Monsanto official Beaten by farmers in India over Failed GMO Bt Cotton Seeds

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posted on Jul, 18 2011 @ 11:37 AM
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Originally posted by 547000
Finally found the word for it: I do not support vigilantes.


Hmm, okay.

You mean you hate Robin Hood?

Interesting point: Robin Hood is from the time of King John, usurper of the throne, who sold it to the barons of Parliament. Yes, Parliament, was victory of the talmudic barons (en masse) over a tyrant King. A tyrant King just like Hitler, was John. They set him up to take him out.

So then after Magna Carta and Robin the Hood, we get, the ultimate modern caricature: Guy Fawkes.

So my main question to you, non-supporter of vigilance, is this: What is the difference between Robin Hood, Guy Fawkes, and some Indian farmer beating a Mudsento employee? The answer of course, is none. That violent Indian farmer, is just as heroic as Robin Hood. It is the nature of tyranny, that has gone high tech. It is the windmill itself, that has cloaked itself, and so how shall we tilt against them?

Guy Fawkes is a distraction, because the parliament of today, can't be defeated with power kegs. So they are using the Guy Fawkes image to make more fools. I prefer Robin Hood to Guy Fawkes, because Robin was good with the ladies whereas Fawkes was a revolutionary shmuck who would only have strengthened the barons if he had succeeded. Typical lonely revolutionary. LAME. At least Robin has panache and a feather. But if you don't like Robin, how about Rob Roy or William Wallace or Jesus? There's lots of people who were vigilant against lawyers and their assery, and you can take any of them as your hero, at any time. Just choose wisely.




posted on Jul, 18 2011 @ 11:43 AM
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Here's the thing. I don't support Robin Hood either. He still commited crimes, and I think people celebrate it because they were not the ones whose wealth was stolen. Essentially because the majority was not rich, it seemed to have made it okay to steal. It's always someone else who's greedy.

How could Jesus be a vigilante? He basically said, turn the other cheek, give unto Caeser what is Caesar's, and if a man sues you give him your coat.

Anyway here is a link to a thread I started that we may discuss in, since no one in this thread seems interested in discussing the topic: www.abovetopsecret.com...
edit on 18-7-2011 by 547000 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 18 2011 @ 12:58 PM
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Originally posted by 547000
How could Jesus be a vigilante?


You quote his saying "Pay Caesar's things back to Caesar." In this moment, he was being tricked by talmud-lovers. They had tried to trick him, as lawyers do. They said, "well, "Master", if we are to be penniless, then how shall we pay the tax?!" ...Do you see their tactic? They. silk traders and religio-slavers. They, stoners of women. They, assheads who use God's name to get rich off hurting the flock, are trying to trick the Master, the good King, the lamb, Jesus.

See, Jesus in this moment, did not even have a penny (the Roman tax coin). That's the true magic. To live free from concern of money. So my point is that the assheads who triggered your quote above, and the assheads who stone/hate women, and the assheads who Jesus smacked around inside the temple, and the assheads who are hired by Mudsento due to their superior lawyering, are all the same asshead.

So I am glad to help you frame your point: You support all tyranny, so long as the little guy never gets a breath.

You are opposed to Robin Hood, and would prefer a tyrant like John the fake King.

You are opposed to Guy Fawkes, and would prefer the stifling human haters called Rule-by-talmudic-Barons aka "Parliament".

You are opposed to Han Solo, and would prefer the order and stability and law, of Emperor Palpatine and his gangster buddy Jabba the Hutt. You like stability, at all costs, and you are angered when one man stands up to oppose that.

Finally you clarified your point. I am glad to have helped.



posted on Jul, 18 2011 @ 06:25 PM
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Originally posted by 11azerus11

Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by Jana12
 


The problem with that is farmers are allowed to choose whether to use Monsanto products or not. No one is forcing anyone.


if that was the case then why do the farmers black themselves out on the movie "food inc".... because their SCARED.... would somebody be scared if they really had a choice... get over it... there is nothing u can say that can justify their actions... you want us to revolt because america is on a crusade... but u want us to stand down to a corporation that is poisoning our children... youre an oxymoron...



reply to post by EyeHeartBigfoot


Hey, I'm totally agreeing with you. I didn't post that comment. If you read my 4 posts you'll see that we actually agree.

I do not recall ever posting (or even thinking) ... "The problem with that is farmer's are allowed to chose whether to use Monsanto products or not" ... nor do I support such an insane statement or position.

My 4th post on this Thread on July 17th @ 1:55 ... supports my 3 previous posts -- Monsanto is a criminal empire run by a crime family. That's the position of all of my posts here. I didn't make the above comment.

I'm soooo confused ... Jana12




I believe it is unjust to resort to mob rule. We might as well start beating up leftists if we want to stand up for our rights.



one is a patriotic revolution while the latter is a mob mentality... which is it? make up your mind...
edit on 18-7-2011 by 11azerus11 because: added quote



posted on Jul, 18 2011 @ 06:35 PM
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Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by Jana12
 


The problem with that is farmers are allowed to choose whether to use Monsanto products or not. No one is forcing anyone.



Holy s**t ... are you kidding me? Farmers are NOT allowed to choose. They are backed into a corner by the Monsanto crime family of BULLIES. That's the problem. And this is NOT anything new ... it has been going on for decades.

Do you live in a cave? ... Jana12



posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 12:41 AM
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reply to post by smallpeeps
 


You don't seem to understand. Jesus did not care about material things. He basically said let the evil be evil, and the good do good, because God will judge all men by their deeds, and throw people in hell or give them heaven. Basically the message is this world will end, and it's the world to come that's truly important. But I guess your political views prevent you from seeing this simple truth.

Oh, because I don't support Robin Hood, I support tyranny now? The masses say he was good, but he still had to commit evil to do good, which negates the whole point. Charity cannot be forced. It has to be voluntary.

You really like accusing people of things, without understanding their points at all. I don't support tyranny, but I believe we should not punish the evil out of our own anger by doing evil--we are responsible for those deeds too, no matter our excuse--, because that is God's role. Vigilante justice often is about what the vigilante and his supporters think is just, and if his perceptions are wrong, then he has commited evil thinking himself to be just, which he will be accountable for.

I don't think Guy Fawkes was all that great either.

I basically gave you another thread to continue this conversation, and yet you decided to lengthen this thread. So how about we go there, and people can continue discussing how evil Monsanto is here, and how Monsanto employees should be beaten up, and so forth.



posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 02:41 AM
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Originally posted by Jana12

Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by Jana12
 


The problem with that is farmers are allowed to choose whether to use Monsanto products or not. No one is forcing anyone.



Holy s**t ... are you kidding me? Farmers are NOT allowed to choose. They are backed into a corner by the Monsanto crime family of BULLIES. That's the problem. And this is NOT anything new ... it has been going on for decades.

Do you live in a cave? ... Jana12


So how did Monsanto force the Indian farmers into buying their products? I am pretty sure the products were marketed to them and then they decided to buy those crops and plant them and they were not pleased with the results. At least that is what I understood from the article.

Okay, I just saw Food, Inc, and it's mainly about the US. But anyway much of the problem is government intervention. They subsidize corn, they have standards which state whether farming is sanitary or not, and they support patents. Get rid of patents and Monsanto cannot claim that people broke their patent.

Either way, I still don't see a justification for beating up the man.



posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 02:41 AM
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Double post.
edit on 19-7-2011 by 547000 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 07:41 AM
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Originally posted by 547000
You don't seem to understand. Jesus [...] will judge all men by their deeds, and throw people in hell or give them heaven. Basically the message is this world will end


Wow, pathetic. That's not the Jesus I look up to, wimpy and throwing people in hell? That's false and doom-tastic. "End of the world"? No, I am talking about the beginning of a new world, if only you could nut up like Jesus did, in opposition to asshead lawyers, just like he did. Hmm, I doubt you'll understand.

Well, I, understand quite well, and I will explain it to you again:

"Taking the law into your own hands" is not possible, when law becomes tyranny. It is a moral imperetive then, to take the law BACK, away from those who use it to do evil. An example would be when Jesus prevented the lawyers of his day from murdering a hooker. That is the nature of lawyers: They are heartless death worshippers. Jesus, as a fine example, told them to get bent, and he saved a woman from their misuse of law. You gettin this or am I wasting my time with you?

Law: becomes tyranny, always, by its very nature. So it is not a question of "taking the law" into ones hands, it is a question of taking the law BACK OUT OF THE HANDS IT IS IN.

Here is the truth from which you run: Law, is a weapon, against those who cannot afford it. Yes, there is no way for you to run from this truth, and I have explained it several times in this thread.

Again: Law, is already in evil hands, and it is used as a weapon, by those who can afford it. Get it?

And those situations, when law and tyranny meet, is when is does take heroes like Robin Hood and Han Solo, and yes, Jesus (your sketch of him is pathetic and lame), to 1: explain the truth, and 2: stand up for action. What part of this is so hard for you to grasp? Monsanto only exists due to their huge army of lawyers, all of whom have had their souls erased, and who have no hearts.

A lawyer for Monsanto, is worse than the smallpox virus, when it comes to the destruction they can wage on humans.

Again (for the incredibly dense among us):, law, is used as a weapon, by those who can afford to wield it. People like you who skate over that truth, are essentially useless in changing anything. Useless.



posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 08:57 AM
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reply to post by smallpeeps
 


You're really looking to reinterpret the bible. Hell is very real, and both those who do evil purposely and do evil but call it good are going there. Heaven is no democracy, just so you know.

The reason God has not poured down his wrath is because He's waiting the people he wants to repent. Once he has accomplished His purpose then God will crush all kingdoms of men and establish His own and judge all men. Those who meet His judgement will enter into the kingdom, and those who don't will suffer the second death. The bible is quite clear on this matter. You call Him a wimp, but according to His purpose He will destroy the proud and exhalt the righteous. He will also turn the wisdom of the world into foolishness, which He did because many who people call wise do not know or believe that the crucifixion and resurection were actual historic events: it's all myths to them.

My sketch of Jesus was accurate. Read the gospels and epistles again. By suffering and being innocent at the same time you are adding to God's wrath towards them for persecuting you. There is divine law. No ruling of men will ever bring peace. Most revolutionaries think they can run things better, but then someone else will have a problem with their rule and revolt again. It's only when God decides to establish His kingdom will people be at peace with each other
edit on 19-7-2011 by 547000 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 09:41 AM
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Originally posted by 547000
You're really looking to reinterpret the bible. Hell is very real [...]

He will also turn the wisdom of the world into foolishness [...]

It's only when God decides to establish His kingdom [...]


Wow, you went from a Medsento defender to a Hell defender. Not a big leap there eh? It makes sense that you would defend both hell, and hell's spawned corporate behemoths.

1: I am not RE-interpreting anything, it was given for us to interpret individually, all churches are anti-Christ, because you see, Jesus did not establish a church (on purpose). All churches are anti-Christian.

2: "Turn the wisdom of the world" do you mean the wisdom of the sages, aka, talmud? What wisdom of the world are you referring to? Because the current wisdom of the world, is to obey corporate masters and to treat the corporate person, as a "super person". Is that the wisdom which is true folly and which God will "turn"? If not, then what the heck do you mean? I doubt you know what wisdom is.

3: Soooo, the Indian farmers should be calm, and wait on God, is that right? Just lie there and accept what life is, and try to avoid hell, is that right? What god would that be? The hateful talmudic God of the lawyers, or the pleasurable Gods of the indian temples with naked chicks all over them?

Further questions for the expert: Are there more lawyers, per capita, in hell, than say schoolteachers? Also, what pontiff or church or leader do you feel to be most informed on your theories above? Can you direct us to your church of the "peacefully waiting and hoping to avoid hellfire" crowd? Also, why do you avoid all I said about law? Why are you totally unable to discuss this idea you disagree with (that of "lone people taking the law into hand") when I have clearly explained that the law is already in an evil hand, and is being used as a weapon? Why do you deny God's injustice at the pain which is being caused by the people in power? Why do you support lawyers instead of goodness?

It is normal, for stupid ones, to tell people hellfire and punishment await them, if they fail to obey the leaders and the lawyers. That is normal, for idiots. That is what makes them, idiots, and cowards. But I would like to hear a better explanation than what you have offered here, as to why you subscribe to such ideas? We really are learning a lot here, but I am not sure you are.



posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 10:17 AM
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Originally posted by smallpeeps
Wow, you went from a Medsento defender to a Hell defender. Not a big leap there eh? It makes sense that you would defend both hell, and hell's spawned corporate behemoths.
Hell is real. Not politically correct but it is real. I am defending individuals who do not make the high level decisions of Monsanto, regardless of popular opinion. Beating him up was a wrong action, regardless of how many people support it.


1: I am not RE-interpreting anything, it was given for us to interpret individually, all churches are anti-Christ, because you see, Jesus did not establish a church (on purpose). All churches are anti-Christian.


Mathew 28:19: "Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,"


: "Turn the wisdom of the world" do you mean the wisdom of the sages, aka, talmud? What wisdom of the world are you referring to? Because the current wisdom of the world, is to obey corporate masters and to treat the corporate pehe heck do you mean? I doubt you know what wisdom is.


The wisdom of the world that there is no God of the bible. Read the writings of Paul. The message of the cross is idiotic to the world and on purpose too.


3: Soooo, the Indian farmers should be calm, and wait on God, is that right? Just lie there and accept what life is, and try to avoid hell, is that right? What god would that be? The hateful talmudic God of the lawyers, or the pleasurable Gods of the indian temples with naked chicks all over them?


1) They believe in karma don't they? Why not let karma get the employee? Why play God and heap bad karma on yourself?

2) Correct.

3) The God of the Hebrews.

4) The other gods don't exist.


Further questions for the expert: Are there more lawyers, per capita, in hell, than say schoolteachers? Also, what pontiff or church or leader do you feel to be most informed on your theories above? Can you direct us to your church of the "peacefully waiting and hoping to avoid hellfire" crowd? Also, why do you avoid all I said about law? Why are you totally unable to discuss this idea you disagree with (that of "lone people taking the law into hand") when I have clearly explained that the law is already in an evil hand, and is being used as a weapon? Why do you deny God's injustice at the pain which is being caused by the people in power? Why do you support lawyers instead of goodness?


1) I don't know.
2) None in specific, but you could try searching sermons online or reading the bible for yourself.
3) No. Also most people are ignorant of scriptures and increasingly unreligious so why would you expect them to follow them?
4) Because you're not understanding my point of view either.
5) Evil will be punished. Also vigilantes act on what they percieve is good or evil. They're not all-knowing, and if they have delusions or persecution complexes they are acting on false beliefs.
6) Every man dies once, then is judged. If victims become monsters they too will suffer judgement for their deeds.
7) Not mutually exclusive.


It is normal, for stupid ones, to tell people hellfire and punishment await them, if they fail to obey the leaders and the lawyers. That is normal, for idiots. That is what makes them, idiots, and cowards. But I would like to hear a better explanation than what you have offered here, as to why you subscribe to such ideas? We really are learning a lot here, but I am not sure you are.


1) Keep calling me a troll or an idiot. You're just setting up for the shame you will feel when God resurrects the dead.
2) I have had a powerful experience that proves, undoubtedly, to me, that the Christian God exists. It's both terrifying and a relief, and I wished I had been more patient and enduring instead of being bad to bullies in return. It's very difficult to turn the other cheek.
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edit on 19-7-2011 by 547000 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 11:34 AM
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Monsanto is literal evil because they are literally destroying and altering God's creations.
They could very well be one of the Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse, the black horse that represents famine.

It's inevitable, so all we can do is laugh.




posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 11:39 AM
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Originally posted by 547000
Hell is real. [...] The message of the cross [...]

[...] Why not let karma get the employee? Why play God and heap bad karma on yourself?


So resisting like Robin Hood, or Jesus, and defending the helpless ones, brings bad karma? Tell us more about your worldview. Heroism, and defense against the horrible corporate persons who wreck the world on a massive scale, should be done in court? Is that right? Or the farmers should just lie there and let the GloboCorporations do as they please? Ah, you would have them go to court or ANYTHING so long as they do not struggle against the headlock being placed on them via market manipulation and death-marketers like Monsanto?



>>> Why do you support lawyers instead of goodness?
7) Not mutually exclusive.


Yes, they are, as I have explained. You are running away, hiding within the pages of a book you do not understand, supporting hellfire with determination. Your skill is to project death and suffering onto everyone in the name of the Hebrew God, as you explained, there are none others. I understand lawyers as being from talmud, and from tyrants.



It's very difficult to turn the other cheek.


I feel that God is merciful, and it is you who are promoting folly, by siding with hellish corporate persons. You didn't explain why you choose to allow law to be misused by the people in power. You fail massively in what God wants from us, which is to defend the weak. As at the end judgement when he asks "When did you try to help the weak?" ...And your answer to him will be "Never, I tried to make it harder for them. I told them to sit tight and take it."

I guess you summed it up nicely, you believe in hell and will quote scriptures to that effect. We agree to disagree as to the origin of the bible and its message. You believe in a vengeful God, and to wait on him. I believe in a merciful God, who rewards heroic action while we are alive. So we have explained our Gods, mine is merciful and simple to understand, and likes heroism. Yours (god of talmud aka law as a weapon) is cruel and prefers to collect power in the lawyers, judges and corporate persons of today. My God hates the state of thi world, yours loves it, and prefers you to meekly and quietly accept what His evil agents do. Am I sketching your God correctly?

It is true that people can see Jesus as a wimp, turning the other cheek all day. That's cute that you fall back on that, but you see, he was being tricked when he gave that response. So it is folly to quote it as a saying of Jesus, it is a response to a trick question.

We can see from Jesus' actions, that he hates the merchant class and the coinchangers, and the lawyers, and the builders of churches. Sorry you can't see that. One of us is suggesting a valid way to change the world today (by resisting evil) and one of us, is saying the same old crap, and sketching Jesus as an impotent dead man whose message was, "get slapped and like it".

I guess that's the beauty of Jesus in that he left his legacy to be seized up by your people (talmud lawyers and hellfire tards) and to run with it. They have built a sickening group of churches on Jesus' words, and he never told them to do that. I see Jesus as being extremely angry at that. People who speak as you do, are numerous, and tiresome, and do not help anyone.



posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 12:30 PM
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Originally posted by 547000

Originally posted by hp1229

Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by 11azerus11
 


America is a threat to world peace and a bully. Therefore they deserve to be beaten up.

Where do you live? in US or outside the US?

Nice generalized statement. (sarcasam intended).


Outside. And what generalization am I making? Anyone with half a brain can tell that America does a lot that threatens world peace.

Its thugs (the compliant populace) must suffer karma. That's how stupid I think it is to beat up a worker of Monsanto.
edit on 15-7-2011 by 547000 because: (no reason given)

Its the politicians and not America as a nation. There are people with almost full brain in US too who knows the truth.

Politicians are the real thugs all over the world, in US and even in your country (wherever that might be).

The employee got his karmic beating and what he asked for...which is to COMPLY with MONSANTO's policies as a COMPLIANT employee

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edit on 19-7-2011 by hp1229 because: typos



posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 12:30 PM
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"Either way, I still don't see a justification for beating up the man"


Okay ... so, that's your interpretation or 'take' on the incident and the non-justification for the beating.

Here is mine ... If the farmers had murdered the Monsanto official by beheading him and sent his head back to Corporate Headquarters in a box, then it would be taking it too far, and perhaps cruel and unjust, and then perhaps doing the work of God.

The farmers brave actions sent a very powerful message. When they awoke on the morning of the beating, they probably didn't have violence on their minds, nor the intention to commit an act of violence. Defending one's self, or family, or property, or crops absolutely necessary to sustain life is not doing the work of God.

We really do not know every single detail surrounding the incident and every single detail as to what lead to the beating. So, unless we were right there, immersed in the situation from the get-go and all of the events leading up to the beating and the beating itself, we are merely speculating. Only ONE ... just ONE missing detail or fact is all it takes, regarding any story or event, can completely change opinions, assessments, outcomes or verdicts.

We do not know all of the details concerning the conversations or 'sales pitches' that lead up to the event. So, we only have skewed, biased media reports to base our decisions and opinions upon ... which means we are coming to conclusions w/o ALL of the relevant details and necessary specifics.

But, I'll bet the farm (pun intended) that many Monsanto officials on many occasions had previously outright lied to the farmer's ... lied, as in lied through their teeth, while looking them straight in the eye, and that in the end, these greedy, evil sociopaths caused them great harm and misery. This harm and misery will be far-reaching. It didn't only affect these farmers on that day. Guaranteed ... this typical Monsanto evil-doing created a long-lasting, negative domino effect.

Believe what you may ... 'This long overdue beating was an act of bravery that delivered a powerful worldwide message' OR 'The farmers were doing the work of God'.

Maybe, just maybe, if beatings, such as this one, of Monsanto officials had occurred repeatedly, decades ago, this incident probably would not have occurred and instead of being here on this Thread, no one would even know who or what Monsanto is ... as in "never heard of them" ... and maybe GMO would be non-existent.

People, including evil-doers, only do what they can do, not what they can't do. When they are not stopped or punished or prevented from repeating their evil acts, the evil-doing escalates leaving many more victims to suffer. The farmers really didn't have any other recourse. What were they going to do ... hold court by jury trial and imprison them for life?

You are entitled to your interpretations and opinions ... this is MY interpretation and opinion ... it doesn't have to be yours.



posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 12:35 PM
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Originally posted by undo

Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by 11azerus11
 


America is a threat to world peace and a bully. Therefore they deserve to be beaten up. Who cares if the people are not the ones deciding for war but their government is? Their compliance makes them responsible for their government's actions. If they get nuked it's karma!


you realize you're saying this on a site provided by americans and brits, populated mostly by americans and brits, who most of the time agree that the usa needs to bring their soldiers home (and protest it, speak it loudly, say it all over the dang internet and on youtube all the dang time) and stay out of armed conflicts with other nations? we've had marches, protests, books, magazines, newspaper articles. you let me know when your government starts doing what you tell it to, k?

I personally think 547000 is a Indian Muslim caught between hating america and loving the islamic nations living in a non-islamic nation


Just a theory
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posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 12:39 PM
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wow..from Monsanto to Bible?

WTF?



posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 12:57 PM
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Originally posted by smallpeeps

So resisting like Robin Hood, or Jesus, and defending the helpless ones, brings bad karma? Tell us more about your worldview. Heroism, and defense against the horrible corporate persons who wreck the world on a massive scale, should be done in court? Is that right? Or the farmers should just lie there and let the GloboCorporations do as they please? Ah, you would have them go to court or ANYTHING so long as they do not struggle against the headlock being placed on them via market manipulation and death-marketers like Monsanto?


How is beating up the man doing any justice? Did he make a plan to sell bunk seeds on purpose, or did the seeds happen to have failed? It's just vengeance. Maybe it makes some people feel good. This reminds me of the thread about whether it's okay or not to steal from a big corporation. It's still stealing, regardless of whether you feel you deserve to sock it to them for firing you or not.

They could try going to court, but they probably signed a contract they didn't understand. In the end they would either have to turn to violence or accept their losses. Which of these two would you support? I think the bible says God would prefer the latter. Be even more righteous than the Pharisees and all that.

I really don't think marketing is coercion. You have to still choose whether to buy the product in the end or not.



Yes, they are, as I have explained. You are running away, hiding within the pages of a book you do not understand, supporting hellfire with determination. Your skill is to project death and suffering onto everyone in the name of the Hebrew God, as you explained, there are none others. I understand lawyers as being from talmud, and from tyrants.


Would you really characterize all lawyers as evil? What about some lawyers who do not support the bad guys? Hellfire is real; I have felt the fires. The crucifixion is real too. I have felt the marks. God is real. I have felt the light. Whether we like it or not hell is very, very real. People try to deny its existance, because the consequences of there being a hell is terrifying. But only when you finally know there is a hell you know that the world is heading that way and that to avoid it is to repent and hold your self to a higher moral code, even if it means you will be despised by many. That means that just because something is popular, doesn't mean it is correct. Again, with that in mind, just because people are thirsty for vengeance, does it automatically justify their deeds? Stealing is wrong, no matter what the intentions are. You can accept moral relativism, and the idea that the ends justify the means, only so long as you keep denying eternal judgement. Most people say that the evil done to them have made them evil, but nevertheless if they commit evil, they will be just as accountable as the people who made them that way, because chances are they were made evil by others too, and if God punishes them, He will punish you too.


I feel that God is merciful, and it is you who are promoting folly, by siding with hellish corporate persons. You didn't explain why you choose to allow law to be misused by the people in power. You fail massively in what God wants from us, which is to defend the weak. As at the end judgement when he asks "When did you try to help the weak?" ...And your answer to him will be "Never, I tried to make it harder for them. I told them to sit tight and take it."


You're making it an us vs them scenario. Because I find beating the employee up ethically questionable, I stand up for him. Simalarly I stand up for both the rich and the poor alike, the popular and the unpopular alike. Simply defending this man to not get beaten up for something the higher ups do is what I feel is fair. Bill Gates supports population control, so should the people opposed to population control implicate the workers of Microsoft of the same deeds or stance? Should all bank tellers be shunned for working for banks? I can just say I stood up for the unpopular (the socially weak) in cases where I felt were unjust to them.


I guess you summed it up nicely, you believe in hell and will quote scriptures to that effect. We agree to disagree as to the origin of the bible and its message. You believe in a vengeful God, and to wait on him. I believe in a merciful God, who rewards heroic action while we are alive. So we have explained our Gods, mine is merciful and simple to understand, and likes heroism. Yours (god of talmud aka law as a weapon) is cruel and prefers to collect power in the lawyers, judges and corporate persons of today. My God hates the state of thi world, yours loves it, and prefers you to meekly and quietly accept what His evil agents do. Am I sketching your God correctly?


Incorrect. My God is one of great mercy, but also of great vengeance and great wrath. I will not ignore one aspect of what He is simply because it's not politically correct to. And he rewards true heroism, not what the world considers heroic, but the true intentions and true motivations of a person, because He is all-knowing. I don't see anything heroic about beating up the man. It was all about people seeking vengeance in my eyes. And people just cheered because the hated Monsanto.


It is true that people can see Jesus as a wimp, turning the other cheek all day. That's cute that you fall back on that, but you see, he was being tricked when he gave that response. So it is folly to quote it as a saying of Jesus, it is a response to a trick question.


What do you have to say about praying for those who persecute you? Or if a man sues you give him your coat? Was He tricked then?


We can see from Jesus' actions, that he hates the merchant class and the coinchangers, and the lawyers, and the builders of churches. Sorry you can't see that. One of us is suggesting a valid way to change the world today (by resisting evil) and one of us, is saying the same old crap, and sketching Jesus as an impotent dead man whose message was, "get slapped and like it".


He didn't hate them because of their profession, but because of what He saw in their hearts. He saw the hypocrisy in their hearts, and their love for money over God. You have to accept His claims that He knew the measure of all men, like when He claimed to see someone when they were part of the earth. I am sketching Jesus the way I read it, keeping His sayings of mercy, forgiveness, righteousness, and love in addition to His rebuking of hypocrites and lovers of money. God is not just merciful, but also vengeful and one who can have terrible wrath. Sorry you can't see that.


I guess that's the beauty of Jesus in that he left his legacy to be seized up by your people (talmud lawyers and hellfire tards) and to run with it. They have built a sickening group of churches on Jesus' words, and he never told them to do that. I see Jesus as being extremely angry at that. People who speak as you do, are numerous, and tiresome, and do not help anyone.


The gospel is both one of grace and one that strikes fear into people. The hellfire turns off people, but it is true. Just because you don't want there to be a hell doesn't mean it isn't so. I tried to deny it, but in the end I had to accept it if I were being honest. You will not accept the testimoney of people who have seen it or felt it, so what can I do? I disagree with your premises. There is scriptural evidence that Jesus did want to start a church. Even for many of the orthodox traditions.



posted on Jul, 19 2011 @ 01:04 PM
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Originally posted by hp1229

Originally posted by undo

Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by 11azerus11
 


America is a threat to world peace and a bully. Therefore they deserve to be beaten up. Who cares if the people are not the ones deciding for war but their government is? Their compliance makes them responsible for their government's actions. If they get nuked it's karma!


you realize you're saying this on a site provided by americans and brits, populated mostly by americans and brits, who most of the time agree that the usa needs to bring their soldiers home (and protest it, speak it loudly, say it all over the dang internet and on youtube all the dang time) and stay out of armed conflicts with other nations? we've had marches, protests, books, magazines, newspaper articles. you let me know when your government starts doing what you tell it to, k?

I personally think 547000 is a Indian Muslim caught between hating america and loving the islamic nations living in a non-islamic nation


Just a theory
edit on 19-7-2011 by hp1229 because: (no reason given)


I was illustrating how just because you are from a group, and some others from the group do something, it doesn't automatically implicate you of the same actions or motivations.





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