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Hikers Deemed Suspicious For Taking Photos; Arrested For Refusing To Provide ID

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posted on Aug, 8 2011 @ 11:37 PM
You may remember that woman who was filming cops from her front yard and ended up being arrested for "obstruction of government administration" or something. Well now they are using that same "law" to arrest people who refuse to show ID to police in a state where you're not required to do so in the first place. Not to mention that photography is not a crime.

Source has youtube vids so you can see these heroes in action.
Source: PINAC

posted on Aug, 8 2011 @ 11:43 PM
reply to post by PsykoOps

Interesting to me how many people on religious grounds seem to feel that laws do not apply to them...and interesting the response from the LEO...what was their crime? It is obvious: arrest you, cause innumerable problems that goes with a charge, and then let you go.


posted on Aug, 8 2011 @ 11:54 PM
reply to post by PsykoOps

Aside from the interaction with the officers,
why did they take offense when they traveled to the town and observed the way of life

They knew something wasn’t kosher when they came across a ““Welcome to Kiryas Joel”
sign suggesting that they cover their legs, arms and necklines and maintain “gender separation
in all public areas.”

I certainly would not want to live that way, the way of Kiryas Joel,
however I am not going to travel there, call them out while filiming it.

Kind of strange if you ask me.

posted on Aug, 8 2011 @ 11:57 PM
reply to post by burntheships

Isn't this the USA? Can't you travel freely and document it? What is the difference in going to this town and any other? Do they have different laws?


posted on Aug, 8 2011 @ 11:58 PM
after reading that link, I wonder if this has anything to do with the uptick in jewish spy cells in america?

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 12:02 AM
When is someone going to sue for unlawful imprisonment and win a huge settlement? This is the only way that a crackdown on cops abusing their power is going to come to an end.

Its a shame to see the US resort to the actions of the Nazi's. My fear is, it just gets worse and more widespread.

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 12:10 AM
This is not a normal place, and has courted much controversy, but I am somewhat surprised that the state trooper's participated in fostering the ideals of this town. I think they felt the pressure from TPTB in this weird little town.

There are no theocracies in America, right? After all, we have constitutionally mandated separation of religion and government. Perhaps not. A village in New York called Kiryas Joel appears to be going right up to the line – and perhaps lurching over it.

An interesting case just filed in federal court will test the ability of a religious group to actually run an entire town. Kiryas Joel is an enclave of ultra-orthodox Jews who belong to the Satmar Hasidic sect.

Members of this group believe in separating themselves from others – they’d rather not be around non-sect members.

Thirty-four years ago, they won the right to create their own village from the surrounding community of Monroe. The village’s founders might have envisioned an idyllic community where people of a shared faith lived in harmony.

“The case alleges discrimination against dissidents…in various facets of public life, from tax exemptions for synagogues to election improprieties to selective enforcement of village noise ordinances.

Among the most serious allegations is that Kiryas Joel’s Public Safety Department, a quasi-police agency, has acted as enforcers for the main congregation and tolerated acts of violence and intimidation against dissidents by unruly crowds of young supporters of Satmar Grand Rebbe Aron Teitelbaum, the leader of Kiryas Joel’s majority faction.”

The Satmar group may not be large, but its members are politically savvy. In 1989, they successfully lobbied the New York legislature for their own “public” school system. The Satmars didn’t want their children to be educated alongside non-Satmars.

A sign at the village entrance admonishes visitors to dress modestly. Cleavage-revealing tops for women are verboten, and both sexes are told to cover arms and legs. Couples are advised to “maintain gender separation in public places.”

The sign was erected by the town’s largest synagogue. Its wording is tough, but in fact the village can’t legally enforce rules like this. Still, women who dare to visit the community while wearing skimpy summer outfits have reported scowls and glares. (Imagine the reaction from the Religious Right if this were a town of fundamentalist Muslims and they erected a sign reading, “Women are welcome to visit if accompanied by a male relative. Please respect our values by wearing a burqa.”)

How did a little community gain such influence? The New York Times explained earlier this year that while Kiryas Joel is a poor community, it has discovered the secret of getting a lot of attention from politicians: “Because the community typically votes as a bloc, it wields disproportionate political influence, which enables it to meet those challenges creatively.”
edit on 9-8-2011 by Maluhia because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 12:14 AM

Originally posted by ColoradoJens
reply to post by burntheships

Isn't this the USA? Can't you travel freely and document it?


Yes, and of course you can, and they did. But...what was the point of it all.

Seems they found an odd place, an odd way of living and became obsessed with it.

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 12:16 AM
reply to post by burntheships

And? Being odd is against the law? I'm not sure I understand your point?


posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 12:20 AM
Obstructing Government Administration only involves force, violence or interference. They did none of that, hence they can't be charged or arrested for that.

I would sue the pants off of New York State Police and that "Moses" guy.

posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 01:08 AM
reply to post by isthisreallife

Agreed. And sucky as many see it, sometimes it takes a dick to make a point. The point is still the same though whether they were jerks about it or not.


posted on Aug, 9 2011 @ 09:53 AM
reply to post by isthisreallife

That's true. Thing is that this is the apparently the new trendy "arrest anyone" charge. Like "resisting without violence" etc. In the end it is used in a manner that if you dont do what the cop says wheter or not he has any right to say it you get arrested.
Also now that I'm back from work this is the embedded video:

posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 08:26 AM
This is insane.

The State Trooper said the guy is a "peace officer" doing an investigation. Investigating what? Walking down the street? Eating lunch? How are they supposed to know he was a "peace officer"? He has no uniform.

Do we want to be a country that requires citizens to produce I.D. on demand when no reasonable cause exists?

This should raise all kind of red flags for every citizen.

Additionally, religion should have no place in the administration of ANY city in the U.S., whether it's Sunday Blue Laws, Sharia Law, FLDS towns in the Southwest or modesty ordinances in Kiryas Joel. It's unconstitutional, period.

posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 08:53 AM

Originally posted by PsykoOps
Source has youtube vids so you can see these heroes in action.


From the source:

“We don’t know who you are or why you’re out here taking pictures,” a New York State police officer says at one point in the above video.

So the State Troopers asked for ID, and they refused to supply it. Now, what would be the harm showing some ID? I mean, besides killing any chance they'd have at a story of how the cops are meanies?

posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 10:57 AM
reply to post by ColoradoJens

Ok, this story was gnawing at the back of my mind...I knew there was something familiar
about this place and there is most likely a deep kind of conpsiracy here.

Which is likely why these guys were targeted for taking photos.

Not that I agree they should have been targeted, because I dont
think they should have been harrassed at all.

I had to go looking as I remembered this town being discussed here before.

Several months ago ATS member Modern Acadamia posted this thread:

A Village With the Numbers, Not the Image, of the Poorest Place

Well what is strange is that this is the same town. Kiryas Joel.

The poorest place in the United States is not a dusty Texas border town, a hollow in Appalachia
Crime is virtually nonexistent.

Nearly half of the village’s households reported less than $15,000 in annual income.

About half of the residents receive food stamps, and one-third receive Medicaid benefits and rely on federal vouchers to help pay their housing costs.

Ultra-Orthodox Satmar Hasidic Jews predominate in the village
The concentration of poverty in Kiryas Joel, (pronounced KIR-yas Jo-E

And to top that off, here is some more info on this place.

“I cannot say as a group that they are cheating the system,” said William B. Helmreich, a sociology professor who specializes in Judaic studies at City College of the City University of New York, “but I do think that they have, no pun intended, unorthodox methods of getting financial support.”

So, not only is this town rampant with rules that seem to be based in religion, at the same time
many of its residents, and it seems even the town itself is gaming the financial system,
and to top that off, they are getting grants from the State to make larger centers
for gathering.

One lawmaker, Assemblywoman Nancy Calhoun, a Republican who represents an adjacent district in Orange County, has demanded an investigation by state officials into why Kiryas Joel received grants for the center. “They may be truly poor on paper,” Ms. Calhoun said. “They are not truly poor in reality.”

So it seems that this place is a religious haven so to speak, and they must have freinds
in high places within the State to get such preferential treatment, to the extent that ordinary
people can not even come there and take pictures. They seem to run the show, even the
State Troopers in the area.

Talk about an abuse power. This place has it all.

edit on 10-8-2011 by burntheships because: (no reason given)

posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 11:23 AM
reply to post by jerico65

What would be the harm in letting them put cameras in your bedroom and toilet? I mean if you have nothing to hide.

posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 11:31 AM
reply to post by burntheships

So they are spending state and federal money to establish or strengthen a religious enclave?

posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 11:44 AM

Originally posted by kosmicjack
reply to post by burntheships

So they are spending state and federal money to establish or strengthen a religious enclave?

Exactly, and when folks come along taking pictures, "they" (in this case whoever this is in a high
place in New York) get upset. Its obviously someones baby.

posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 03:35 PM
reply to post by burntheships

Thanks for that post burntheships. I think I ate a cranky sando the other day, sorry about my abrupt responses.

First thing, in going back to the first point we "discussed" regarding the ones filming and their intent, I DO agree with you that many are just trying to make a point, and often are so stupid in doing it they hurt whatever cause they may be promoting. It didn't seem these guys were being beligerent about it, but not giving ID is just not necessary.
On to your very informative post, wow. I wonder if this is somehow protected like the Amish? Too bad you can't pay to come into their living rooms and watch them live...
The only way I can see gov't monies going to a place like this is via an established "township" that qualifies for can you qualify if you are a self governing theocracy in the US? How can you be one in the first place? The whole thing stinks to me. Thanks for the research.


posted on Aug, 10 2011 @ 03:55 PM
Attention all Turists..

Do NOT go to America and expect to take pictures of your lovely trip.

Infact, go somewhere nicer and bring back happier memories.
edit on 10-8-2011 by JennaDarling because: (no reason given)

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