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posted on Jan, 21 2011 @ 07:24 PM
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Originally posted by kaya82
here we go again with more truster out right lies
NOBODY in the truth movement supports theories such as no planes!


I would bet my paycheck you are wrong.


www.911hoax.com...
killtown.blogspot.com...

Oh look, two different sites that claim no planes.



Originally posted by kaya82

they are simply saying the os stinks and theres no proof to support it and we need a new investigation


See above. That is not what the "TM" is saying. In fact, some people (not many, but nonetheless) actually claim no victims!
www.septemberclues.info...




Originally posted by kaya82
because there are so many wholes in the os your gunna get a bunch of theories just because every truther doesnt have the same opinion doesnt automatically mean that the os is true as you ppl always love to point out


Ok. Feel free to believe that. It's cool by me.


Originally posted by kaya82

we dont claim they are all right


So which ones are wrong? Then we can ask the no planers who's right. They will have a different answer.



Originally posted by kaya82

wtc complex was a crime scene why was all the forensic evidence from a crime scene so quicky cleaned up with out testing?


What evidence wasn't collected? (PS. Fresh Kills proves you wrong, but that's cool too)


Originally posted by kaya82
why was the metal shipped off so quick with out conducting tests in order for a better understanding for future buildings?


Do you need my entire car to tell me why my seatbelt won't buckle? No. You could have just the two pieces, and you could figure it out.




posted on Jan, 21 2011 @ 07:28 PM
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Originally posted by ANOK

Originally posted by FDNY343
The biggest problem I see with a "new investigation" is that there are so many different fractions of the "Truth" movement. From no planers to CD, to thermite/explosives to plain old thermate to nano-thermite, to DEW and shape-shifing reptiles etc......


Where do you get this from?

You've been here less than a month, and I have yet to see ANYONE in the threads you are involved in talk about any of that stuff.

You really did come here with a closed mind and an agenda, as it's obvious your mind was made up before you even joined.


Did I say here specifically? No, I did not. I said "different fractions of the "Truth" movement." Did I specify ATS? How about David Icke forums? Letsroll.com? No. I did not.

I have been researching the events of September 11th for quite some time. Yes, my mind is made up, as all the actual evidence and facts point towards the commonly held narritive. I also experienced it first hand. I also have an education in a relevant field that helps me make informed, educated opinions.



posted on Jan, 21 2011 @ 10:55 PM
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Originally posted by FDNY343
So, the walls fall IN, and that is how the roof fo Fitterman Hall was hit?

How amazing! Did someone relocate Fitterman into the INTERIOR of 7WTC then move it back out?


Oh dear you are not really paying attention are you.

Other buildings getting hit by debris does not mean the building didn't fall in its own footprint.

PICS AFTER THE EVENT SHOWS IT DID.

Controlled implosion demolition is about getting the majority of the building to fall into its footprint, and seeing as WTC 7 was the tallest building EVER imploded they couldn't have done a better job. How much more 'in its own footprint' would you expect?

Why is that so hard to understand?



posted on Jan, 21 2011 @ 11:04 PM
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Originally posted by FDNY343
Did I say here specifically? No, I did not. I said "different fractions of the "Truth" movement." Did I specify ATS? How about David Icke forums? Letsroll.com? No. I did not.


Then why even mention it? We are not elsewhere, we are on ATS. You are just trying to discredit, not add to the discussion.


I have been researching the events of September 11th for quite some time.


I don't believe you. You have looked at 911myths etc., and taken on board their opinions. You have yet to add anything new, or original, to this discussion, your own research.


I also experienced it first hand. I also have an education in a relevant field that helps me make informed, educated opinions.


If your mind is made up why are you here? Do you have an agenda to set the 'truthers' straight or something?
If you're happy with the OS then why would you care if others are not, especially if you believe we're a bunch of dangerous cranks?

You experienced what first hand?

Hmmm, again I don't believe you are educated in any field that helps your argument. Like most debunkers you make the most obvious mistakes in your understanding of basic physics.

Lots of people come here and claim to be engineers etc., and it is obvious from what they type that they're not.
edit on 1/21/2011 by ANOK because: typo



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 10:35 AM
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Originally posted by Alfie1
reply to post by kaya82
 


You say that " NOBODY in the truth movement supports theories such as no planes ." but you are kidding right ?

There are 4 or 5 threads just on page 1 about that ; e.g It is scientificaly impossible that a plane hit the Pentagon, Where did aircraft wreckage come from, Evidence no plane crashed at Shanksville, No plane at the WTC.

It is no good pretending that there is some sort of logical combined truther front because it is obvious that there isn't.

i ment no planes at the wtc as there is video evidence of this (the type of planes that hit is debatable)
a boeing did not imo hit the pentagon or shanksville



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 10:38 AM
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Originally posted by ANOK

Originally posted by FDNY343
So, the walls fall IN, and that is how the roof fo Fitterman Hall was hit?

How amazing! Did someone relocate Fitterman into the INTERIOR of 7WTC then move it back out?


Oh dear you are not really paying attention are you.

Other buildings getting hit by debris does not mean the building didn't fall in its own footprint.

PICS AFTER THE EVENT SHOWS IT DID.

Controlled implosion demolition is about getting the majority of the building to fall into its footprint, and seeing as WTC 7 was the tallest building EVER imploded they couldn't have done a better job. How much more 'in its own footprint' would you expect?

Why is that so hard to understand?


I'm sorry that you are having a hard time with this.

How does a building that hit 3 OTHER buildings, on 3 DIFFERENT sides, fall into it's own footprint?

It doesn't. Only people who claim that, are "Truthers". Specifically the dolts at AE911T.



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 10:41 AM
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Originally posted by FDNY343

Originally posted by kaya82
here we go again with more truster out right lies
NOBODY in the truth movement supports theories such as no planes!


I would bet my paycheck you are wrong.


www.911hoax.com...
killtown.blogspot.com...

Oh look, two different sites that claim no planes.



Originally posted by kaya82

they are simply saying the os stinks and theres no proof to support it and we need a new investigation


See above. That is not what the "TM" is saying. In fact, some people (not many, but nonetheless) actually claim no victims!
www.septemberclues.info...




Originally posted by kaya82
because there are so many wholes in the os your gunna get a bunch of theories just because every truther doesnt have the same opinion doesnt automatically mean that the os is true as you ppl always love to point out


Ok. Feel free to believe that. It's cool by me.


Originally posted by kaya82

we dont claim they are all right


So which ones are wrong? Then we can ask the no planers who's right. They will have a different answer.



Originally posted by kaya82

wtc complex was a crime scene why was all the forensic evidence from a crime scene so quicky cleaned up with out testing?


What evidence wasn't collected? (PS. Fresh Kills proves you wrong, but that's cool too)


Originally posted by kaya82
why was the metal shipped off so quick with out conducting tests in order for a better understanding for future buildings?


Do you need my entire car to tell me why my seatbelt won't buckle? No. You could have just the two pieces, and you could figure it out.
ill feel free to believe what ever i want i dont need your aproval thanks
we know planes hit the wtc as we have video evidence i was talking about the TM doesnt support holograms or cgi crap and theres zero evidence a boeing hit the pentagon or shanksville

oh right so a plane crashes but you only need a few pieces of it to understand what happened?? lol lol

like anok has asked you debunkers many times you believe the os so why do you come on here? your never going to convince us other wise but you lot will never answer that question always seem to go quiet



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 10:44 AM
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Originally posted by ANOK
Then why even mention it? We are not elsewhere, we are on ATS. You are just trying to discredit, not add to the discussion.


Because I asked if there would be different investigations as to different viewpoints.


Originally posted by ANOK
If your mind is made up why are you here?


Because I enjoy discussing the events of September 11th. Specifically, the CTs that go along with it.


Originally posted by ANOK
Do you have an agenda to set the 'truthers' straight or something?


Nope, just enjoy proving truthers like Phil Jayden wrong.


Originally posted by ANOK
If you're happy with the OS then why would you care if others are not, especially if you believe we're a bunch of dangerous cranks?


Did I ever claim that? No, I most certainly did not. Don't put words into my mouth.


Originally posted by ANOK
You experienced what first hand?


The entire days' events.


Originally posted by ANOK
Hmmm, again I don't believe you are educated in any field that helps your argument. Like most debunkers you make the most obvious mistakes in your understanding of basic physics.


Maybe you can school me using math. I would love to see your math. Go it?


Originally posted by ANOK
Lots of people come here and claim to be engineers etc., and it is obvious from what they type that they're not.


I am sure people do. How does that effect my position? None whatsoever.



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 10:45 AM
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Originally posted by kaya82

Originally posted by Alfie1
reply to post by kaya82
 


You say that " NOBODY in the truth movement supports theories such as no planes ." but you are kidding right ?

There are 4 or 5 threads just on page 1 about that ; e.g It is scientificaly impossible that a plane hit the Pentagon, Where did aircraft wreckage come from, Evidence no plane crashed at Shanksville, No plane at the WTC.

It is no good pretending that there is some sort of logical combined truther front because it is obvious that there isn't.

i ment no planes at the wtc as there is video evidence of this (the type of planes that hit is debatable)
a boeing did not imo hit the pentagon or shanksville


And I showed you were absolutely wrong about that.



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 10:48 AM
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Originally posted by kaya82

Originally posted by FDNY343

Originally posted by kaya82
here we go again with more truster out right lies
NOBODY in the truth movement supports theories such as no planes!


I would bet my paycheck you are wrong.


www.911hoax.com...
killtown.blogspot.com...

Oh look, two different sites that claim no planes.



Originally posted by kaya82

they are simply saying the os stinks and theres no proof to support it and we need a new investigation


See above. That is not what the "TM" is saying. In fact, some people (not many, but nonetheless) actually claim no victims!
www.septemberclues.info...




Originally posted by kaya82
because there are so many wholes in the os your gunna get a bunch of theories just because every truther doesnt have the same opinion doesnt automatically mean that the os is true as you ppl always love to point out


Ok. Feel free to believe that. It's cool by me.


Originally posted by kaya82

we dont claim they are all right


So which ones are wrong? Then we can ask the no planers who's right. They will have a different answer.



Originally posted by kaya82

wtc complex was a crime scene why was all the forensic evidence from a crime scene so quicky cleaned up with out testing?


What evidence wasn't collected? (PS. Fresh Kills proves you wrong, but that's cool too)


Originally posted by kaya82
why was the metal shipped off so quick with out conducting tests in order for a better understanding for future buildings?


Do you need my entire car to tell me why my seatbelt won't buckle? No. You could have just the two pieces, and you could figure it out.
ill feel free to believe what ever i want i dont need your aproval thanks
we know planes hit the wtc as we have video evidence i was talking about the TM doesnt support holograms or cgi crap and theres zero evidence a boeing hit the pentagon or shanksville

oh right so a plane crashes but you only need a few pieces of it to understand what happened?? lol lol

like anok has asked you debunkers many times you believe the os so why do you come on here? your never going to convince us other wise but you lot will never answer that question always seem to go quiet


You're correct, you do not need my approval.

Would you care to actually address the rest of my post?

PS. You're still wrong about the TM not believing in holograms and DEW's at GZ. I linked you two different sources.

No, we do not need the entire plane to know that 19 terrorists hijacked it and crashed it. We have radar tracks showing it, we have eyewitness phone calls from aboard the plane, we have DNA, and in some cases, the FDR and CVR showing what happened.



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 10:58 AM
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Originally posted by FDNY343

Originally posted by kaya82

Originally posted by Alfie1
reply to post by kaya82
 


You say that " NOBODY in the truth movement supports theories such as no planes ." but you are kidding right ?

There are 4 or 5 threads just on page 1 about that ; e.g It is scientificaly impossible that a plane hit the Pentagon, Where did aircraft wreckage come from, Evidence no plane crashed at Shanksville, No plane at the WTC.

It is no good pretending that there is some sort of logical combined truther front because it is obvious that there isn't.

i ment no planes at the wtc as there is video evidence of this (the type of planes that hit is debatable)
a boeing did not imo hit the pentagon or shanksville


And I showed you were absolutely wrong about that.

they are not part of the truth movement



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 11:29 AM
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Originally posted by kaya82
they are not part of the truth movement

Huh? So they're part of some other movement?

www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.democraticunderground.com...

Two more links.

Who are you to say they aren't?

That is the BIGGEST problem I see as far as this new investigation is concerned. Too many competing theories.



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 12:00 PM
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you say you was there on 9/11?

are you a fire fighter? just going off your username?



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 01:47 PM
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Originally posted by kaya82
you say you was there on 9/11?

are you a fire fighter? just going off your username?



Yes, among other things. I also teach at the college level.



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 02:23 PM
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reply to post by FDNY343
 




That is the BIGGEST problem I see as far as this new investigation is concerned. Too many competing theories.


That is where the role of scientific based forensic analysis comes in to observe, hypothesise, test and either confirm or reassess the evidence. Out of all the theories put forth so far, the planes flying into WTC 1 & 2 and the use of nanothermite in WTC 1, 2 & 7 to bring the building down is the only one I consider as being confirmed, you are free to draw your own conclusions. These procedures and processes are not new to the legal community, however considering the size of this case may take a little longer to perform. It is up to the new investigation to decide if they will use their own independent experts, or draw on the body of knowledge from the community for questioning to ascertain the facts. The two main competing scientific factions are NIST and Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth. The new investigation may want to bring in its own independent experts to ascertain the validity between the competing arguments, but that is a decision for the investigation to decide.

The biggest problem I see with a new investigation is the conflict of interest that can develop when a state investigates its self. The results of the first 9/11 commission is testament to this as many important questions went unanswered. For example, none of the many questions involving the collapse of WTC 7 was addressed by the 9/11 commission. There are many other unanswered questions remaining. This is why I advocate for international oversight to a new investigation so an independent verdict can help restore justice to this horrendous crime.



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 03:55 PM
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Originally posted by gr82m8okdok

My point is, if it IS that secure and controlled, how did a Boeing 757 even get close enough to the Pentagon without being shot down.


Shot down by what exactly, and you do not even realise how close a airport is to the Pentagon, and how close planes normally fly to the Pentagon!



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 04:01 PM
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Originally posted by kwakakev
his younger brother Marvin was in charge of security at the towers


Why do truthers keep repeating that lie? He was NOT in charge of security at the towers, in fact he had nothing to do with the towers on 9/11.

This is one reason the truther movement is treated with ridicule, they have to tell blatant lies.



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 04:23 PM
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Originally posted by kwakakev
Wikileaks has demonstrated this by kicking out Prime Minister Kevin Rudd when he went against US homogeneity.


What a lot of rubbish - wikileaks did not kick out Krudd, he was knifed in the back by his own party for being incompetent


I consider the CIA is the prime suspect behind the removal of another Prime Minister Gough Whitlam


Whitlam was removed because he was the most incompetent PM, and had the most corrupt cabinet Australia ever had. The fact that he was not returned to power when the people could have put him back in, and he lost with a landslide shows the Australian people also thought him incompetent.



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 06:36 PM
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Originally posted by FDNY343
PS. You're still wrong about the TM not believing in holograms and DEW's at GZ. I linked you two different sources.


Who do you think speaks officially for the "truth movement"?

Anyone and everyone?



posted on Jan, 22 2011 @ 07:08 PM
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I would like to see another independent study done of the WTC dust sample to see if any other scientists find the same results. If another group of scientist discovers the same particles as Jones’ did and summit their work for peer review, it will put an end to the slandering lies about Jones peer reviewed Journal and even the Trusters will have no choice but to accept it and if they accept the finding of na-nothermite, they will have no choice but to except demolition on all three WTC, and once that is accepted you all will have to except in side job.




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