I'm not sure if I posted this in the right spot, but it seemed to fit here? Anyway, I was wondering if anyone had ever heard of these and if so, has anyone had an experience with one in their lifetime. I have had a few "run ins" with what I would consider familiars and some were what seemed to be good and the others evil. Would anyone care to comment?
Thanks

Magestica, certainly heard of them but never had an experience with them. Don`t suppose you would care to expand on your experiences, sounds very interesting.

Familiars are spirits (demons, in my belief) that direct and council one who allows oneself to come in contact. An exmple of a gateway to finding a "Familiar" would be the Oujia board.

Personal note. Familiars are demonic in nature, nd whether or not it portrays itself as being good or evil, it will lead you down the same path.

Well I was actually asking and kinda hoping that someone might be able to validate it for me. I had a very odd experience with 2 black dogs a few years ago. I was sitting in my livingroom talking amongst friends and family, and ofcourse we were all talking about weird stuff like the illuminati and we mentioned some names well, all of a sudden it got silent and we turned and looked and there were 2 black dogs staring through the sliding glass doors. I got up and opened the doors and they ran off, I tried calling to them and one disappeared and the other stopped in the street and turned around and just stared at me-it was a very creepy feeling.Finally he turned and left.
Well a few months later...I had some friends over again and we got on the subject of the illuminati and I told them what happened the last time I was talking about this, and they kinda laughed-didn't think there was a connection----then. The same 2 dogs appeared through the same window! It freaked everyone out!! I chose not to go out this time...lol Instead I kicked the door and they ran off. But I thought this was really really odd..and so did my friends. Btw...they were dobermins. I went around the neighborhood asking everyone if they owned or had seen these 2 dogs, noone did??? So that's my theory, that they were familiars of some sort.
I don't know though, I could be wrong, could be just coincidence?? Anyway that was one experience...so what do you think??? I'd like to know

Actually, some factions of the Christian religions consider themselves to be watched over by "Guardian Angels"...Wouldn't that also fit into your definition of a "demon familiar", TC?

think they actually exist then? But that they are evil in nature? If they are demons then why come in the form of an animal? Can't demons just lurk in the shadows?
Don't you think that people who are involved in deep witchcraft can use animals to lure others or scare others or like my situation-listen in on others? I'm asking this for a very good reason btw...
Shame on me for mis-spelling "exist"

[Edited on 23-3-2003 by magestica]

Yeah I believe they exist, there is enough historical stuff around to say that something like that is true.

They are demonic entities that attach themesleves to the person, either manifesting as a 'pet' or animal, or just posessing some animal and using it.

Animals can easily be taken over by entities, - look in the bible at the pigs that ran into the lake.

Not really, M-D. The notion of Guardian Angel can be found in the Bible as being a good thing, but Familiars fall under the category of witchcraft and sorcery. We are to run from evil and give credit to God and His glory. Familiars give no credit to God, do not pass the testing of spirit and work on the weakness of man's pride.

I've always been under the impression that familiars were commonly believed to be the animal forms taken by spirits that worked with witches.

I've always understood familiar spirits to be spirits who were "familiar" with certain personal secrets or family facts and would give that information to a medium.

Below, I've added some basic information about this:

Familiar Spirits

The Old Testament Hebrew word for those with familiar spirits meant a bottle, since they were regarded as a vessel for the inspiring demon. The New Testament Greek word was equivalent in meaning, and whether they were fakers, or actually possessed by a spirit, the people of God were to have absolutely nothing to do with them.

The word "familiar" is from the Latin familiaris, meaning a "household servant," and was intended to express the idea that sorcerers had spirits as their servants ready to obey their commands.

According to The Bible record, sorcerers, or necromancers, who claimed the ability to contact the dead were said to have a "familiar spirit." The word "familiar" in this usage is derived from the Latin word familiaris, meaning a "household servant," and was intended to imply that they had spirits as their servants, ready to obey their commands, which for some of them may have been partly true - but the spirits were demons. The rest, like the many carnival "mediums" today, either had hidden human (or in modern times, electronic) assistants, or were skilled ventriloquists who could fake the sound of a voice coming from the ground, or from "thin air."

What draws a person into involvement with familiar spirits? The appeal of the occult is usually either curiosity or a desire for that which is hidden. One may have fascination with the supernatural, but may not know how to differentiate between the supernatural realm of God and that of Satan. Almost everyone wants to know what the future holds in store. It is easy, therefore, to be drawn into a scheme that claims to hold the key to knowing the unknown.

A familiar spirit is the designation of a specific type of evil spirit. It is so classified because of its chief characteristic: namely, familiarity. It is a relationship, a familiarity, with a person or personality. For example, a woman, whom Paul encountered in Macedonia, had a familiar spirit which gave her powers of divination. (Acts 16:16-18)

Familiar spirits are common amid the practices of spiritism and witchcraft, but their activity is by no means limited to persons and practices so obviously occult. Evil spirits are personalities. They can reason, decide, express emotions and communicate. Personalities have the capacity to relate to one another. Two human personalities can form a relationship; and, through communication and communion, that relationship can be enhanced. Likewise, a person can form and develop a close relationship with an evil spirit. When a person forms a relationship with an evil spirit (which can be done either willfully or through ignorance), he then has a familiar spirit.

Communication is the chief characteristic of a familiar spirit. The spirit responds quickly to the summons of the medium. A medium, such as the witch of Endor whom Saul consulted (I Sam. 28:7), is a go-between which forms a communication link between the earthly world and the demonic realm. Thus, anyone who becomes a channel of communication for an evil spirit is a medium. He has a familiar spirit.

A familiar spirit is something that a person has, because it is a personality identified with a certain individual. In the same sense that one has a book, a friend or a cold, one can be personally identified with a demon spirit.

A familiar spirit and a spirit of divination are very similar in nature. A familiar spirit is usually involved in the areas of (supposed consultation with the dead), spirit mediums, clairvoyancy and trances.

The ability to contact the spirits is often passed from one generation to the next within receptive families. The word familiar comes from the root word, family. Many, it seems, have been enticed by the desire to communicate with departed loved ones.

Sorcerers or necormancers, who professed to call up the dead to answer questions, were said to have a familiar spirit (Deut. 18:11; 2 Kings 21:6; 2 Chr. 33:6; Lev. 19:31; 20:6; Isa. 8:19; 29:4). Such a person was called by the Hebrews an "ob", which properly means a leather bottle; for sorcerers were regarded as vessels containing the inspiring demon. This Hebrew word was equivalent to the pytho of the Greeks, and was used to denote both the person and the spirit which possessed him (Lev. 20:27; 1 Sam. 28:8; compare Acts 16:16).

The famous magician Harry Houdini (1874-1926), a man who it could be said knew "every trick in the book," exposed a great many of them as frauds during his lifetime while attempting to communicate with his dead mother. The effort to make contact between the living and the dead continued even after Houdini himself died. Houdini and his wife agreed to an experiment in which the first of them to die was to communicate with the survivor. When he died in 1926, his widow spent the rest of her life waiting for the message, that by her own admission in 1943, never came.

Halloween, formerly Hallow Evening, started out to be called the 'Death of the Year' by the Celts, hundreds of years ago. They believed that on that day, ghosts of the dead returned to haunt those who hadn't given them proper remembrance and worship. These ghosts came in the form of bats and owls and ghouls and goblins, flying through the night, angrily causing terror and destruction wherever they went, and not only to those who were guilty. Those unfortunate enough to have to venture away from home, light, and family, carried candles within hollowed out turnips which had been carved with frightening, scowling faces, in the hopes of keeping away these angry spirits.

When Christianity reached the area, the Church used this pagan holiday, as it did so many others, for it's own good. Instead of simply being 'haunted' by ghostly evil, the Church decided to celebrate the lives of those were especially worthy of remembrance. Martyrs were 'sainted' - made worthy of human worship, and the day was a celebration of their sacrifice for the cause of Christ.

Eventually, the day became All Saints Day, a day set aside to remember and worship all those made saints by the church (not all martyrs), but soon the original reason was remembered and an additional day was added the day after, further watering down the original meaning. 'All Soul's Day' is the day to remember those 'who've gone before us', a time of respect and remembrance of our loved ones, much the same as Memorial Day in the US. Thus 'Halloween' is 'Hallow Evening', the day before the celebration of the dead.

Predicitng with includes those who are replenished from the east (Masons and Mormons facing east in their temple worship): rituals (Isaiah 2;6), astrologers (Daniel 2:2), tea leaf reading, tarot card readers, palm readers or any form of psychic predictions. The Bible refers to all preceding as sorcery, magic (Daniel 1:20) and witchcraft (Micah 5:12)

(golly, there's a lot of disinformation there)

Oooookay... speaking as a Wiccan who's owned some familiars... they're not demonic in origin (though the Inquisitors and witch hunters tortured people until they gave them stories that they (the witch hunters) liked). They ARE more-or-less ordinary cats and dogs (and any other animal you'd like.)

They are friends and guides and we do have a special bond with them. Think of them more as energy givers (helping you through times of low energy) and "vibe detectors" (they will let you know when someone or something disturbing is around.)

Sounds pretty ordinary, eh -- just what you'd do with a pet you're bonded with. For the Wiccan, that's how it is and it exists on a spiritual level as well. Two of mine came to me after they died and offered some advice and help.

Could the dogs have been familiars? There's a weak possibility. Messengers from someone or something? Only if the land itself has legends about them.

Let me give you an example: If there was a white dog that was doing something like that around here, it would be just Another White Dog. If the white dog was doing it along the Nuuanu highway on Oahu, it MIGHT be Kaupe, the spirit dog of Nuuanu (a demigod/demon who is frequently seen there.)

The park rangers at Volcano National Park in Hawaii frequently see mysterious white dogs. They are avoided VERY respectfully, and anything they seem interested in becomes a point of interest for humans. They are "sendings/manifestations" of the goddess, Pele -- and there's not a person there (no matter how educated) who doesn't believe that it's Pele, watching over them.

True familiars and spirits like that are VERY rare. Remember, dogs can do a lot of roaming in the course of an evening and those are more likely from another area of the neighborhood.

(and lab-type dogs make lousy familiars. They are sweet, but soooooooooooooooooooo dumb!)

I thought about that too..the first time they appeared. I thought ohh, it's just 2 regular dogs wanting food or something. But when they showed up the second time, we were having just about the same conversation as we were the first time. A very good friend of mine told me that someone in my family has to be involved with a very powerful magician. Which noone was, but 2 years prior in a different state..yes someone was involved with a very powerful and skilled magician and we know this for FACT and at that time...we would periodically have run ins with strange dogs and someone told us that they were "listeners". Now I myself do not see how a human could have this kind of power over animals. But after some of the other things I've witnessed in my time with what "people" can do-it wouldn't surprise me one bit. But I also think that magicians are quite capable of "tricking" the mind,therefore who is to know that what you are seeing is actually even real at all??
So now what do you think? You said that you are a wiccan...do you consider yourself good or evil? And if you are good, which I have a feeling you are, would you even begin to know the power of someone working under satan?
I know I'm kind of getting off the original post, but I had ulterior motives for my questioning anyway.

I have to say, that I think the information you provided makes more sense then anything else I've read thus far.
It definately coincides with some of my own personal experiences with the occult and things of that nature. I think that if you hold the power, you can definately use that power on people and so it would make sense that it's even that much easier to use it on animals. I am an avid dog lover and animal lover, and I've worked with animals the majority of my life. And I have felt from certain animals that I was able to kind of "feel" what they were thinking, and I am not a wiccan or powerful person-by far. So that leads me to believe that someone who is, definately possess the power to manipulate a mere animal.
Thank you so much for your very informative post Deep!
You've helped put a few things into perspective

I've heard of them too. TC, NC, and Deep are right on the money. Magestica you said that some of them were good and some were evil in your first post. Here's a little side note related to the topic. I've read about some "ghost stories" in the experiences of Bill Schnoebelen who was deeply involved in the occult for a long time before finally becoming a Christian.
Back when he and his wife were Wiccans they helped some people whose house was haunted by a male and female ghost in their house. The people said that the female ghost was good and she would complain about the bad male ghost. After trying a bunch of stuff the ghosts were still there.
Finally Bill's wife Sharon decided to try something which worked and got rid of the ghosts. When she was a little girl she gave her life to Jesus so she commanded the ghosts to leave in the name of Jesus Christ and they did. As a parting shot the male ghost threw the family's cat into the door. They heard a bang on the door, opened it and there was the poor, terrified cat that acted scared for days after that.
Related to that I was watching Leno or Conan Late Night and Matthew McConnaughey, however you spell that, and he was talking about his new house or mansion and about a female ghost that lived there called "Madam Blue" and she told him there was a male one there too. Same type of situation.

I think this is extremely interesting. I think if they (the dogs) were evil in any way they would come for you when you are alone.

would you of kicked the door the second time if they were yorkshire terriors?

Probably not?? But they weren't so there isn't really any point to what you are asking?? Is there? I only "kicked" the door to shooo them away, for some reason that was the only thing I could think to do at the time. Who knows why we do what we do sometimes? Who knows why the same 2 dogs appeared on two seperate occassions while we were discussing nearly the same thing both times? Who knows? That has to be the question of the decade
Sincerely Magestica

because if they were yorkshire terriors you probably wouldnt of kicked the door because you wouldnt have had the same picture in your mind you did with the dobermans.dobermans have bigger teeth and yorkshire terriers look friendlier and cute.what im trying to ask is do you think your reaction to why you thought they were there the second time would have been any different if they had been less menacing dogs.

ooohhh kaayy... if we are going to share ghost stories and pets, here is mine...

One day I was sitting on my bed in the sun praying with my eyes closed. Our kitten was sleeping on the bed in front of me, I was leaning agianst the wall and the kitten was at my feet.

While I was praying, I forget the topic, I could feel a dark presence rise up in front of me, like a shadow had covered me, I opened my eyes in suprise, and there was the kitten rolling back and forth on the bed, with its eyes still closed, from side to side. It looked like something was trying to get it moving as it was still asleep. It rolled off the bed onto the floor and ran out of the room as fast as it could.

true.....

I suspect my prayers had disturbed something that was residing in the cat, and it just wanted to get out of the place.

Still an ordinary cat though.....

Familiars are just thoughtforms filled with energy and intent... They can be created by a human. I have created one once.

Visualize a form of a person or thing standing in front of you... See all of the details of the person or thing. Fill it up with energy and tell it what to do. done...
You have to believe it is possible though...

I have shared my experience with you and this is what kind of reply I get? What if they had been cats, what if they had been white yorkies? I cannot answer this because well, they weren't! Look the whole idea around "familiars" seems almost absurd to me. But think of it this way, since we are saying "what if"-what if that were YOU and not me there with your friends and family and these same 2 dogs appeared during the SAME type of conversation??? What would YOU have thought? I know for one, you would have said, "now ok, that is really strange"? And that is what I thought too. It really spooked me, and my friends. I am not saying infact they they were familiars, but I've heard a few things about familiars so I figured I'd share my story with you guys and see what you thought? That is all.
And Squintingcat..just so you know, if they had been yorkies both times then yes-as I sit here today and think about it-I would have kicked the door to "shooo" them away. And I by no means think that dobies are "menacing". That is simply your opinion. I personally think after working in vet clinics many years-that if I had to use the word "menacing" to describe a specific breed- it would have to go to these damn "oki" dogs here in okinawa that weigh at the max 20 pounds, I don't think that I or any of my co-workers could have imagined being bit or threatened by any dog as we have with these.