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posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 02:38 PM
This thread is intended to perhaps discuss terms and ideaology regarding Black Ops...

How much do we know about dreams? How much do we as a collective know about the inner workings of the human mind? How often do we confuse opinion/bias for prediction?

Do we also think that the U.S. Government, among others, is not trying to figure out how to influence people without their knowing it?

I think we should consider this point....especially in light of the fact that there is a huge debt and discrepancy in our class system.

Kucinch anyone?

Last year, in October, the congresman Denis J. Kucinich introduced in the American Congress a bill, obliging the American president to get engaged in the negotiations aimed at the ban of space based weapons. In this bill the definition of a weapon system includes: any other unacknowledged or as yet undeveloped means inflicting death or injury on, or damaging or destroying, a person (or the biological life, bodily health, mental health, or physical and economic well-being of a person) through the use of land-based, sea-based, or space-based systems using radiation, electromagnetic, psychotronic, sonic, laser, or other energies directed at individual persons or targeted populationsor the purpose of information war, mood management, or mind control of such persons or populations" (12). As in all legislative acts quoted in this article the bill counts with sound, light or electromagnetic stimulation of human brain. Psychotronic weapons remain, at least for a layman uninformed of secret military research, in the sphere of science fiction, since so far none of the published scientific experiments was presented in the way which would allow for its replication.


A major politician is focusing on something that is not even discussed in real day to day life...

What do you think ATS? Real or not?
edit on Sat, 27 Aug 2011 14:39:52 -0500 by MemoryShock because: To Add URL...

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 02:49 PM

In May 1999 the neuroscientists conference, sponsored by the UN, took place in Tokyo. In the declaration we read: "Today we have intellectual, physical andinancial resources to master the power of the brain itself, and to develop devices to touch the mind and even control or erase consciousnessWe wish to profess our hope that such pursuit of knowledge serves peace and welfare" (14).The events at the international political scene, in the last few years, confirm that the concept of remote control of human brain is a matter of negotiations. In January 1999 the European Parliament passed a resolution where it calls for an international convention introducing a global ban on all developments and deployments of weapons which might enable any form of manipulation of human beings." (15) Already in 1997 nine states of the Union of Independent States addressed OUN, OBSE and the states of the Interparliamentary Union with the proposal to place at the agenda of the General Assembly of the Organization of United Nations the preparation and conclusion of an international convention On Prevention of Informational Wars and Limitation of Circulation of Informational Weapons" (17), (3). The initiative was originaly proposed, in the Russian State Duma, by Vladimir Lopatin (1). V. Lopatin worked,rom 1990 to 1995, in sequence, in the Committees on Security of the Russian Federation, Russian State Duma and Interparliamentary Assembly of the Commonwealth of Independent States, specializing in informational security (3).

From the link above...

Check my sources...Mind Influence is a very common thing from direct interaction to indirect...physically changing the brain waves of an individual can be done either through emotive tactics or electronic stimulation...either way, it is manipulation...and needs to be addressed by the my opinion...

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 03:00 PM
gave you a flag and star for starting this interesting topic...

I don't know enough about American politicians to comment on their credibility, but as an ordinary person, hearing this out of the mouths of politicians and neuroscientists, to me it's scary. It still sounds to much sci-fy, but if this technology doesn't exist already then it will only be a matter of time before it does.

thread bookmarked,
and curious to see what others have to add to this topic

edit on 27/8/2011 by GypsK because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 03:03 PM

Originally posted by GypsK
I don't know enough about American politicians to comment on their credibility, but as an ordinary person, hearing this out of the mouths of politicians and neuroscientists, to me it's scary. It still sounds to much sci-fy, but if this technology doesn't exist already then it will only be a matter of time before it does.

It's not just American politicians...and it is certainly SciFi-ish...but this is something that was conceived of in the 1920's if patent dates can be believed...

Really, we are talking about the capacity to control the mood of an that is where opinion is bourne of...

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 03:19 PM

A Defense Intelligence Agency review of Communist literature affirmed microwave sound and
indicated voice transmission. The report states, "Sounds and possibly even words which
appear to be originating intracranially (within the head) can be induced by signal modulation
at very low average power densities."[24] Among microwave weapon implications are "great
potential for development into a system for disorientating or disrupting the behavior patterns
of military or diplomatic personnel." An Army Mobility Equipment Research and Development
Command report affirms microwave speech transmission with applications of "camouflage,
decoy, and deception operations."[25] "One decoy and deception concept presently being
considered is to remotely create noise in the heads of personnel by exposing them to low
power, pulsed microwaves . . . By proper choice of pulse characteristics, intelligible speech
may be created" quotes the report.

I am having difficulty commenting more without others' opinions...hint hint...

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 03:20 PM
I didn't read through your link yet before I replied... but wow, I really had no idea how much of this already became reality!

I found the EU report on Crowd control technologies interesting:
from your link

The report states that the most controversial non-lethal' crowd control technology proposed by the U.S., are so called Radio Frequency or Directed Energy Weapons that can allegedly manipulate human behavior the greatest concern is with systems which can directly interact with the human nervous system" (25). The report also states that perhaps the most powerful developments remain shrouded in secrecy"

I wonder how many of it has already been put to use in warfare... it's a fail proof way for any gov or org to make someone who is a threath loose all creadability.

everyone should read that link
edit on 27/8/2011 by GypsK because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 03:27 PM
flagged and starred for an interesting topic, i've always been interested in this subject and always knew that it was around but not mainstream. i remember hearing about the Nazis doing alot of research on this sort of thing back before and during ww2?

an interesting link
edit on 27-8-2011 by rayuki because: (no reason given)

could the "Low Rumbling" that have been heard around the world lately that have been associated with ELF be apart of some bigger experiment on this?
edit on 27-8-2011 by rayuki because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 03:43 PM

Originally posted by rayuki
could the "Low Rumbling" that have been heard around the world lately that have been associated with ELF be apart of some bigger experiment on this?

An interesting thought but something that can't be me...I have looked hard on HAARP and other sources...something like that can't be verified via the internet....but my personal opinion would think that there is something to it...nothing definitive, mind you, as personality will effect how one reacts but there is a possibility that reactions can be induced...
edit on Sat, 27 Aug 2011 15:44:07 -0500 by MemoryShock because: Coding

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 03:46 PM
reply to post by MemoryShock

yeah agreed it was just something i clicked with when i was reading the report and saw the link to ELF being used, and remembered about hearing the stories going around about the low noise rumblings going on and people associating it with ELF.

im sure theres alot more to it then any of us know, and just the fact people are banning the use of any such weapons already available and available in the future is worrying.

if a group of people have been working on things like this for 50+ years then theres no telling what they have available to use.
edit on 27-8-2011 by rayuki because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 04:24 PM
The U.S. government has known since at least the early 1900's how to influence people. It's called marketing and advertising. It involves in-depth psychology.

One of the more infamous cases of global psychological manipulation has been the myth perpetrated by De Beers that diamonds are rare. Diamonds don't even make the top 20 of rare stones. In 1938, De Beers contracted N.W.Ayers of New York, a leading advertising firm of the time, to reverse the world-wide price decline of diamonds because of the glut. Look at history to see how successful that was.

Go visit a major advertising/marketing firm and note the bank-vault like doors that look like they're bomb proof that provide admittance to the inner sanctum.

As with all things, I'm sure the military applications became a hot topic item long ago. After the slight uproar over subliminal messaging, seems like everything went underground.

Your OP is excellent in bringing this to the fore. I don't think the U.S. government is trying to figure out how to influence people - I think it's a done deal and they're on.

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 06:55 PM
Definitely something scary to think about. We're influenced whether we know it or not but aye, mind control is a touchy subject. Sometimes I get the suspicion that when there's a ringing in my ears, a very high pitched one, that someones trying to mind control me. Nice thread. Still too new to figure out how to flag it though...

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 09:20 PM
I've been interested in this area for years, have read many accounts, seen patents for devices that fall into this category. I used to save those things but it all got so creepy and discouraging. Nick Begich has written a couple of books with much documentation about "non-letal weapons" as they are called. People tell of experiences where a voice in their head says things to them. I have certainly seen patents for these devices. Don't we all have little voices, our own, in our heads? I've always thought that I might recognize mind control type voice because it might stay on one topic, where my thoughts jump around. I have never felt that a voice was coming from outside but I have certainly at times felt very low for no reason at all. Sometimes, especially on a beautiful summer day, a very oppressive feeling comes along. Weather pressure? maybe. sometimes many people mention finding it difficult to sleep. coincidence? don't know, but these kind of vibes, waveforms, would be extremely easy to broadcast. Haarp is entirely capable of it. How finely can haarp target? There are certainly other antenna arrays like haarp capable of doing the same things. There are a great many satellites orbiting that it seems would be able to broadcast waves that would affect our thoughts and feelings. David Icke believes the moon has stuff going on and thoughtforms are being projected that create the "matrix" we live in. I must admit that lately when I think about gulf oil spill, and how there is no longer talk about the damage done, the fukishima earthquake, with no discussion of how the vast amount of radiation is spreading around the earth, the large number of members of congress who appear to be doing things to top off their bank accounts using their special priveleges and yet nothing is said or done not to mention the strange sexual shenanigans many seem to be involved in, well it feels like we really are living in a pretend world where there are laws to be followed and values to be respected, and plans to be made for the future, when underneath that countries and individuals are enslaved with debt, a few people hold all the power, and we pretend all is normal. are we all just blind fools or is there more going on that make us incapable of seeing what's going on? in summary: yeah, I believe mind control is happening on many levels.

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 10:12 PM

Originally posted by luxordelphi
The U.S. government has known since at least the early 1900's how to influence people. It's called marketing and advertising. It involves in-depth psychology.

100% agree with that.

The essence of control for today and for the future is in raking in the money while preventing most of the population from realizing how influenced they are by the things they love so much, due to marketing. This is a fascinating subject because while under the influence of today's marketing, most people like the ads. The ads are designed to capture attention, and they exceed at that. They are better at or at least as good as Hollywood because they must craft an experience using newspapers, magazines, billboards, pictures, animation, videos, smells, and even actual people.

Smells? Yes. It is no wonder that if you pass by Burger King, you can smell the greasy MSG-soaked patties being "flame broiled." Look at the top of BK during rush times, and eventually you'll see the greasy cloud of smoke pouring out the top of the building.

Actual people? Yes. Every shirt you see that has a logo on it, is a form of advertising. The bigger the better. How many grade school kids vie to wear expensive clothes? Highschoolers are the same. College kids too, though maybe a bit less.

So, even if you don't see the ads of beautiful people paid to wear the clothes, you are surrounded by people who have, or by people whose parents do. Try going shopping without seeing banners and signs everywhere urging you to be like the beautiful person in the picture. Impossible. And, so this has penetrated our cultures to such an extent that we can easily become desensitized to the impact it has on us. And, so they just come up with new techniques to get our attention. They change the products in superficial ways. Look down the toothpaste aisle. 30 or so choices, despite that the active ingredient is the same. But, not really, because the feeling attached to the product ("This one is better for me.") does count. If the person believes it works better, they feel better (confident). But, the downside is that they have been tricked by a gimmick called a flashy box, words like "Professional", or an advertisement they saw a total of 10 or more times without realizing it.

It extends in more subtle ways, too. If you go to school, you're asked to wear a certain shirt (or color) on a certain day. That's a form of advertising most likely, if you decided to buy a shirt. They "give them away" at many orientation programs at college. (You paid for it at registration.) It creates a group dynamic too. You start to act like everyone else who's wearing that color at school, which is pretty scary considering most college campuses are full of people who do not represent the idealism of values we should admire, to say the least. Anyway, the school gets free advertising when it pushes students to buy official school merchandise. They also reap profits on these overpriced goods. On top of this, tuition prices continue to rise, but we're still stupider in America than ever before.

Why do people have so much trouble focusing? Could it be the flashy ads that bombard us? They certainly add to the problem, pushing us this way and that. Movies, music, the internet (YES, HERE too!), and television are all activities that require virtually no concentration or analytical skill. No wonder with all that we do of these things, when it comes time to use these skills, we have trouble. You don't use it. You lose it. We are at the mercy of our desires for these forms of entertainment and paying the price for overindulging in them.

Who needs covert ways to control people when the overt ones are proven to work? I appreciate the study into this area, but the most of the US is certainly not about to start thinking for themselves. Most people's ideas are simply the ideas of other people. Original thought is a thing of the past except for a very few of us.

It's been said that business is practically a religion itself. This is true, if you think about the mindset required to do well in business. It relies on taking more from someone else than you give them. Buying cheap and selling high, including wages to employees. As the business grows richer, those who dealt with it grow poorer. A corporate pig that only intends to grow over time, never die, and squash the little guy as often as necessary.

The future is sadly going to be run by businesses even more than it already is. I am not a big 'nwo' person, but big businesses are already controlling many areas, and there's nothing that will stop them, save a natural disaster or nuclear holocaust.

I could elaborate on this and rant for hours. Think it's pretty clear to most of us, though, with or without anything I've had to say here.

Apart from advertising of goods, we all advertise things without realizing it. What does your avatar say about you? What feelings does it carry with it? Does it make others feel excited? Scared? Laugh? What about the messages you type here? How effect do those have on others (and you)? It all matters. It affects you and everyone who comes across them. If you aren't knowledgeably and deliberately trying to come across as a certain way, you could be neglecting to take good care of yourself and you could be spreading things that are hurtful to others.

Just wanted to end on a bit of a philosophical note...

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 10:34 PM
Reminds me of this very curious story from 2008 that seems to have faded into the woodwork:

Tuesday, September 9, 2008

Pulitzer Prize-winning journalist Bob Woodward revealed to Larry King last night that the U.S. has embarked on a "secret killing program" in Iraq which has dramatically reduced attacks on coalition troops by wiping out terrorists, but what could this secret weapon possibly be?

A CNN report details Woodward’s revelations.

The program — which Woodward compares to the World War II era Manhattan Project that developed the atomic bomb — must remain secret for now or it would "get people killed," Woodward said Monday on CNN’s Larry King Live.

"The top secret operations will "some day in history … be described to people’s amazement," Woodward told King.

While he would not reveal the details, Woodward said the terrorists who have been targeted were already aware of the capabilities.

"The enemy has a heads up because they’ve been getting wiped out and a lot of them have been killed," he said. "It’s not news to them."

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 10:44 PM
reply to post by MemoryShock

correct me if i am wrong but didn't Nikola Tesla do research into such things as this?
Interesting topic though.

posted on Aug, 27 2011 @ 11:21 PM
reply to post by daynight42

In 1997, in Japan, 618 children experienced epileptic type seizures after viewing an episode of Pokemon, a popular cartoon show for kids. It was later called photosensitive epilepsy because it was apparently brought on by a particular sequence and duration of flashing lights peculiar to one of the characters in the show.

IMHO, advertising long ago left the benign non-invasive realm and reached out to their customers in experiments, even on children, as described in the Pokemon incident.

I believe that every person, children included, from every country has a right to liberty and that what the corporate-military complex practices is enslavement.

posted on Aug, 28 2011 @ 05:33 AM
reply to post by luxordelphi

In 1997, in Japan, 618 children experienced epileptic type seizures after viewing an episode of Pokemon, a popular cartoon show for kids.


posted on Aug, 28 2011 @ 11:04 AM

Originally posted by gazzachel
reply to post by MemoryShock

correct me if i am wrong but didn't Nikola Tesla do research into such things as this?
Interesting topic though.

I haven't heard of anything in this regard from Tesla but there is no reason to doubt that much of what Tesla did couldn't have been applied in some fashion for these reasons...but as far as direct correlations, I have seen/heard of none...

I also have heard of the Pokemon dealio...interesting but that is something more along the lines of advertising techniques and frame rates applied for commercial reasons, in my opinion...think raves and house music but applied to the hurried culture of Japan...still relevant though, in some fashion...

posted on Aug, 28 2011 @ 08:32 PM
Seems there is no doubt that marketing and merchandising is designed to influence our behavior. The images used, music, shapes, and I remember listening to a merchandiser talk about how different colors attract us when are in different emotional states and this is used to get people to buy more. Maybe we should call this indirect mind control because it attempts to influence our behavior. Direct mind control then be the variety that speaks directly to individuals, causing them to say or do things believing they themselves made the decision to follow that impulse. Not entirely clear cut difference. I'll try to find some examples of direct mind control.

posted on Sep, 28 2011 @ 09:58 AM
reply to post by MemoryShock

This thread is right on in many ways.

The military did a study to decide why they did not "win" vietnam. The decided it was because they did not have total control over what U.S. citizens believed. So they decided to take total control of the propaganda, i mean news that we receive. They defined it not as lies because they would make it truth, thus get around the laws requiring it not be used on U.S. citizens. This is the official army document presented:

MindWar must reach out to friends, enemies, and neutrals alike across the globe - neither through primitive “battlefield” leaflets and loudspeakers of PSYOP nor through the weak, imprecise, and narrow effort of psychotronics11 - but through the media possessed by the United States which have the capabilities to reach virtually all people on the face of the Earth.
These media are, of course, the electronic media - television and radio.
Under existing United States law, PSYOP units may not target American citizens.12 That prohibition is based upon the presumption that “propaganda” is necessarily a lie or at least a misleading half-truth, and that the government has no right to lie to the people. The Propaganda Ministry of Goebbels must not be a part of the American way of life.
Quite right, and so it must be axiomatic of MindWar that it always speaks the truth. Its power lies in its ability to focus recipients’ attention on the truth of the future as well as that of the present. MindWar thus involves the stated promise of the truth that the United States has resolved to make real if it is not already so.
Unlike PSYOP, MindWar has nothing to do with deception or even with “selected” - and therefore misleading - truth. Rather it states a whole truth that, if it does not now exist, will be forced into existence by the will of the United States.

Source: From PSYOP to MindWar: The Psychology of Victory.
Article with some of the history.
Here they are during Kosovo war.
source 2

So since this documents publication, it has been official policy to control our news, and they have been caught at it many times over. This is just the military, not to mention Operation Mockingbird.

Starting in the early days of the Cold War (late 40's), the CIA began a secret project called Operation Mockingbird, with the intent of buying influence behind the scenes at major media outlets and putting reporters on the CIA payroll, which has proven to be a stunning ongoing success. The CIA effort to recruit American news organizations and journalists to become spies and disseminators of propaganda, was headed up by Frank Wisner, Allen Dulles, Richard Helms, and Philip Graham (publisher of The Washington Post). Wisner had taken Graham under his wing to direct the program code-named Operation Mockingbird and both have presumably committed suicide.

Media assets will eventually include ABC, NBC, CBS, Time, Newsweek, Associated Press, United Press International (UPI), Reuters, Hearst Newspapers, Scripps-Howard, Copley News Service, etc. and 400 journalists, who have secretly carried out assignments according to documents on file at CIA headquarters, from intelligence-gathering to serving as go-betweens. The CIA had infiltrated the nation's businesses, media, and universities with tens of thousands of on-call operatives by the 1950's.


But back to the original premise of this thread psychotronics:

LTC John Alexander’s Military Review article in support of “psychotronics” -
intelligence and operational employment of ESP - was decidedly provocative.
“Psychotronics” was a term applied to concepts such as ESP and “remote viewing” by some government agencies in the 1970s-80s, possibly to make them sound more “scientific”.

And even in 1980 they new that a HAARP like device could be used alone or in conjuction to create mind control:

There are some purely natural conditions under which minds may become more or less receptive to ideas, and MindWar should take full advantage of such phenomena as atmospheric electromagnetic activity19 , air ionization20, and extremely low frequency waves21
ELF-waves are not normally noticed by the unaided senses, yet their resonant effect upon the human body has been connected to both physiological disorders and emotional distortion.

And that is just the TIP of the iceberg, so to speak.

Welcome to the rabbit hole, Alice...

Red or blue pill?

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