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Osama's kidney condition: why he had to be "killed" now

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posted on May, 4 2011 @ 05:58 PM
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I hope this is not taken as just another Osama thread. This is meant for those that believe the official story and those that do not. Whether or not you want the dead Osama photo released or not, based on his kidney disease, Osama probably died years ago. This sheds more light as to why this story is happening now.

I searched for a thread specifically related to his kidney disease and dialysis and found one from 2006 with no sources and no real information in the OP (Would osama already be dead...). On the media they have always talked about dialysis as though it's a minor inconvenient procedure that if done a few times a week the person will be fine in the stories I've seen.

People rarely survive 10 years or more on dialysis.

Hemodialysis prolongs life for many people, but life expectancy for people who need hemodialysis is still much less than that for the general population.
Hemodialysis and complications




Overall adjusted annual mortality in hemodialysis-dependent patients tends to be about 20%.
(Merck Online Medical Library). There's a 1 in 5 shot of dying each year since dialysis itself is invasive and risky.



10-year survival rate for Kidney Dialysis: probability of 9.0 survive 10 years of dialysis in the USA 1991-2001(United Network for Organ Sharing, 2003)
Wrong diagnosis.com


Only 9 of 100 people will survive after being on dialysis for 10 years. Consider this data includes people receiving care in hospitals and dialysis clinics, as opposed to machines in caves and in 3rd world countries. He had reportedly been undergoing dialysis since as early as 2000, eleven years ago.

According to authorized sources, bin Laden had mobile dialysis equipment shipped to his hideout in Kandahar in the first part of 2000.
Centre for Research on Globalisation



Week of March 24, 2000 Suspected Saudi terrorist Osama bin Laden is dying of kidney failure
CNN Central Asia


If Obama was doing this purely for political gains for 2012 reelection it would have been more profitable for him to wait until closer to the date. The announcement of Osama bin Laden's death needed to be publicized soon since the time was running out for someone with kidney disease to still be alive and a threat to the USA.

I am hoping to let people know how unlikely it was he was even alive on Sunday. I'm sure some people in here have known people on dialysis and can share their knowledge. And I'm open if someone else knows about dialysis and can argue against this.

Assuming Osama had kidney disease and was on dialysis, it is highly unlikely he was still alive on May 1, 2011. This may be why no body, video, photo or other real proof is yet to be seen by the public.




posted on May, 4 2011 @ 06:05 PM
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I think the only fact in all of that is that he had dialysis equipment shipped ... I'm not sure it's ever been confirmed that he himself had a need for dialysis, isn't it conceivable that the equipment could have been for someone else? family, friend, a member of the organization? any number of things.

I guess my point is people are so willing to shrug off official statements, but so willing to believe other unconfirmed things.. it's quite possible this dialysis equipment sent the media into a firestorm of conjecture and gave life to the Osama on Dialysis scenario .. if there's proof he had kidney disease, I've not seen it .. He very well may have.. I'd love some reliable sources saying he did for sure have this issue



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 06:06 PM
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www.doctorzebra.com...




Kidney (i.e. Renal) [Does Osama bin Laden need dialysis?]
There have been reports that bin Laden requires dialysis because of kidney disease [7].

CIA thought thought possibility of kidney disease was credible [1d].

The U.S. Central Intelligence Agency has concluded that bin Laden does not need dialysis, but does suffer from kidney stones [4].

A journalist who visited bin Laden's camp in the 1990s reported camp members saying that bin Laden had a kidney problem requiring him to drink large amounts of water. The journalist witnessed bin Laden constantly sipping water and green tea in the time they spent together [3].

On July 1, 2002, Time Magazine "reported that physicians who analyzed photos of bin Laden determined that he probably suffers from secondary osteoporosis, which is often related to diabetes and kidney trouble" [6].

Comment: Renal failure can be a complication of diabetes (which he may or may not have -- see above). Interestingly, occasional persons may have their diabetes improve after renal failure occurs, because insulin is retained longer in the body when kidney function is impaired.




4 Robert Windrem. "CIA is looking for a few good doctors." NBC News, Dec. 29, 2004.



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 06:10 PM
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Originally posted by HawkMan11
CIA thought thought possibility of kidney disease was credible [1d].

The U.S. Central Intelligence Agency has concluded that bin Laden does not need dialysis, but does suffer from kidney stones [4].



Which would make it very possible for him to have died in this recent operation and not of kidney failure.

edit on 4-5-2011 by miniatus because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 06:23 PM
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reply to post by HawkMan11
 


Kidney stones can be a result and cause of chronic kidney disease and failure.

Kidney stones are not treated with dialysis. NKUDIC, this website discusses treatment and prevention, no mention of dialysis. Same thing here PubMed Health Kidney stones.

To be sure, dialysis is not indicated for kidney stones or stone prevention. Dialysis is only used in patients with renal failure, that is their glomerular filtration rate is less than 15, page 23 of dialysis indications.

If he was on dialysis he had renal failure, and yes he likely also had kidney stones.



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 06:28 PM
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reply to post by BenIndaSun
 


Star for you, sir.

I am only aiming to show


The U.S. Central Intelligence Agency has concluded that bin Laden does not need dialysis, but does suffer from kidney stones [4]


Which has apparently been their supposition since at least 2004. True or false? I don't know.
edit on 4-5-2011 by HawkMan11 because: (no reason given)

edit on 4-5-2011 by HawkMan11 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 06:35 PM
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A buddy of mine had kidney stones a decade ago, relatively simple operation, he showed me the jar full of stones, quite large.



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 06:42 PM
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Originally posted by miniatus
I think the only fact in all of that is that he had dialysis equipment shipped ... I'm not sure it's ever been confirmed that he himself had a need for dialysis, isn't it conceivable that the equipment could have been for someone else? family, friend, a member of the organization? any number of things.

I guess my point is people are so willing to shrug off official statements, but so willing to believe other unconfirmed things.. it's quite possible this dialysis equipment sent the media into a firestorm of conjecture and gave life to the Osama on Dialysis scenario .. if there's proof he had kidney disease, I've not seen it .. He very well may have.. I'd love some reliable sources saying he did for sure have this issue


As I said, assuming he has kidney disease. Based on several sources (hard to call anything completely reliable), he was suffering with kidney conditions and needed dialysis. I would like to know "for sure" as well but that probably won't happen.

CNN's doctor Sanjay Gupta thought he might have been on dialysis in 2008 based on his appearance and sources at the time in a video. Gupta.


Gupta: his sort of grayness of beard, his paleness of skin, very gaunt sort of features. A lot of times people associate this with chronic illness

Zahn(interviewer): I think we need to remind the viewers once again that the president of Pakistan talked about [bin Laden] importing two dialysis machines into Afghanistan

Gupta: The sort of frosting of the appearance is something that people a lot of times associate with chronic kidney failure, renal failure, certainly someone who is requiring dialysis would have that.

He's also not moving his arms. I looked at this tape all the way through its entire length. He never moved his left arm at all. The reason that might be important is because people who have had a stroke -- and certainly people are at increased risk of stroke if they also have kidney failure

Gupta: dialysis machines require electricity, they're going to require clean water, they're going to require a sterile setting -- infection is a huge risk with that. If you don't have all those things and a functioning dialysis machine, it's unlikely that you'd survive beyond several days or a week at the most


Not saying that Gupta is right, but there wouldn't have been any reason to lie about this in 2008 based on the news of late.



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 07:09 PM
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Originally posted by HawkMan11
There have been reports that bin Laden requires dialysis because of kidney disease [7].

CIA thought thought possibility of kidney disease was credible [1d].

The U.S. Central Intelligence Agency has concluded that bin Laden does not need dialysis, but does suffer from kidney stones [4].

A journalist who visited bin Laden's camp in the 1990s reported camp members saying that bin Laden had a kidney problem requiring him to drink large amounts of water. The journalist witnessed bin Laden constantly sipping water and green tea in the time they spent together [3].

On July 1, 2002, Time Magazine "reported that physicians who analyzed photos of bin Laden determined that he probably suffers from secondary osteoporosis, which is often related to diabetes and kidney trouble" [6].

Comment: Renal failure can be a complication of diabetes (which he may or may not have -- see above). Interestingly, occasional persons may have their diabetes improve after renal failure occurs, because insulin is retained longer in the body when kidney function is impaired.
4 Robert Windrem. "CIA is looking for a few good doctors." NBC News, Dec. 29, 2004.


There are conflicting sources. But if he had secondary osteoporosis it makes it more likely he had chronic kidney disease as said above.


In his book, Professor Griffin also endorses this theory. He says Bin Laden was treated for a urinary infection, often linked to kidney disease, at the American Hospital in Dubai in July 2001, two months before 9/11. At the same time, he ordered a mobile dialysis machine to be delivered to Afghanistan.
Has Osama bin Laden been dead for 7 years?


A recent Reuters report (11/13/03; scroll down) quoting Labeviere's book "Corridors of Terror" points to alleged "negotiations" between Osama bin Laden and the CIA, which took place two months prior to the September 11, 2001 attacks at the American Hospital in Dubai, UAE, while bin Laden was recovering from a kidney dialysis treatment

CBS News has been told that the night before the September 11 terrorist attack, Osama bin Laden was in Pakistan. He was getting medical treatment with the support of the very military that days later pledged its backing for the U.S. war on terror in Afghanistan. Pakistan intelligence sources tell CBS News that bin Laden was spirited into this military hospital in Rawalpindi for kidney dialysis treatment.
Where was Osama bin Laden on 9/11?



posted on May, 4 2011 @ 07:18 PM
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As a person with first hand knowledge of the progression of kidney failure, I do not believe that he would be alive 10 years later. After four years on dialysis my spouse's "quality" of life was greatly reduced and impacted enough to place the word quality in quotes
. What began as kidney failure (requiring dialysis) by the end of 4 years we were dealing with diabetes, blood pressure problems, asthma, an enormous reduction in energy, frequent rounds of pneumonia and various other illnesses.

Once a transplant occurred all these side illnesses went away, but we can never be far from a pharmacy (or civilization) due to the high number of medications required to ensure the survival of the kidney. If he simply suffered from kidney stones, I don't see why that is particularly news worthy. I wonder if received a transplant.



posted on May, 5 2011 @ 11:51 AM
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When you read the many biographies of Bin Laden’s it becomes quite obvious that he did not require a dialysis machine. So I have concluded that the whole thing about his kidney problems was nothing more than a popular rumour that has infiltrated some aspects of the MSN, but in reality he did not have any need for a dialysis machine. Therefore this thread is just one of the many BS bin Laden threads popping up on ATS.

I find this very frustrating.



posted on May, 5 2011 @ 12:41 PM
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Originally posted by kevinunknown
When you read the many biographies of Bin Laden’s it becomes quite obvious that he did not require a dialysis machine. So I have concluded that the whole thing about his kidney problems was nothing more than a popular rumour that has infiltrated some aspects of the MSN, but in reality he did not have any need for a dialysis machine. Therefore this thread is just one of the many BS bin Laden threads popping up on ATS.

I find this very frustrating.


Thanks for your opinion, but do you have other sources for your conclusion that it was "obvious" he did not require dialysis? I don't see how conflicting reports could be taken as obvious, one way or the other that he needed dialysis.

He either did not need dialysis as was widely reported and believed, or he was not alive on May 1, 2011, it couldn't have been both ways.



posted on May, 5 2011 @ 01:10 PM
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reply to post by BenIndaSun
 


Read a few of his biographies, there is one call “secret Al’Qa’ida” by abdel bari atwan who interviewed him and guess what, no dialysis other commentators have said the same. He might have had kidney stones and probably had diabetes but not and renal disorder requiring dialysis. And i don’t understand how it couldn’t have been both ways



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