French soldier in Afghanistan killed in friendly fire incident.

French soldier in Afghanistan killed in friendly fire incident.

www.winnipegfreepress.com

PARIS - France's Defence Ministry says a French soldier in Afghanistan has died after he was accidentally shot by another French soldier.
The ministry said in a statement that an investigation has been opened to establish the precise circumstances of the shooting.
It took place early Monday as a convoy of armoured vehicles was entering a base in Afghanistan's eastern Tagab region. The convoy was returning from an operation.
The soldier was evacuated to a military hospital in Kabul, where he died.

(visit the link for the full news article)

Man how many people have been killed due to friendly fire incidents? I can understand though i think the friendly fire rates is lower than the previous wars we have now. Yes this was only ground-to-ground bases. I think this was a very tragic i mean how you you feel when you accidentally shot a friendly?

www.winnipegfreepress.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

Well, at least this time I don't have to listen to the Brits bitching about how we're always killing their soldiers.

It's a war. Friendly fire happens.

Originally posted by Adyta
Well, at least this time I don't have to listen to the Brits bitching about how we're always killing their soldiers.

It's a war. Friendly fire happens.

edit on 7/11/2011 by Adyta because: (no reason given)

Well ya i agree i mean why do Brits always complain about friendly fire more than anyone else?

Originally posted by Paulioetc15

Originally posted by Adyta
Well, at least this time I don't have to listen to the Brits bitching about how we're always killing their soldiers.

It's a war. Friendly fire happens.

edit on 7/11/2011 by Adyta because: (no reason given)

Well ya i agree i mean why do Brits always complain about friendly fire more than anyone else?

Because Americans are more trigger happy perhaps? And because us Brits suffered many losses at the hands of the Americans during the gulf wars?

People need to realize war is hell. All of this crying over every friendly fire incident, or IED death is "pussifying" everyone. What are you all going to do when we go to war with a country that has an ACTUAL military, with jets, ships, tanks, etc?

It's not going to be "Oh my god how horrific we lost 2 soldiers this month"... it's going to be "This just in: 12,374 troops were killed today in -insert country here-". Look at these numbers, because you WILL see numbers like this in future wars.

* Second world war (1939-1945)
US deaths:135,576
Friendly fire: 21,000 (16%)

* Vietnam (1966-1971)
US deaths: 58,000
Friendly fire: 8,000 (14%)

Source

Originally posted by Adyta
People need to realize war is hell. All of this crying over every friendly fire incident, or IED death is "pussifying" everyone. What are you all going to do when we go to war with a country that has an ACTUAL military, with jets, ships, tanks, etc?

It's not going to be "Oh my god how horrific we lost 2 soldiers this month"... it's going to be "This just in: 12,374 troops were killed today in -insert country here-". Look at these numbers, because you WILL see numbers like this in future wars.

* Second world war (1939-1945)
US deaths:135,576
Friendly fire: 21,000 (16%)

* Vietnam (1966-1971)
US deaths: 58,000
Friendly fire: 8,000 (14%)

Source

I heard during the 1st Gulf War, we lost around 35 out of 148 Americans deaths due to friendly fire by our OWN side. That's like 24% of those in modern war. AS far as i can see, the current wars we are in are the lowest. I mean there are couple of friendly fire incidents involving Libyan rebels by NATO warplanes. Like one in April 1st 2011 of this year where NATO warplanes struck Libyan rebels, killing 13.

Edit out my comment.

Originally posted by Paulioetc15

I think this was a very tragic i mean how you you feel when you accidentally shot a friendly?

Yeah,,, It would be bad knowing you @#$%ED UP big time and your mistake has cost a life. ;@@:

Imagine being that poor bastard that was killed by that " friendly".

Originally posted by mr-lizard

Originally posted by Paulioetc15

Originally posted by Adyta
Well, at least this time I don't have to listen to the Brits bitching about how we're always killing their soldiers.

It's a war. Friendly fire happens.

edit on 7/11/2011 by Adyta because: (no reason given)

Well ya i agree i mean why do Brits always complain about friendly fire more than anyone else?

Because Americans are more trigger happy perhaps? And because us Brits suffered many losses at the hands of the Americans during the gulf wars?

Well the US has more troops than any other NATO nations that's why we have more incidents

reply to post by Paulioetc15


A quote from Murphy's Laws of Combat.

Friendly fire...isn't.

I feel for the family of the Soldier who was killed. And the person who did it.

Originally posted by Paulioetc15

Originally posted by Adyta
Well, at least this time I don't have to listen to the Brits bitching about how we're always killing their soldiers.

It's a war. Friendly fire happens.

edit on 7/11/2011 by Adyta because: (no reason given)

Well ya i agree i mean why do Brits always complain about friendly fire more than anyone else?

Because, more often than not, it is the British getting shot at by Americans who are usually too stupid to recgnise a friendly (Tornado downed in 2nd Gulf War mistaken for a Scud missile by Patriot battery) or to pumped up on amphetamines to distinguish between a light tank and a Grad launcher, then not even getting confirmation of the target before letting rip (Matty Hull - A10 attack).. There are plenty more examples we can provide..

Perhaps we wouldn't bitch so much if the US DoD actually assisted the coroners enquiries for the deaths caused, but instead stonewalled and refused to provide any sort of info which could be used for a proper investigation.

reply to post by stumason


I hear ya. Though I'm not a Brit, it was always my greatest fear as Recon to get shot up by our own trigger happy SOB's after surviving the mission.

A-10's shot up quite a few Bradleys during the 1st Gulf War too.

This has led to better IFF (Identify, Friendly or Foe) techniques, but there is still a lot to be desired in that arena.

Originally posted by mr-lizard

Originally posted by Paulioetc15

Originally posted by Adyta
Well, at least this time I don't have to listen to the Brits bitching about how we're always killing their soldiers.

It's a war. Friendly fire happens.

edit on 7/11/2011 by Adyta because: (no reason given)

Well ya i agree i mean why do Brits always complain about friendly fire more than anyone else?

Because Americans are more trigger happy perhaps? And because us Brits suffered many losses at the hands of the Americans during the gulf wars?

More a lapse in communication. Brits are as stubborn as U.S. Americans when it comes to communications and intelligence privileges. The first Gulf War was the most complex, the fastest and the most successful invasion/offensive ever conducted at the time. All completed with communications technology a good leap inferior to what we have today.

Men and women have been killed due to blue on blue fire on just about every side of the line in both Iraq and Afghanistan. It is war. It is close-quarters, high-intensity war. The fact that most of the metal dropped and fired in both conflicts comes from U.S. American forces accounts for the higher rates of "friendly fire."

Originally posted by stumason

Originally posted by Paulioetc15

Originally posted by Adyta
Well, at least this time I don't have to listen to the Brits bitching about how we're always killing their soldiers.

It's a war. Friendly fire happens.

edit on 7/11/2011 by Adyta because: (no reason given)

Well ya i agree i mean why do Brits always complain about friendly fire more than anyone else?

Because, more often than not, it is the British getting shot at by Americans who are usually too stupid to recgnise a friendly (Tornado downed in 2nd Gulf War mistaken for a Scud missile by Patriot battery) or to pumped up on amphetamines to distinguish between a light tank and a Grad launcher, then not even getting confirmation of the target before letting rip (Matty Hull - A10 attack).. There are plenty more examples we can provide..

Perhaps we wouldn't bitch so much if the US DoD actually assisted the coroners enquiries for the deaths caused, but instead stonewalled and refused to provide any sort of info which could be used for a proper investigation.

Actually, it is your incompetent government not supplying your troops with the right gear quite often that leads to them being in bomb zones. Like this link where a British Forward Air Controller accidentally gave the wrong coordinates to USAF F-15 pilots that killed three of your boys. He did not have his headset so he did not hear the pilot correctly. Had the FAC had the headset on, the three boys would have lived. Source

As for the Tornado being shot out of the sky by a Patriot missile, it was actually the flaw of the warplane itself. The Tornado's IFF wasn't actually working and nobody even the Patriot crew knew it. The Patriot fired on what they considered to be an enemy scud missile. www.timesonline.co.uk...

however, if it makes you -feel better- to blame america fully verses be critical of your own government, then by all means, go for it.

Here is the stats though, if you're curious.

Iraq/Afghanistan War:
British military deaths by FF from Americans forces: Five
British military deaths by FF from British forces: 14

BTW the Brits who have committed friendly fire incidents have not been charged for it either. www.guardian.co.uk...
www.independent.co.uk...
news.bbc.co.uk...


So, in Afghanistan, if you added up all the FF deaths from the US to both brits and themselves, it still doesn't equal the amount of FF deaths that the brits have brought on to themselves
-part snipped due to it being inaccurate and reported in the bottom external-

it is the British getting shot at by Americans who are usually too stupid to recgnise a friendly

Like how many killed compare to your forces killed by your own forces? Saying it shows how the British public were brainwashed to believe that Americans always shot up British soldiers but in fact, not a lot actually. But again, as I said, if you want to blame americans for the incompetents of your officials, go ahead...sometimes it feels good to lie to yourself and blame other nations for your own nations shortcomings.

March 23, 2003 - A U.S. Patriot missile battery shot down a British Tornado GR.4A warplane of No. 13 Squadron RAF, killing the pilot and navigator. Investigations showed that the Tornado's Identification friend or foe indicator had malfunctioned and hence it was not identified as a friendly aircraft. (Iraq)

March 28, 2003 - 190th Fighter Squadron, Blues and Royals friendly fire incident: A British soldier was killed and five others injured when two USAF A-10 Thunderbolt II warplanes attacked their armored vehicles on the road to Basra. (Iraq)

December 5, 2006 - A USAF F-18 warplane during close air-support accidentally killed a British Royal Marine in Helmand Province, Afghanistan.

December 5, 2010 - A USAF F-18 warplane during close air-support accidentally killed a New Zealander serving in the British military in Nad 'Ali district of Helmand Province, Afghanistan.

Now i'll list all the friendly fire incidents caused by British forces.

IRAQ WAR: March 24, 2003 - British tank commander Sgt. Steven Roberts from the 2nd Royal Tank Regiment was killed by bursts of L94A1 machine-gun fired from a Challenger II tank manned by a fellow British soldier who was trying to help Roberts quell a stone-wielding Iraqi protester. The Iraqi protester was also killed in this same incident. The gunner who shot Roberts did not know that his machine gun was inaccurate at short range. It was found out that three days before Roberts died, he was forced to give up his body armor to a fellow soldier due to government shortages. Had Roberts lived with the body armor, he would have survived the bullet wound.

March 25, 2003 - Two British soldiers were killed and two others injured when their Challenger II tank was accidentally fired on by another British Challenger II tank in southern Iraq.

March 30, 2003 - British Royal Marine Christopher Maddison was killed when his river patrol boat was hit by missiles after being wrongly identified as an enemy vessel approaching a Royal Engineers checkpoint on the Al-Faw Peninsula, Iraq.

April 3, 2003 - Fusilier Kelan Turrington, of the 1st Battalion, Royal Regiment of Fusiliers, was killed by machine-gun fire mounted from a British tank.

July 16, 2006 - During a raid to apprehend a key terrorist leader and accomplice in a suburb of North Basra, Cpl John Cosby, of the Devonshire and Dorset Regiment, was killed by a 5.56 mm round from a British-issued SA80. It was ruled to be a case of friendly fire by the coroner. It was reported that the British forces who shot him were unclear about the rules of engagement.

AFGHANISTAN WAR: April 6, 2006 - A British convoy in Afghanistan wounded 13 Afghan police officers and killed one, after calling in a US airstrike on what they thought was a Taliban attack.

August 20, 2006 - In Sangin Province, a RAF Harrier II warplane mistakenly strafed British troops missing the enemy 200 metres during a firefight with the Taliban. This angers British Major James Loden of 3 PARA, who called the RAF, "Completely incompetent and utterly, utterly useless in protecting ground troops in Afghanistan". British paratroopers even said that they rather prefer the US air-support over the RAF.

January 15, 2007 - Lance Corporal Matthew Ford, from Zulu Company of 45 Commando Royal Marines, was killed and five others injured after being hit by gunfire in Afghanistan which was later found to be due to friendly fire. The final inquest ruled Ford deaths and five injured soldiers was caused from NATO rounds from a fellow British Royal Marine's machine gun. The report added there was no "negligence" by the other Marine, who had made a "momentary error of judgment".

August 23, 2007 - A USAF F-15 warplane called in to support British ground forces in Afghanistan dropped a bomb on those forces due to the incorrect coordinates given to the pilot by the British Forward Air Controller. Three privates of the 1st Battalion, the Royal Anglian Regiment, were killed and two others were severely injured. It was later revealed that the British forward air controller who called in the strike had not been issued a noise-cancelling headset, and while he supplied the correct target co-ordinates, in the confusion and stress of the battle incorrectly confirmed one wrong digit mistakenly repeated by the pilot, and the bomb landed on the British position 1000 metres away from the enemy. The coroner at the soldiers' inquest stated that the incident was due to "flawed application of procedures" rather than individual errors or "recklessness".

^Now to comment, Not really the fault of anyone on the battlefield. If you want to criticize anyone then criticize the people who keep cutting the military budget. The American pilot only fired once the British FAC confirmed the coordinates. Doesn't sound like it was the US fault but more like the British Government not supplying the FAC a headset. Had the FAC had the headset, the three boys would have lived. However no matter who's fault was it, it's the British FAC always responsible for the pilots action.

September 26, 2007 - British soldiers in operations in Helmand Province, Afghanistan, fired Javelin anti-tank missiles at Danish soldiers from the Royal Life Guards, killing two. It is also confirmed from Danish forces that the British fired a total of 6-8 Javelin missiles, over a 1½ hour period and only after the attack was completed did they realize that the missiles were British, based upon the fragments found after the incident.

January 14, 2008 - In the night in Helmand Province, British troops saw some Afghans "conducting suspicious activities". Visibility was too bad for rifle-fire and they were too far away to call in mortar strikes. The squad decided to use a Javelin anti-tank missile missile they were carrying. British soldiers fired their missile on the nearby roof but the victims were their own Afghan army sentries. One Afghan soldier was killed.

July 9, 2008 - Nine British soldiers from the 2nd Battalion, The Parachute Regiment, were injured after being fired upon by British Army Apache helicopter while on patrol in Afghanistan.

January 14, 2009 - Captain Tom Sawyer, aged 26, 29 Commando Regiment Royal Artillery, and Corporal Danny Winter, aged 28, Zulu Company 45 Commando Royal Marines, were killed and two other British soldiers injured by an explosion. They were taking part in a joint operation with a Danish Battle Group and the Afghan National Army in a location north east of Gereshk in central Helmand Provence. The MoD subsequently confirmed that Tom Sawyer and Danny Winter died from friendly fire when they were hit in error by a Javelin anti-tank missile from British troops.

December 20, 2009 - A British Military Police officer was shot dead by a fellow British soldier while on patrol. It was reported that no charges are to be brought against a British army sniper who killed a British Military Policeman because he was allowed to open fire if he believed that his life was in danger.

July 26, 2010 - Sapper Mark Antony Smith, age 26, of the 36 Engineer Regiment, Royal Engineers, was killed by a smoke shell fired upon by British troops in Sangin Province, Afghanistan. The MoD is investigating his death and said a smoke shell, designed to provide cover for soldiers working on the ground, may have fallen short of its intended target.

Very sad event... I am sure the soldiers involved feel gutted at killing/wounding their own side or those who are fighting by there side.

As for the direction the topic has taken sadly it feels like neither Britain or America are friends (I would go further and doubt there was ever any friendship there in the first place)..

and going by these topics there appears to be more hatred between them than there is towards those they are fighting which leads me to suggest that perhaps they should be fighting each other and not the world.