A Reasonable Argument for God's Existence, page 3

reply to post by pintobean

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God does exist but if I even mention it I'm attacked.

I think you are confusing being criticized with being attacked. You are free to believe whatever you want, but if you go around preaching, you have to accept that rational/logical people will question your belief...at least until you provide objective evidence. I know I sound a bit like a Vulcan, but we live in the 21st century and more an more people aren't happy with made up stuff that isn't backed up by objective evidence. A lot of the scientific info available completely contradicts not only Christianity, but a ton of religions...which is why religions have been losing members fast over the past 20yrs.

reply to post by pintobean

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Originally posted by pintobean
God does exist but if I even mention it I'm attacked.

Attacked? You mean you're questioned, right?

America is more anit-Christian than the rest of the world.

Hahahahahahaa....wait, you're serious? America? Anti-Christian? You mean one of the few if not the only first-world country that's trying to get creationism taught in public schools is anti-Christian? The one country that has never had a non-Christian head of state is anti-Christian? The one country that has a 90+% Christian legislature without a similar population demographic is anti-Christian?

If I say UFOs, chemtrails, Planet X then it's believable, but if I suggest there's a supreme being who made everything and Bible prophecy is coming true then it's horrific.

Nope, I'd say those are all not believable. In fact, the supreme being thing? Not a lick of evidence...also not a bit of evidence for Bible prophecy, only post-hoc rationalizations of passages.

That alone should tell you there's some truth to it.

...so there's something to it because people disagree with it? I'm sorry, but that must mean that there's something to randomly raping infants, because more people are against that than anything else.

Besides, if God doesn't exist then I lose nothing. If I'm right and He does exist and this is humanity's last change for repentance; that He gave us free will so we can love Him based on faith alone, then you lose your soul forever.

Two problems there:
1: Pascal's wager is seriously flawed. If you're wrong Zeus could exist and might be pissed that you didn't offer him any sacrifices. So on and so forth for every other religion on the planet. Also, it's not an argument for sincere belief, merely an argument to pretend to con an all-knowing being.

2: The Christian deity doesn't afford free will. You cannot have truly free will in the instance of coercion. Sure, there's a choice, but it's not a free choice.

I'm not selling rosary beeds, cookies, or looking for children to molest. I care about my fellow man and your destiny. I don't want you to hurt. I don't care if that offends you. I'm allowed to care because that's another part of God's free will.

Again, it's not free will. And I'm not offended, I just find what you're pushing to be silly and unsupported.

If you'd just take a chance and say a prayer in Jesus's name asking Him to come into your heart and BELIEVE that's who you're talking to, you'd be suprised

More problems...

3: I already tried that a dozen times.
4: Why must I accept the claim that Jesus not only existed as a historical figure but that all of the Christian claims about him were true before I actually get any evidence?

Originally posted by redhorse

Originally posted by BeenieWeenie

A Reasonable Argument for God's Existence

I've got one...

Platypus

enough said.

If anything, the platypus is evidence in favor of evolution
LINK

Originally posted by MrXYZ

Originally posted by redhorse

Originally posted by BeenieWeenie

A Reasonable Argument for God's Existence

I've got one...

Platypus

enough said.

If anything, the platypus is evidence in favor of evolution
LINK

Yes. I do not believe that evolution and creation are mutually exclusive however. It's all about ones personal belief system at the end of the day.

reply to post by redhorse

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Of course there is a possibility some deity created the universe, but there's ZERO evidence hinting at that. Furthermore, when it comes to religion, science clearly debunks the Christian genesis account, as well as Islam, Hinduism, as well as pretty much every single other religion.

The genesis account in the bible is clearly wrong as there's a ton of parts in it that are factually wrong.

Originally posted by MrXYZ
reply to post by redhorse

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Furthermore, when it comes to religion, science clearly debunks the Christian genesis account, as well as Islam, Hinduism, as well as pretty much every single other religion.

AFAIK hinduism has quite a few different creation myths. I'm not aware how exactly science can e.g. disprove that the Universe isn't in fact the dream of Brahma? Not that I think so, but I find this idea far less ridiculous than the one Abrahamic religions propose with talking snakes and what not. Also at least the hindu got the time scale about right. Same can't be said about any other religion that I'm aware of..

Originally posted by rhinoceros

Originally posted by MrXYZ
reply to post by redhorse

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Furthermore, when it comes to religion, science clearly debunks the Christian genesis account, as well as Islam, Hinduism, as well as pretty much every single other religion.

AFAIK hinduism has quite a few different creation myths. I'm not aware how exactly science can disprove that the Universe isn't in fact the dream of Brahma?

Well, there's ZERO evidence that would suggest it is...so why believe in it? I mean, if you don't think rationally, you could say a giant space turtle farted and created the universe...we also have zero evidence for that, but it's just as valid as the Brahma dream.

The only religion that doesn't seem to contradict science as much is Buddhism imo. And a lot of people claim it isn't really a religion

reply to post by MrXYZ

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Like I said, I don't believe in it. There's no rational reason to do so. However, what you said about science having debunked it is false info.

reply to post by Astyanax

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Er, not quite sure what you mean there. maybe I'm not reading carefully enough. Sorry. Anyhow, this book "Is God a Delusion?" is a response to "The God Delusion" and books like it. I think that if you read it with an open mind, you'll find some very good arguments there. it's logical and well thought out in my opinion.

reply to post by Sundowner

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I've yet to hear of a single argument that is actually a proper response to Dawkins' book...and there are at least a dozen books directly riding that bandwagon. I believe the point that was being made was that you might want to try actually reading The God Delusion before reading a response to it.

reply to post by Sundowner

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Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
I believe the point that was being made was that you might want to try actually reading The God Delusion before reading a response to it.

What the man said.

You will almost certainly find that the book you recommend does not marshal any worthwhile arguments against those proposed in Dawkins's famous book, but is simply a rehash of some well-known Christian tropes.

Faith cannot stand against reason. A well-informed atheist will always win any argument with a believer. If you believe in something that cannot be rationally proven, best hold your faith firmly to yourself and not get into arguments about it. Because after the argument is lost – which it is sure to be – you have only two choices, neither of them pleasant:

1. Stop believing
   
   
2. Go on ‘believing’, knowing you are probably living a lie

Both choices are disturbing, life-changing and potentially dangerous. The first choice is probably the better one, but no believer will accept that it is. If you don't want to have to make the choice, don't get into arguments about what you believe.

Have you read The God Delusion, by the way?

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