Originally posted by Mr A
RAF is the most idioitic name for any amry base

Well what kind of a name is USAF and other countries' Air Forces. If you have a problem with the Royal bit then screw you.....personally I am proud of our Monarchy and most of our imperialist past.

i really think this RAF sounds so gay what a English bullshi.t

How on earth is that "English bullshi.t".....that doesn't even make sense

[edit on 2/8/04 by Infidellic]

Originally posted by WestPoint23


Damn im being watched how do you know what my room looks like
Like I said I know the general specifics about British jets I don't know every little bolt or thing they have on it.

this is a perfect exsample of propaganda unleashed on the youg naive mind.
and i bet you didnt even know the name of this jet before you looked at the thread didnt you?

Originally posted by WestPoint23
Hyperen when people here post thread on jets, they post cuz something has changed with the jet that is new or something has happened to it they don't just post things we can get from nay website.
And some British jets are 03 years old too. Aging US jets that can still whoop arse eve after 30 years and are second to none.

yeah and who's competeing against you?
who actually cares about proper wars anymore?
the answer is noone. most coutries are caring about terror attacks and the like.
yeah and also since when is the RAF part of the RN?
and that bit about our jets being 30 years old yeah they are cause our gov sucks and doesnt care about our military,and yet our jets still do a better job than american jets CAUSE WE DONT BLOW UP OUR OWN ALLIES!!

Originally posted by WestPoint23

Damn im being watched how do you know what my room looks like

- LOL! You never know.

Like I said I know the general specifics about British jets I don't know every little bolt or thing they have on it.

- so how do you understand where you are if you have no clue how you got there?

(what with all your early jet stuff being cribbed Brit help?)

thought people might like to know about these planes as they fight the wars of today. People are always going on about America's 'old' planes on ATS so why shouldn't people know about British 'old' planes.

- Totally spot on - and with the added benefit that those who had anything to do with the craft can now speak a lot more freely about them. So folks can actually benefit from some actual knowledge rather than the staple cheer-leading school-boy fantasy that affects so much of this sphere.

30 year old?

Maybe if you did just a little research beforehand you would find that the F3 entered service in 1986.

Maybe you got the 30 year figure from the aging US jets.

- Have the RAF any jets that old in the front-line anymore? It must be close to none if not actually none.

Hyperen when people here post thread on jets, they post cuz something has changed with the jet that is new or something has happened to it

- really? I thought it was because we liked talking about planes. Sure new stuff is interesting but it's hardly a case of one along every minute, hmmm?

If we really believe the 'deny ignorance' theme then surely the truth about how things actually were helps illuminate how the might actually be?

they don't just post things we can get from nay website.
And some British jets are 03 years old too. Aging US jets that can still whoop arse eve after 30 years and are second to none.

- Hey now come one Westy, besides ignoring the Tornado's nothing like as elderly as you imply .....

......if you really want to talk about how a thirty year old could kick young up-start US ass (to an embarrassing degree) go look into the EE/BAC Lightning.

....or check out how our positively ancient Vulcans could perform even against F15's.

This whole 'airframe' age thing is pretty pointless, as even 'your own' B52 clearly shows. The carriage of new digital systems can transform a plane into something very new and very mission capable.

Thats how the 30 year old American fighters do. 30 year old planes still second to none?

Hyperen your chart is BS no F-15 have been shot down down do to enemy fighters. And in a full out battle using support aircraft and many other systems our planes would come out on top. The F-15 is still one of the best planes in the world so is the F-15 even though they are 30 years old.

ell what kind of a name is USAF and other countries' Air Forces.

Well USAF makes sense it stands fro United States Air Force and the British one should be BAF British air force instead of royal air force.

Thanks Hyperen for the excellent post on a largely overlooked aircraft.KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK!

Its perfectly simple Westpoint. When the RFC and RNAS were merged in 1918 they were formed into the worlds first autonomous air force (a move the US made in 1947). As it was unique there was nothing to distinguish it from, hence the name 'Royal Air Force' was perfectly adequate, with subsequent new air forces adopting the name of their country of origin to distinguish them, ie RCAF(Canada), USAF (United States), RAAF (Australia) etc etc. Incidentally Germany made the same move when they called theirs 'Luftwaffe' which simply means 'Air Force'. It isn't Deutsche Luftwaffe, nor is their any call for it, air minded people are perfectly aware that the Luftwaffe is German and the RAF is British. If they can't get to grips with such simple facts they shouldn't be pontificating on anything aeronautical, should they?

Originally posted by groingrinder
Thanks Hyperen for the excellent post on a largely overlooked aircraft.KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK!

Thanks very much, groingrinder. I appreciate the feedback.



[edit on 2/8/04 by Hyperen]

Originally posted by WestPoint23

Hyperen your chart is BS no F-15 have been shot down down do to enemy fighters. And in a full out battle using support aircraft and many other systems our planes would come out on top. The F-15 is still one of the best planes in the world so is the F-15 even though they are 30 years old.

I am quite aware that no F-15s have ever been shot down by another aircraft but that list is not 'BS'. Those aren't real combat performances. Anyway the US hasn't fought a war with any powerful rich countries.

The F-15 gets to shoot down old fighters manned by pilots who aren't as well trained as rich countries pilots. No wonder it has a perfect combat record.

From the link below the list
The study used real pilots flying the JOUST system of networked simulators. Various western aircraft were put in simulated combat against the Su-35. The results were: [The list on a previous post]

It was a simulation but a realistic one at that.

Hyperen British planes don't fight rich powerful countries, but they still get shot down. Although US patriots missiles and US pilots may have something to do with that

Originally posted by WestPoint23
Hyperen British planes don't fight rich powerful countries, but they still get shot down. Although US patriots missiles and US pilots may have something to do with that

Anyone know how many British planes have been shot down in air to air combat?

Have any Tornado F3s been shot down by another plane?

Originally posted by Hyperen


Anyone know how many British planes have been shot down in air to air combat?

Have any Tornado F3s been shot down by another plane?

I think some were shot down by MIGs during Desert Storm.