I am Cool if I don't believe in God

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by Cosmic.Artifact
I am questioning your 'intent' in bashing Creationist... or religious peoples in general.

Creationists are demanding equal time in science classrooms in school.

Do you not see the inherent problem with this?

not really, it sounds like some equality issue which possibly would have never even arisen if Religious people were not attacked in the first place... they must be using the rules or fighting fire with fire.

btw which version of creationism are they trying to teach in school ? the Muslim/Christian/Taoist/Buddhist or the Hindu version ect... or do the Creationist want to teach the Scientific version of it ?

Buddism is a religion, yet they are not requesting time in a science classroom to discuss their ideas on the origins of earth..why?

that is interesting... maybe they will just make us deal with our own crap by pouring gas on themselves and then lighting the torch... It is kind of their tradition to have nonviolent resistance or no involvement at all.

This means it is not religion that is being attacked overall...its passing the story of creation on in a equal light as something that has been tirelessly examined, refined, and continues to be examined and refined.

well maybe creation should be taught in a different class or just later on all together, it is a beautiful story too and heavy on philosophy. Children (no matter what ethnicity) seem to have a sense of God all on their own, it takes awhile before they realize how they came about from their parents.

My religion has a different view on math. It is said that 1+1=2, however, my religion dictates it is actually 3, because the holy number is in all couplings...therefore, my mathmatical religion should be given equal time with standard math.
Do you agree with this?

well that depends if it is logical and received as logical by the majority and then to be accepted. Was this religion of math already taught in schools and then removed via relentless vampires seeking monetary gain through a lawsuit ?

reply to post by Cosmic.Artifact


LOL this guy is either a troll, or someone who is pissed at the fact that the majority of people on here do not share his religious views. Get over it buddy!

Originally posted by Cosmic.Artifact

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by Cosmic.Artifact
I am questioning your 'intent' in bashing Creationist... or religious peoples in general.

Creationists are demanding equal time in science classrooms in school.

Do you not see the inherent problem with this?

not really, it sounds like some equality issue which possibly would have never even arisen if Religious people were not attacked in the first place... they must be using the rules or fighting fire with fire.

religion is attacked the day someone tried to understand why it got cold in some months, and warm in other months without it being attributed to a deitys favor or anger.
religion crumbles when people investigate what is going on behind the curtain of the great wizard of Oz.

if thats an attack, then oh well..

btw which version of creationism are they trying to teach in school ?

Thats just it...which story is a good story to tell...now the people whom are making the biggest noise about it in America are of course the biblical creationists...6 days, everything sprung all at once, mudman and ribwoman, etc..however, they are pretending to guise it in "intelligent design"...but its all the same...the god of abraham

the Muslim/Christian/Taoist/Buddhist or the Hindu version ect... or do the Creationist want to teach the Scientific version of it ?

There is -no- scientific version of creationism..."Magic happened" is not science..

Buddism is a religion, yet they are not requesting time in a science classroom to discuss their ideas on the origins of earth..why?

that is interesting... maybe they will just make us deal with out own crap or they will pour gas on them selves an light the torch.

that made no sense

This means it is not religion that is being attacked overall...its passing the story of creation on in a equal light as something that has been tirelessly examined, refined, and continues to be examined and refined.

well maybe creation should be taught in a different class

It is, its called Theology. Also christian schools have elective classes for religion. I am fine with that, its in its context...the problem is, they want it taught...equally...with science...not a single scrap of evidence for creationism, yet they want it smashed right next to science class

or just later on all together, it is a beautiful story too and heavy on philosophy.

a magic man grabbing glop and slapping it together is beautiful?

Children (no matter what ethnicity) seem to have a sense of God all on their own, it takes awhile before they realize how they came about from their parents.

Children think they can fly also after watching superman...gravity laughs at their attempt

My religion has a different view on math. It is said that 1+1=2, however, my religion dictates it is actually 3, because the holy number is in all couplings...therefore, my mathmatical religion should be given equal time with standard math.
Do you agree with this?

well that depends if it is logical and received as logical by the majority and then to be accepted. Was this religion of math already taught in schools and then removed via relentless vampires seeking monetary gain through a lawsuit ?

Its about as logical as creationism...a nice philosophy devoid of any evidence or factual standing..I am sure if I spin it enough, I can get the 100 and below IQs to buy it as some sort of universal truth...does that mean it will be great for society, or will just screw up physics and technological progression when trying to measure things.

And there is -no- monitary gain in trying to get science kept to science class, or removing giant crusifixes in courtrooms...it is done often at the expense of the person making the lawsuit. Tax dollars spent shoving religious ideals on people in public, and a few people standing up against the ancient relic of control to try and make America the land for any and all thinking without favoritism.

whatever...hey, religion is 85% of the world...I guess your thinking is simply "normal" and average for the days age. I got a friend whom said anything that goes against the norm is weird...therefore you must wear your clothes by what people are wearing now, listen only to top 40s, etc etc etc. He and I disagree on alot of things, and I am sure he thinks he is right in following lock step with the majority. I personally think that is being bland and unremarkable. Majority thinking is herd thinking..unquestioning, and rebellious towards anything that goes against the norm.
Congratulations on being so...normal

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Thats just it...which story is a good story to tell...now the people whom are making the biggest noise about it in America are of course the biblical creationists...6 days, everything sprung all at once, mudman and ribwoman, etc..however, they are pretending to guise it in "intelligent design"...but its all the same...the god of abraham

that's just it, they should teach them all then... the philosophy. Teaching evolution as a religion in school is not wise because it does not teach morals and after several generations of this only one could imagine what kind of world this would be... take a look around you, and at the news, you get Columbine and VaTech when 'kids' are walking around thinking they are their own God (this is a little excessive) but kids 'will' eventually perceive it this way.

no boundries, no rules, degrading family values, crackhead parents, parents who have not made it through even high school.

There must be some control always... even if some (as adults) feel they do not need it.

off topic:
hey man can I ask you why some go off and start calling you names or trying to make you made if you do not answer them or just ignore them, what's that all about ?

Kids today I tell ya !

reply to post by Cosmic.Artifact

Originally posted by Cosmic.Artifact
not really, it sounds like some equality issue which possibly would have never even arisen if Religious people were not attacked in the first place... they must be using the rules or fighting fire with fire.

...it's not an equal issue. Science isn't an equal issue. We aren't giving equal time to geocentrism, flat earthism, or Lamarckian evolution.

And religious people weren't attacked. They just lost the special privilege they used to have of being able to force their religion upon children.

btw which version of creationism are they trying to teach in school ? the Muslim/Christian/Taoist/Buddhist or the Hindu version ect... or do the Creationist want to teach the Scientific version of it ?

...there's no such thing as a scientific form of creationism.

well maybe creation should be taught in a different class or just later on all together, it is a beautiful story too and heavy on philosophy. Children (no matter what ethnicity) seem to have a sense of God all on their own, it takes awhile before they realize how they came about from their parents.

Um, it can be taught in a mythology class with all the other stories. And children don't have a sense of gods without their parents intervention. It's something that you're most assuredly not born with.

well that depends if it is logical and received as logical by the majority and then to be accepted.

...the truth is not democratic. Science and mathematics are based on a tyranny of evidence. Science is true whether or not people accept it. You cannot base education on the whims of a populace that is unfortunately ignorant of actual science and mathematics.

Was this religion of math already taught in schools and then removed via relentless vampires seeking monetary gain through a lawsuit ?

Blatant ad hominem attacks! Please, demonstrate that the people that removed the ignorance of creationism from school were 'relentless vampires seeking monetary gain'. Hell, prove that they gained money.

You do realize that it was actually removed thanks to...the law. Because teaching religion in school is illegal in the USA. It's also immoral to teach children

It is very self evident that it is not in our nature to be kind to eachother as huumans, but exactly the opposite.

reply to post by Cosmic.Artifact


I do not bash religious people in general. Most of my friends are religious. Two of my closest friends, who I consider to be like brothers, are incredibly devout, one was recently considering becoming a priest. Crazy thing, neither of them is a creationist.

And I don't really have a problem with creationists as people, I just have a problem with their specific belief. It's a silly, easily disproven belief with more holes in it than...something with a lot of holes in it. It flies in the face of reason and evidence. I'm not bashing the people, I'm attacking the belief.

Creationists themselves tend to be no less lovely as people than anyone else, it's just in this one area where I have a problem.

Oh, and I did point out in my thread on creationists being ignorant that it refers to a specific ignorance of science. You could still be a brilliant concert pianist and be ignorant of science. Sadly, plenty of people are ignorant of science. Creationists just take that ignorance to a different level.

Originally posted by SaturnFX

that made no sense

you really must Robin Williams live on Broadway all the way through I guess to get this.

sorry I think sometimes everyone likes comedy...

www.youtube.com...

Originally posted by Cosmic.Artifact

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Thats just it...which story is a good story to tell...now the people whom are making the biggest noise about it in America are of course the biblical creationists...6 days, everything sprung all at once, mudman and ribwoman, etc..however, they are pretending to guise it in "intelligent design"...but its all the same...the god of abraham

that's just it, they should teach them all then... the philosophy.

I think I read sometime back there was just shy of 2500 different creation stories mapped throughout history, from the wicker basket theory, to the turtle on the back of an elephant standing on snakes. The reeds at night, the jewels of the goddess twinkling in the night, the starseed. the mudman and ribwoman, the great pig that dug up the manroot, the etc etc etc. If you gave each theory just a day in class, that would basically account for the entire schoolastic career of a student..aka, it would be theology class, never having time for actual science.

The philosophies of the religions combined doesn't work either.
Earth is a school of the soul, life is an illusion, earth is heaven, earth is hell, Life is to feel and experience pain, or pleasure, life is a curse that you must break free from else reincarnate eternally, life is a series of temptations that tempt you for the ultimate test of your immortal soul. Life is to serve the pharoah and allow through service the pharoah to enjoy an afterlife. life is...etc (endless philosophies).

Again, theology and philosophy class covers this just fine...its NOT SCIENCE!

Teaching evolution as a religion in school is not wise because it does not teach morals and after several generations of this only one could imagine what kind of world this would be... take a look around you, and at the news, you get Columbine and VaTech when 'kids' are walking around thinking they are their own God (this is a little excessive) but kids 'will' eventually perceive it this way.

Evolution is about as religious as mechanical engineering or astronomical calculating of star drift. just because it goes against other religions of the world, does not make it another religion. A flat earth goes against biblical statements...but for some reason, the creationists aren't screaming that a sphere earth is a religious lie...it simply is. its verifiable to anyone with some pocket money and a airplane ticket.

Religion's biggest problem is when they try to delve into science...they don't, they can't, and need to stick to simple philosophical "why am I here" discussions verses try and explain the science of "how I am here"...but nope...religious organizations are defending to their last breath a flat earth/earth is the center of the galaxy mentality.

no boundries, no rules, degrading family values, crackhead parents, parents who have not made it through even high school.

Spend a bit of time in jail...you will find almost no atheists in there. Sorry, but the biggest crackheads and criminals are actually the ones that believe all they got to do is ask a deity for forgivness and tada, no crime.

Nice false argument though...but absolutely untrue...the exact opposite of reality.

There must be some control always... even if some (as adults) feel they do not need it.

off topic:
hey man can I ask you why some go off and start calling you names or trying to make you made if you do not answer them or just ignore them, what's that all about ?

Kids today I tell ya !

Not sure what your talking about. If people call me names, I tend to ignore that nonsense...if someone percieves me insulting them as a person, typically they are mistaken me slamming an idea for them as a person.

Nobody knows me as a person, and I do not know anyone as a person...hell, some of my most arch nemesis RL people I disagree with are actually pretty good friends. People have dumb ideas (myself included) and should be called out on it for some respectful but strong debate if the people are mature enough to handle it.

The net...meh...text is a very poor portrayer of emotion behind the words, so its pointless to take anything beyond face value.

Originally posted by Cosmic.Artifact

Originally posted by Killface
The vox? Ha ha, this isn't rap, you mean vocals? If you think those vocals need to go, you are not much of a metal fan.

from Cookie Monster to Screaming Banshee yes I would say they have to go... I left the cookie monster Vox style back sometime right after high school. There is alot of great Metal out there that is very heavy, actually heavier than what you posted and one can actually make out the lyrics... you see Lyrics make Metal heavy, not just the slamming riffs.

I don't think anybody going to a Suicide Silence show is getting any sort of reverse psychology. Have you been to a metal show

you wouldn't know how many shows I been to, The majority attending have not yet been released from school just as possibly you have not just by asking me this question. (it gives a rough idea of your age in other words)

I love how you avoid all the points I made in my post and focused on the fan base in the music I added to the post in jest...

hey I love Metal and can not stand Rap... you posted it and I was intrigued figuring it more worthy of a response.

keep up the good work

Hmm, so you are saying the whole genre of death metal has to go, just because you can't understand the words? (The high-low scream is one of the staples in death metal) Some metal-head you are...

You are kidding me right? You are saying school children are the majority of the crowd at a metal show, and by asking about shows, I am a school child? Worst. Logic. Ever. Most metal shows are 18+ or 21+ ... no school children present. (Not to mention I don't see where age comes to play in this? Are you implying older = smarter? Are you trying to present me as young as some sort of insult or "burn"? )
I am 22.

The reason I said "were not talking rap" was the use of the "word" "vox". I haven't heard that word used by anyone older than 14 unless it was hip-hop related. Work on understanding context and things like this wont slip by you next time.

You still ignore all my points that were on topic, you say you want to open productive discussion, but you ignore people who present you with questions you can not answer.

Originally posted by SaturnFX
does that mean it will be great for society.

imo yes.

And there is -no- monitary gain in trying to get science kept to science class,

the monetary gain comes from the opposite party suing everything in site that they disagree with. Science is science, kids are self aware it would seem not long after birth that there is a God (try explaining that one)

or removing giant crusifixes in courtrooms...

I have never seen a cross in a courtroom, but of course I was born mid 70's so...

whatever...hey, religion is 85% of the world...

and the numbers are rising all the time, regardless of the sect... In all actruallity I think the numbers would be closer to 99% of the world and the last 1% would be the newborns who have not quite come of age yet, afterall everyone has a conscience.

I guess your thinking is simply "normal" and average for the days age.

yes Religion is normal, and almost automatically imprinted at birth thanks to millennia of advantage over science one could say it has evolved with us and may even be part of our genes by now. Something that will be very hard to separate from mankind of all nations... the naysayers have a huge job ahead of them and a few thousand years to go.

I got a friend whom said anything that goes against the norm is weird...therefore you must wear your clothes by what people are wearing now, listen only to top 40s, etc etc etc. He and I disagree on alot of things, and I am sure he thinks he is right in following lock step with the majority. I personally think that is being bland and unremarkable. Majority thinking is herd thinking..unquestioning, and rebellious towards anything that goes against the norm.
Congratulations on being so...normal

thanks I finally made it !

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
reply to post by Cosmic.Artifact

 

I do not bash religious people in general. Most of my friends are religious. Two of my closest friends, who I consider to be like brothers, are incredibly devout, one was recently considering becoming a priest. Crazy thing, neither of them is a creationist.

And I don't really have a problem with creationists as people

well that's cool, so you might understand where I am coming from then, I am not devout as you say one of your friends are but I still believe in a higher being and I have my own reasons just as your friends may have their reasons. One could even say that having creationist around keeps the big mystery alive, you know our quest for knowledge and understanding comes directly from this and has given birth to science.

Originally posted by Cosmic.Artifact
kids are self aware it would seem not long after birth that there is a God (try explaining that one)

They believe also in santa...both come from the same source
babies are athiest, they are then conditioned by their parents/guardians on how to think...
Santa, God, etc..

or removing giant crusifixes in courtrooms...

I have never seen a cross in a courtroom, but of course I was born mid 70's so...

10 commandments, other type religious items in a tax dollar supported place is the point..and again, a successful lawsuit gets no money..just the offending items removed

whatever...hey, religion is 85% of the world...

and the numbers are rising all the time, regardless of the sect... In all actruallity I think the numbers would be closer to 99% of the world and the last 1% would be the newborns who have not quite come of age yet, afterall everyone has a conscience.

No, it is currently at 85%, and the numbers are actually dwindling from established religion, rising into new age type sub-faith style. Of course, islam is rising quickly, but thats because they keep having frikkin babies like a rabbit in theocratic nations

... the naysayers have a huge job ahead of them and a few thousand years to go.

It is hoped that religion will be ultimately the minority in 100 years or less, to be replaced with agnostic or general spirituality. Call it an observable trend growing and speeding up with the help of the internet (try shutting this down vatican pukes!)


Incidently, its always been normal for the herd to be easily led. Normal is not necessarily a good thing.

Originally posted by Killface
Hmm, so you are saying the whole genre of death metal has to go,

obviously you may not understand our slang... in otherwords, it s*cks ! do what you will with it I don't care really, they will not last.

just because you can't understand the words? (The high-low scream is one of the staples in death metal) Some metal-head you are...

I didn't have to understand the words, you posted them for us... how else was you going to get his age old recycled message across to us ? I am a Metal-Head that actually has taste in music, I have played guitar since I was 13 years old.

You are kidding me right? You are saying school children are the majority of the crowd at a metal show,

yes I have been to tons of all ages shows, try taking a look at peoples hands next time you are at a show, that stamp they are wearing means it is all ages. I also said (school kids or not long out of school) just as you are.

Are you implying older = smarter?

very directly 'Yes' (with age comes wisdom) love that saying but of course it does not apply to all.

Are you trying to present me as young as some sort of insult or "burn"?

no it was just an observation, pretty good one I may add also.

I am 22.

and you are acting like it...

The reason I said "were not talking rap" was the use of the "word" "vox". I haven't heard that word used by anyone older than 14 unless it was hip-hop related.

do you live in America ? some must not be so in-tune with the scene as they wish to think, and imo the new scene is kind of weak, just as the lyrics are in the video you posted.

Work on understanding context and things like this wont slip by you next time.

mkay... I knew it all once too.

You still ignore all my points that were on topic, you say you want to open productive discussion, but you ignore people who present you with questions you can not answer.

where am I ignoring you ? I'm sorry... would you like a cookie !

Vox is a shortened for Vocals, across all genres that is not proper or POP music.

some just haven't been around long enough to see rap steal all the jargon from those who went before... there are tons of samples and even out right stealing of old rock & roll and even metal, this is one of the main reasons I despise Rap music, not much of it is original at all.

VOX, something way before either of our time.

take your pic, I give the first one that comes up in a google search...

there is nothing 'New' under the sun !

Originally posted by SaturnFX

They believe also in santa...both come from the same source
babies are athiest, they are then conditioned by their parents/guardians on how to think...
Santa, God, etc..

I highly doubt this, what about kids who do not celebrate Christmas or on the other side of the planet ?
oh I see, they are conditioned eh ? yes it is a conspiracy... then explain where conscience comes from ?

10 commandments, other type religious items in a tax dollar supported place is the point..and again, a successful lawsuit gets no money..just the offending items removed

ok well since you made a mistake then you may still have time to edit your post, and then also change the whole discourse after that...

No, it is currently at 85%, and the numbers are actually dwindling from established religion, rising into new age type sub-faith style. Of course, islam is rising quickly, but thats because they keep having frikkin babies like a rabbit in theocratic nations

from the data I was looking at and I think it came right off Wiki 'possibly one of your favorite sources... says there is only 2% undecided.

It is hoped that religion will be ultimately the minority in 100 years or less,

mkay... sadly either one of us will be around to see this theory proven fact, still I highly doubt it.

the Herd is called success

I would like to take this moment to thank 'madnessinmysoul' as I have adopted his posting style... as I have said there is nothing new under the sun, I am just trying to figure out where I get the freakin (dots) from...

uggh ! can't help it

Originally posted by etherical waterwave
reply to post by Cosmic.Artifact

 

It's a fact if you dont believe in love you don't believe in Lord JHVH, God.

Are you cool for not having joy, kindness and self-control.

edit on 2010/12/16 by etherical waterwave because: (no reason given)

how can I answer this without using a one-liner ?

but my answer would be 'No'

(love is all you need)

Originally posted by etherical waterwave
Evolution does not replace God! Right!

First of all, I said it before, there must be creation first for it to evolve. We come out of the earth. Our lifeforce is love. See you can't get the picture. There is a missing link. God! Thus, I have spoken.. fun fun

I believe !



the full length unedited album version is tons better

reply to post by Cosmic.Artifact

I have stated in another post that I have not seen evolution proven in a petri dish and that is what the majority of the worlds population needs to see also because the majority are not scientist.

Nobody, except your biology teacher in school, is obliged to explain evolution to you, or to the majority of the world's population. Science is not done to edify the masses. It is enough that they enjoy the benefits of science; there is no need for them to understand it.

If you don't understand evolution, or aren't convinced of it, perhaps it is because the subject is simply too difficult for you. I suggest you forget about it, and interest yourself in something you can understand instead.

I (believe) in evolution "something unseen" just as I (believe) in God, which is also "something unseen"

If you think evolution demands belief, or that it is 'something unseen', you definitely don't understand it.

and by the way a certain group pushes evolution it would almost seem as it too is a religion...

It also seems, to the uneducated mind, that the Sun goes round the Earth.