the removal of civil rights in the workplace

Today I was handed another slip of paper removing yet another civil right that has been deemed unalienable by the founders. It seems that our rights are being terminated from all sides.

It is no longer allowable to express your religion in the workplace, as others might find it objectionable. This is a clear violation of our first amendment rights.

Your employer can it appears search your personal property that is on company property, ie lockers, cars, tool boxes etc. This is a clear violation of our fourth amendment rights.

Legally owned weapons are now prohibited on company property, including those stored in private property. This is a clear violation of our second amendment rights.

When are he people going to stand up to he corporations, and the insurance companies that issue these rules and deny he people their constitutionally protected rights?

I will no be long before the though police will be standing at he gate of our employers telling us what o think and how o apply it. he unions in fact have already done so.

Are there others out there that are aware and concerned about these things?

respectfully

reluctantpawn

Tell me about it. I work for an evil corporation. I could write a book on their injustices to their workforce.

There is a simple solution to this. Quit working for them. Life may be harder, but at least you wont be a slave to the beast.

reply to post by reluctantpawn

Today I was handed another slip of paper removing yet another civil right that has been deemed unalienable by the founders. It seems that our rights are being terminated from all sides.

It is no longer allowable to express your religion in the workplace, as others might find it objectionable. This is a clear violation of our first amendment rights.

Hi, reluctantpawn. I have a question. Did everybody recieve this slip of paper, or was it only you? Did someone complain about prostlytization? Does this deal with customers or just in house employees?

Legally owned weapons are now prohibited on company property, including those stored in private property. This is a clear violation of our second amendment rights

I, personally, am uncomfortable around guns. If I owned a business, I wouldn't want my employees carrying guns while representing my products. I wouldn't want them in their cars, if their cars were parked on my property, either. Don't I have that right? Just saying.

Sounds like it is time to move to a friendlier state or find a new job.

reply to post by reluctantpawn


Very aware and very concerned but unable to change it. I refuse to work for a corporation(they won't have me anyway so it's not a big deal) because one has to sell their soul to make a buck and I have no need for all the headaches of trying to act like a person I am not, try and conform to all their ridiculous rules. Frak that and frak tham.

Noam Chomsky said something to the effect that the corporation is the most tyrannical thing man has ever devised. Pretty spot on if one asked me. Say welcome to the Fascist States of Amerika. The freaking corporation has more rights than I do, a supposed American citizen, how sad is that?

I have zero problems with such a move by an employer, in fact I wish mine would get on board with this because it gets old hearing people go on and on in religious or even political debates. Works is a place to do things not sit around flapping the gums about religion or scurrying off to pray or worship or whatever else you call it.

Very good topic. I dealt with full time cctv ( that any manager could log into anytime of the day or night). in plants. Its an eery feeling when you put a wrench down look up and the cctv camera stops panning and points directly at you. at 2 A.M.

I Left there; couldn't take the fence/guard shack 24/7 cameras ( for "safety purposes" only).

we can throw in "drug testing";
"non-smoking"

Once they start it gets ever more intrusive.

When do they get to:
POLICY: "We require every employee to eat a fiber rich diet and have bowel movement before leaving their home to cut down on productive time and company supplies wasted in the company restrooms."(?)

By extrapolation its the same principle.

Oh well in the big picture your not really that important anyway

reply to post by reluctantpawn


Man, I don't see too much of a problem with any of those rules.

Religion and politics should stay out of the workplace. It divides people up when. When you are at work you are part of a team that needs to work seamlessly for a common goal. I refuse to talk about religion or politics at work. If someone brings them up I change the subject. If they keep pushing, I flat out tell them I won't talk about it at work. Now over a beer after, sure. But in the work place there is no need. We are there to work, not fool around.

As for weapons, they should stay out too. There really is no need to have a weapon on you. Most I'd allow is a regular pocket knife. A gun is not needed. Now in your car...I see both sides there. Sure you should be allowed to keep it there, but what happens when someone with a gun in their car snaps, goes out and comes in and shoots the place up. It has happened before and it will continue to happen.

Looking in your lockers? It's on their property. It's their locker. They have a right to know if you have something illegal in them. But if you don't keep anything there you won't have too much to worry about. If your stuff gets searched and they find nothing you have a pretty good harassment case against them. That has happened before and it will happen again.

When you agree to work for a company you agree to follow their rules. You don't like the rules you can leave. If your belief is as strong as you are portraying you should take a stand and leave. Sue them for violating your rights even but you will lose that because just implicating rules is not a violating of your rights.

Originally posted by thenewguy1987

As for weapons, they should stay out too. There really is no need to have a weapon on you. Most I'd allow is a regular pocket knife. A gun is not needed. Now in your car...I see both sides there. Sure you should be allowed to keep it there, but what happens when someone with a gun in their car snaps, goes out and comes in and shoots the place up. It has happened before and it will continue to happen.

The answer to your question about weapons in the workplace is sooooo simple. If people were trained and had concealed carry permits, the mass shootings you worry about wouldn't happen. Someone would end it before it really got started.

reply to post by Firefly_


Sure I could quit. But then what? These policies are becoming ore and more mainstream. Running from the problem only makes it bigger.

reply to post by windword


No, the first amendment issue encompasses any display of religious faith. As to the weapon [not firearm specifically] ALL shootings in the workplace have been in weapon free zones from the Standard Gravure shooting to Columbine. One man with a legal firearm and ccw could have stopped them

A company has the right to dictate policy to it's employees, as long as they are in accordance with the law. The ones you mentioned do not violate the law. In fact they seem quite reasonable to me.

Religious express = 1st Amendment. Tell your boss to shove a carrot up his butt and see if the 1st will save your job.

Searches = 4th Amend. Not on private property they don't.

Weapons = 2nd Amend. Again, not on private property.

reply to post by thenewguy1987


You really want to see how much your human rights are stomped on?
Get hurt on the job, then deal with compo. They kill people and destroy families, but are protected from prosecution because they made a deal with the government. Not just here in B.C. but everywhere.
I don’t care if they watch me work search my locker, and if they want to call a cop they can search my car.
Get hurt, then you can find the abuse. Compo gets to mentally rape you over and over again, and all you can do is take it and smile. I’m smiling now.

The rights outlined in the Constitution are basically a contract between the Federal Government and the citizens. This contract outlines the way the government can approach a citizen.

These rights do not extend to private property (i.e. your employer's place of business) and therefor your whole premise is invalid. The employer has every right to attach any stipulations/conditions to your employment with them (outside of sexual harassment and robbing you of your life). If you do not like the stipulations your employer has as a part of being employed there you are free to leave your position and find another.

It would seem as though you expect your employer to forgo their rights of private property in order to satisfy you. How would you feel if someone wanted to bring a gun into your home (private property) and told you that you couldn't stop them because its their 2nd amendment right to bear arms? If you didn't want the gun there your right of property would allow you to deny them entry, that is to say unless the constitution extends to private property in which case they could bring the gun into your home whether you like it or not.

reply to post by reluctantpawn


It is totally within their rights to enforce these types of restrictions. We do (supposedly) have the right of free association and should they wish to eliminate guns and free expression of religion from their work place I have no problem with them doing that. I would encourage them to do that.

Free expression is limited in most workplaces. You may have the right to complain about the company or talk openly about how their services or products suck, but the employer does not have to put up with that and should not have to. they have the right to limit your free speach. Same with talking openly about management or clients.

Free expression goes both ways. You want to have free expression of display of religion in the work place? Fine, then you obviously don't have a problem with cartoons of Jesus or a crucifix in a jar of urine either. It has to go both ways.

Like it or not, both fall under the category of what amounts in employment law as a hostile workplace. Display of religous items can create an atmosphere where folks feel uncomfortable. Everyone displaying Christian icons in their cubes/offices could reasonably make a Jew feel that he is on the outside and is not going to be treated fairly. Now that may not be the case, but should the Jewish person not receive a promotion, he can sue and he will win.

As far as the weapons, they have no place in a work place, period. The employer can not guarantee that they are properly secured and face it, we have all worked with unstable people. I doubt that you are one nor do I think it likely that you would improperly secure a weapon, but believe me, I have worked with and have managed people that you would in no way want to have a weapon in the workplace.

It boils down to allowing some folks to have them and others not to. Get rid of the person who is a bit unstable? Easier to say than to do should the person reach out to a doctor and lawyer and claim that he suffers from some disorder which the courts will treat as a disability that requires reasonable accomodation. You can't fire someone because they are bipolar for example or has an anger management issue. They may be able to contain their disorder with medication, but do you really want to have someone in the workplace with an anger issue to have a weapon?

If you don't like it, get a different job.

reply to post by Paul47


What you are talking about really is not the situation here. Sorry you have a problem/have dealt with that. I really don't think that is part of civil rights either. We expect our job to take care of us if we get hurt there, but we should also have our own backup. We need to stop depending on others and man up and take care of ourselves. It's not easy but we cannot depend on each other all the time.

reply to post by centurion1211

that line of thinking doesn't really work for me. I know about 20 people personally who have a concealed weapon licence, and one I am forced into being around a lot who ALWAYS carries her fire arm. I would only trust one or two of them to have a level head in a stressful situation. A guy who snaps with a gun is bad, but a guy who is trying to play hero who doesn't know how to is just as bad.

Now let me be clear on this:I am ALL for being able to carry. Most of me thinks it's dumb to have to have a licence, but understand why. I just think that on private property it is up to the owners to decide what goes on.

I had a party at my apartment a few years ago and some yahoo came with a friend and he was carrying a piece in his waist band. I told him to go put it up. He wasn't going to have a gun in my house when I don't know him and everyone is getting drunk, let alone someone who wasn't being responsible about it. He and my friend that brought him got pissed and left. I have the right to control what goes on in my home, a company has the right to control what goes on in theirs.

reply to post by thenewguy1987


I agree with most of what you had to say with exception to the gun in the car argument. I feel it's a relatively weak argument as if someone snapped they could just as easily drive home, grab their gun and drive back. Most corporations live near metropolitan centers so a 20 minute ride is something most can do on lunch. A gun locked in the car by legally operating citizens could actually save the lives of those who are unarmed. As far as I'm concerned my car is my private property and cannot be searched without a warrant regardless of where its parked unless there is a sign stating so at the gate "all vehicles are subject to search".

If I have a gun in my private property such as a car as long as I'm following the storage laws I see no problem with it being there. I really feel that a nationwide open carry for non criminal folk (who has gone through a rigorous safety course) should be common place and it would probably cut down on the stupid crimes if the criminal knows that victims have the means and right to defend themselves in any way necessary. We'd also have less criminals because a lot of them would be dead.

reply to post by thenewguy1987


Man up? Let’s see now, had ten grand saved in case of emergency, gone, truck, gone, car gone. (Sold to pay mortgage)
We were talking human rights right? Your employer has the right to watch you search you and question you. People don’t like it but in reality it doesn’t go against human rights because your employer has rights too.
I’m not here to bitch but insults; you can keep them to yourself. Try being seriously injured at work then fighting for medical help and tests. 4 years now good thing my wife can work of my kids would starve.
Sorry but sounds like you work for compo.