using violence must be laid to rest.

Originally posted by feloniusIf the revolution did/does happen, there will be an immense political void. The current "revolutionaries" have neither the education , common sense, nor the moral compass to guide them in such a void. I can not take any bunch serious that while wearing "Che" shirts, they couldnt identify a picture of George Patton or give even a cursory history of either world war.

I take your point, but in all seriousness what do any of those things have to do with changing the way we live or building a NEW civilisation?

I think you'll be surprised what the younger generations are capable of once we are "unplugged" from the distractions that have so far captured our attention.

Besides, we'd still have the oldies like you around for guidance

P.S. I don't wear Che shirts, not sure who George Patton is (Just looked it up - US Army General in WW2 - no relevance at all to my life) and I can give a cursory outline of both World Wars. Both the real versions and the history book versions Then again I am almost 30 so perhaps not the generation you are speaking of.

ignore...

wrong thread...

error

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Action in Lexington Kentucky today (29th).

Originally posted by pajoly
This is the kind of ignorance we are up against as a people. Nothing is factual about this post. No evidence from history can be offered to pretend this is true. The raw, basic, undisputable fact is that modern conservatism is a gross failure. As a nation, we are the poster child of what not to do. Measure wealth creation, job creation, any metric you want -- history PROVES they only go positive with moderate policy. Eisenhower (who by modern standards would be considered a communist since his policy was eons more liberal than Obama's) oversaw a progressive tax rate as his as 90+% for the very ultra top brackets. The lower the tax rate for the rich, the worse is job creation, middle class wealth, national health statistics, educational statistics and even the basic "happiness" indexes.

This poster lays out what is famous as a Right wing tactic -- assert the opposite of reality and call it fact. Here is some fact. The strongest, happiest, healthiest economies and peoples of Europe are those in nations of Scandanavia and Germany. They enjoy free health, free education, no worries that a child's cancer will cause them to lose their home or go bankrupt. because they are not beholden to their employees for insurance, they are free to follow their dream jobs. They enjoy vacations, high savings rates. Hell, germany is carrying the burden for much of Europe and is still healthy, its people happy, free and safe; its economy is healthy. CEOs are not gods in Germany or Sweden/Denmark/Norway. Politicians actually make decisions base on national well-being, not Wellpoint, GM, Exxon or Haliburton's bottom line.

And guess what OP, these are countries people like you call socialists...and you are right, to some degree they are, but they are tons more free than us slaves, their cops don't abuse them, the fellow citizens don't spit on each other like we do here. Yeah, the answer is some rugged ficticious fantasy wild west Republic. Sure thin' massa.

Pajoly...This is EXCELLENTLY spoken. Having been a citizen of two of the countries you compare here, I can say without hesitation that the United States FAILS MISERABLY to realize the truth of there own predicament. The ideals that we were founded on are long forgotten, and have become unattainable...The American Dream is just that...a dream. We are pounded with propaganda like "The Greatest Superpower in the World!!!" which is SADLY true (and hardly something to brag about ), as this government is a violent and extremely well armed one at the cost of it's citizens. "Love It or Leave It! There's another good one; openly accept the myriad shortcomings and hypocrisy, the lies, the cheating, the corruption... "You are either with us or you are against us!"
I spent years in Germany, and alas, had to leave for reasons beyond my control. I have always said to people in conversation that while I lived and worked there I was happier than ever before in my and haven't been since. You can it whatever you want, but the system WORKED in Germany, and the people were happy and much more laid back about life than we are here.

Originally posted by zapr1943
reply to post by pajoly

 

Yep, Europe is definitely a utopia. That's why it's in worse shape than we are financially (even with Obama's blunders). Have you checked the news lately?

If the U.S. didn't shoulder the burden of protecting these countries so they don't have to spend their money on defense, or that American taxpayers didn't bail out their banks and carry the burden of the UN and IMF, they wouldn't have the money to have those great social welfare societies.

Bring our troops home, kick the UN out of New York, and then watch the picture change in Europe really fast. Don't kid yourself, without America this world would crumble, and if things don't soon change here, you'll be seeing that very thing happen shortly.

Oh these countries that were around for hundreds & hundreds of years before the U.S. became the wet dream of our "Forefathers" ??? They are going to CRUMBLE without the U.S. How ego-centric to believe such garbage!!!
A fallen economy does not mean a fallen people...BUT IT WILL IN THE UNITED STATES!!!

Yeah, sure...go on believing this bit of tripe. The one thing the REST OF THE GOD MADE WORLD KNOWS is HARDSHIP & SELF RELIANCE...

And that's the one thing the U.S. has NO EXPERIENCE with AT ALL...and the first cut is the deepest.

Nice thread S&F

It's showtime!

Originally posted by odd1out

Originally posted by pajoly
This is the kind of ignorance we are up against as a people. Nothing is factual about this post. No evidence from history can be offered to pretend this is true. The raw, basic, undisputable fact is that modern conservatism is a gross failure. As a nation, we are the poster child of what not to do. Measure wealth creation, job creation, any metric you want -- history PROVES they only go positive with moderate policy. Eisenhower (who by modern standards would be considered a communist since his policy was eons more liberal than Obama's) oversaw a progressive tax rate as his as 90+% for the very ultra top brackets. The lower the tax rate for the rich, the worse is job creation, middle class wealth, national health statistics, educational statistics and even the basic "happiness" indexes.

This poster lays out what is famous as a Right wing tactic -- assert the opposite of reality and call it fact. Here is some fact. The strongest, happiest, healthiest economies and peoples of Europe are those in nations of Scandanavia and Germany. They enjoy free health, free education, no worries that a child's cancer will cause them to lose their home or go bankrupt. because they are not beholden to their employees for insurance, they are free to follow their dream jobs. They enjoy vacations, high savings rates. Hell, germany is carrying the burden for much of Europe and is still healthy, its people happy, free and safe; its economy is healthy. CEOs are not gods in Germany or Sweden/Denmark/Norway. Politicians actually make decisions base on national well-being, not Wellpoint, GM, Exxon or Haliburton's bottom line.

And guess what OP, these are countries people like you call socialists...and you are right, to some degree they are, but they are tons more free than us slaves, their cops don't abuse them, the fellow citizens don't spit on each other like we do here. Yeah, the answer is some rugged ficticious fantasy wild west Republic. Sure thin' massa.

Pajoly...This is EXCELLENTLY spoken. Having been a citizen of two of the countries you compare here, I can say without hesitation that the United States FAILS MISERABLY to realize the truth of there own predicament. The ideals that we were founded on are long forgotten, and have become unattainable...The American Dream is just that...a dream. We are pounded with propaganda like "The Greatest Superpower in the World!!!" which is SADLY true (and hardly something to brag about ), as this government is a violent and extremely well armed one at the cost of it's citizens. "Love It or Leave It! There's another good one; openly accept the myriad shortcomings and hypocrisy, the lies, the cheating, the corruption... "You are either with us or you are against us!"
I spent years in Germany, and alas, had to leave for reasons beyond my control. I have always said to people in conversation that while I lived and worked there I was happier than ever before in my and haven't been since. You can it whatever you want, but the system WORKED in Germany, and the people were happy and much more laid back about life than we are here.

Germany has an export economy which has greatly benefited from the declining Euro.
The decline in the dollar started to see the same export increases for the U.S. and everyone freaked out and said "they killed the dollar, the end is nigh".
I don't disagree that there is an imbalance in our political and economic life.
But it doesn't end there.

People need to accept the consequences of their own decisions and there are still far too many people in the general "victimized" public who are not doing that. It's easier to blame the ones at the top.

Some people at the top are scum and some are people who worked hard for what they have. Any movement which fails to try to accept that complexity is bound to either fail or bring us a replacement that is worse than the problem it seeks to address.

I say this as one who supports tax increases, reasonable unions, good teachers, bringing jobs home, and state's rights.

reply to post by watcher3339


Being closely attached to a small business owner in the U.S., I have to say that in order to bring jobs home we'd have to put and END to the endless amounts of RED TAPE, which cost hundreds and thousands of dollars PER INCH. These come in the form of every kind of TAX imaginable, health & safety codes, and environmental laws. You can't paint, you can't plate, your bathroom has to meet 30 different codes, your shelves can't be to high, you need this sign and that sign, so many inches for this, so many feet for that, wheelchair ramps, this, that, and the other thing, etc. etc. etc...it's nearly impossible to meet the ALL THESE demands and be lucrative. Hiring someone, an employee, COMES AT GREAT RISK AND COST to the Employer.

If you ask me, it's way to far gone to ever be FIXED...it has be re-created from the ground up.

Originally posted by odd1outBeing closely attached to a small business owner in the U.S., I have to say that in order to bring jobs home we'd have to put and END to the endless amounts of RED TAPE, which cost hundreds and thousands of dollars PER INCH. These come in the form of every kind of TAX imaginable, health & safety codes, and environmental laws. You can't paint, you can't plate, your bathroom has to meet 30 different codes, your shelves can't be to high, you need this sign and that sign, so many inches for this, so many feet for that, wheelchair ramps, this, that, and the other thing, etc. etc. etc...it's nearly impossible to meet the ALL THESE demands and be lucrative. Hiring someone, an employee, COMES AT GREAT RISK AND COST to the Employer.

If you ask me, it's way to far gone to ever be FIXED...it has be re-created from the ground up.

I agree it needs to be started over. However in light of what you were saying above, if countries didn't have to compete with 3rd world countries who can do it cheaper, then there would be no problem.

I think that's a step backwards though - I am a big advocate of a Global Community, NOT Global Government.

reply to post by TheOneElectric


TIME TO FORGIVE ALL DEBT!!! START FRESH!

RESET!

reply to post by TheOneElectric


Excellent post and excellent thread. If I could give you a thousand stars and flags, I would.

It does my heart good to see this happening on a larger scale than it was at first. The people that can do this need to keep it up and keep it spreading. I don't live near a large urban area so it's imprcatical for me to try and do that, but I do have writing skills that I can put to use to help the cause. I can also stream this to various places around the country and around the world to help keep the word and the hope alive that this type of change not only can happen, but it needs to happen. The current system that we have here in the U.S. simply isn't working anymore.

There is something that everyone can do to help and that would be to stop paying federal income tax. If you really want to help make change happen, find a way to take the money that you would pay the feds with and pay the state that you live in instead. Donate it to state funded and sponsored programs if you have to. Donate it to your local school if you can. Keep all the paperwork. You want to leave as much of a paper trail as you possibly can so you can prove to the government that you are paying your fair share of taxes. Just not to them. This would help funnel more money into state programs.

We need to find a way to help get the individual states back to the point that they were, in that they have more control and power to do what they need for their populace, and take that control and power away from the feds. And not giving the feds your income tax money would be a good start. How many people work for the IRS and the US Governmnet combined? Not nearly enough to find and prosecute EVERYONE who does this. If I've said it once I've said it a million times. Our strength is in our numbers. When we grow large enough, there is no way they can stop us. It would be logistically impossible.

As another poster pointed out, individual income is not a profit, and should therefore not even be taxed. Big businesses on the other hand, yes. Take that tax money and re-build our infrastructure. Bring our military home where they belong to protect our borders here. Protecting our borders from an "enemy" on the other side of the world that we helped create anyway is just idiotic at best, and self-destructive at its worst.

If you must vote, vote for someone like Ron Paul. If you hear someone, whether he or she is a candidate or not, and that person says things that smack of common sense and practicalty, vote for them. I think we all know at this point that if the Democratic or Republican party themselves choose someone for us, that someone will be absolutely worthless to We The People. WE need to choose our next leader. Not the people in Washington who have been coporate whores for as long as anyone can remember.

WE need to take our country back. We need to try it peacefully too. But if the video I saw in another thread here of some fat cats sitting on a balcony sipping champaigne and laughing at the protesters are any indication, peaceful protests may not last that long. If you think a civil war sounds too radical to stomach, think of the alternative. Think of business as usual for the next 10 years. I have a 12 year old daughter and the alternative of "business as usual" just doesn't cut it for me. It shouldn't be good enough for ANY parent IMO.