Greetings, sons of Heimdall!

How on Earth Nazism could (and still) use the Norse religion to their advantage in their attempts at conspiring against the human kind and ”solving the Jewish Problem” is a riddle to me, because the ancient Norse people were all “sons of Heimdall”, and Heimdall, is just another name for Noach in my opinion. Shem was called Jarl (“Earl”), Ham was called Trell (“Slave”) and Japhet was called Karl (“Man”). Heimdall may mean “Light of the World” or the “Fairest Æs” (god).

Though the names are completely different on the surface, the stories’ close resemblance to the Hebrew tradition becomes quite clear when you investigate the stories closer. First off, Heimdall guarded the bridge “Rimfrost” also called the “Rainbow-Bridge”, which was the only crossing between the “World of the gods” and the “World of the humans”. The bridge was shaped like the rainbow, and seeing how the bridge always moved and could be seen over the highest mountains, shows us that Rimfrost was infact the rainbow itself, and also includes elements of the Beresjit Flood and the Ark of Noach.

Seeing how Beresjit (Genesis) explains how God put the rainbow in the sky after the Flood to be a sign that God wouldn’t destroy the whole world with water for as long as the rainbow would exist, and how the Tanakh’s (Biblical) rainbow with the waters under it was also a divide of the aeons before the Flood when the gods (“sons of God”) walked the Earth and the “Age of Man” – the aeons after the Flood. Every time anyone came close to the bridge, Heimdall lifted his trumpet, “Hjallarhodn” and blew “Hjallarljod” a signal which will also be blown at the advent of “Ragnarok” – the terrible Harmagheddon of the Norse.

Rimfrost thereby has the elements of the Ark of Noach in the shape of a bridge/water-crossing between the gods and the humans, as a stronghold over water and in the shape of a rainbow. Also, his three sons, Trell, Karl and Jarl are directly linked to Noach’s three sons. Trell was black like Ham, and like Kanaan, Ham’s son, he was the slave of his brothers, Trell would be the slave of his brothers. Karl was a farmer and Jarl was on top of the food chain, father of kings and the noble.

Heimdall was also the æs (god) who helped Tor to retrieve his hammer “Mjolnir” when Trym stole it. Tor resembles the word for Law in Hebrew, Torah, and his hammer was used to judge, and it sparked electric lightning, like the Ark of Covenant, or Aaron ha-Berit, and the Torah (Law) inside was a tool of judgement, and possibly also acted as a static weapon capable of storing high amounts of electricity. Thus Tor would probably be Aaron or even Mosjeh (Moses). Tora is also an ancient Norse girls’ name. The Norse had a version of the Ten Commandments, which are more or less identical to the ten commandments of the Torah. The first people on Earth were called Ask (Adam) and Embla (Eve), see how the names start with the same letter even. Also, Yggdrasil, the “World Tree” even has a serpent in it, called Nidhogg. And the old Futhark (oldest Norse “alfabet”) not only resembles ancient Hebrew scripts in shapes, but there were even 22 letters in it, just like in the Hebrew Alef-beth. And seeing how one of the most common and holiest names of the highest Norse god is “Allfadr”, or “Father of All” (compare this with Abraham’s name which means “Father of Many”), and how Odin was hung upon a tree and was cut with a spear so he would stay awake, gaining him the 22 letters of the Elder Futhark, which bears clear resemblance to Jesjuah and the crucifixion. This together with a well of other similarities can’t simply be coincidences.

Originally posted by Neo Christian Mystic
How on Earth Nazism could (and still) use the Norse religion to their advantage in their attempts at conspiring against the human kind and ”solving the Jewish Problem” is a riddle to me, because the ancient Norse people were all “sons of Heimdall”, and Heimdall, is just another name for Noach in my opinion.

But not in THEIR opinion. And if you look into it closely, there's no real match between the gods and Biblical figures you mention (Noah doesn't have three wives and nine mothers, as a quick example.)

The lack of parallels strongly shows another origins for the proto-Germanic and Nordic myths (we have a lot of information on religions that are derived from another religion.) In any case, members of a sect which believes its religion is the ONLY right way tend to be people who will demonize and torture and kill people of other religions.

The Nordic beliefs that Hitler had weren't the source of his decision to eliminate the Jews. He needed a convenient scapegoat for Germany's economic woes, and the Christians in Germany already hated the Jews... so he had a ready-made audience to stir up to support him by pinning the blame for a weak economy on a religious group that was viewed with suspicion all over Europe and that was forced to live in isolated communities (called "ghettos"... which is where our word comes from) and not mingle with "honest folk" in certain places. They were the moneylenders of Europe... so... it was very easy to get people to hate them.

His motivation was political power. The Neo Nazis feel as though their way of life (the "pure white man"/ "original noble race") is being polluted by everyone else who isn't of their belief system or who have icky ancestors (like mine) who are Native American or African or Jewish and so forth. Their motivation isn't religious, either.

Originally posted by Byrd

Originally posted by Neo Christian Mystic
How on Earth Nazism could (and still) use the Norse religion to their advantage in their attempts at conspiring against the human kind and ”solving the Jewish Problem” is a riddle to me, because the ancient Norse people were all “sons of Heimdall”, and Heimdall, is just another name for Noach in my opinion.

But not in THEIR opinion. And if you look into it closely, there's no real match between the gods and Biblical figures you mention (Noah doesn't have three wives and nine mothers, as a quick example.)

Infact, the mother of Trell (Ham) is called Edda, which means Grandmother in Norse. These stories are parallel allegories, and are not to be understood literally. Edda is also the name of the book in which some of these stories are recorded (together with Voluspå and Haavamål). Another interesting detail with Heimdall linking him to Noach, is that there are nine -9- maternal generations before Noach, and Heimdall was the son of nine -9- mothers. Coincidence?

And another thing showing how the Norse weren't racists is that they called the Africans "the Blue Men" or "Blámenn". The first Africans we met were the Tuareg people who controlled the trade routes through Gibraltar and North Africa. These people dress in blue garnments and supposedly this was where the ancient Norse travellers learened how to dye garments blue. The herb we used to dye blue is the same herb used by the Tuaregs.

Originally posted by Byrd
The Neo Nazis feel as though their way of life (the "pure white man"/ "original noble race") is being polluted by everyone else who isn't of their belief system or who have icky ancestors (like mine) who are Native American or African or Jewish and so forth. Their motivation isn't religious, either.

Modern genetics show that the North American Natives carries a mix between North European and East Asian DNA. I even have a friend we call "the Indian", his father is Norwegian and his mother is from the Far East. Which makes sense, since the ancient Norse AND Indonesians (Thor Heyerdahl's expeditions over the Pacific proved this) were capable of travelling in rough seas and with a relatively short distance via Island and Greenland to "Vinland" ("Land of the Great Plains") known as North America today. The ones who taught us how to make long-ships with keels were the Sami people, Norway's own natives. Not exactly what we would call racistic. Also the old Norse word for the Sami people is Alvr, or Elves in Mordern English. Read the Edda-story about Volund, "the Elven king" for substance.

Von Däniken couldn't have done it better.

Originally posted by bogomil
Von Däniken couldn't have done it better.

What exactly did you mean by that? I can't see the relevance here you see. What I have written here is easily source-able, and though I find great joy in reading about von Däniken, it is my opinion that he is quite speculative at times, although his theories are indeed intriguing.

Voluspå is an ancient Norse prophecy where Heimdall and other gods are discribed, and "Volven" ("the female seer") "spår" ("prophecy") stories resembling those of Beresjit (Genesis) so closely she MUST have known these stories, and she also explain Ragnarok (Harmagheddon) resembling the prophecies in the Prophets of the Tanakh and the NT sayings of Jesjuah and the Apocalypse. Just take a look at the quote below:

Voluspå verse 2:
Jeg mins jotner,
-- I remember giants
urtidsbårne,
-- primordially borne
fjernt i fortid
-- in the distant past
fostret de meg;
-- they educated me
mins ni heimer,
-- remember nine homes/worlds
mins ni gygrer,
-- remember nine mother-giants
visdomstreet,
-- the Tree of Wisdom
som tein i mold.
-- like a shoot in the soil

Kinda amazing or what? Compare this with how in Noach's times giants were born, and how there are nine maternal generations until Noach, and the story of the "Tree of Wisdom"

Re Neo-christian:

My main objection to your OP is, that you're stretching 'inductive reasoning' far beyond any functional limit. A methodology you share with (the already mentioned) Von Däniken and the sensationalist writer Peter Moon, who in an endless series of books uses a cottage industry 'epistemology', he calls 'synchronicity'.

'Inductive reasoning' implies a use of identical phenomena to arrive at conclusions. With some lenience this can even include very strong similarities. But only 'resemblances' as such are worthless.

Any serious comparative research between OT and northern mythology would start with the common indo-european roots, on a STRICT linguistic and symbology-analysis basis.

As to the nazi/northern mythology connection, there actually exists one. The cosmogony of fire-ice. A kind of washed-out yin/yang model with manichean overtones.

This connection doesn't prove or disprove anything, except that people with sociopathic and violent characters can use anything to justify their egotistic aims.

Ofcourse I wholeheartedly support your anti-racistic attitude, and I also find northern mythology fascinating (being a north european myself, I grew up with it), but your way towards any conclusions on these subjects looks like boiling soup on a nail to me.

Originally posted by bogomil
Re Neo-christian:

My main objection to your OP is, that you're stretching 'inductive reasoning' far beyond any functional limit. A methodology you share with (the already mentioned) Von Däniken and the sensationalist writer Peter Moon, who in an endless series of books uses a cottage industry 'epistemology', he calls 'synchronicity'.

I point out similarities, some quite striking, and you go with circular reasoning? Besides, this is not meant to be a scientific paper. ATS simply doesn't mean THAT much to me, that I have to work for a year with every thread and post I make to make it scientifically valid. You think too highly of me

'Inductive reasoning' implies a use of identical phenomena to arrive at conclusions. With some lenience this can even include very strong similarities. But only 'resemblances' as such are worthless.

Concider the OP a sketch, it is not meant to be anything else than a list of trivial, but compelling coincidences between the biblical narrative of Genesis and stories from Edda and the vast world of Norse mythology.

Any serious comparative research between OT and northern mythology would start with the common indo-european roots, on a STRICT linguistic and symbology-analysis basis.

As for linguistics, Hebrew is not an Indo-European language, it is a Shemite language. Secondly, the Genesis account is a compilation of earlier Sumerian myths, like Enuma Elish and Gilgamesj etc. However, both the Norse tales and the Genesis account are distinctively different from the Sumerian tales, but still share many common concepts, like lineage of Heimdall and Noach both being seemingly tenth generation and both showing three sons where one is black etc. Like I said this isn't a scientific paper, I honestly don't have time for that with this. As of yet, that is. In the future I will work with comparative cultural studies, with linguistic science and religious science as my main base.

As to the nazi/northern mythology connection, there actually exists one. The cosmogony of fire-ice. A kind of washed-out yin/yang model with manichean overtones.

This connection doesn't prove or disprove anything, except that people with sociopathic and violent characters can use anything to justify their egotistic aims.

Ofcourse I wholeheartedly support your anti-racistic attitude, and I also find northern mythology fascinating (being a north european myself, I grew up with it), but your way towards any conclusions on these subjects looks like boiling soup on a nail to me.

Hehe. I have actually been skating a few times in a soup of nails Thanks for kind words

Re Neo Christian

There are a few details, you and I could spend eternities arguing about, but that kind of nitpicking doesn't appeal to me. It never leads to anything apart from enforcing already entrenced positions.

Pie-throwing on the other hand can be rather entertaining, but your gracious attitude to your own OP makes that un-necessary. I only start loading my pie-catapults, when people on loose grounds insists on great and final 'truths'.

Should I ever in the future become irritated with you, please remind me, that I owe you one. We may disagree, but in this context you behave decent. A no-loose outcome.

Greetings

Bogo

reply to post by bogomil


LOL. I'll remind you with a wedding cake in between your eyes!

Graceous

Originally posted by bogomil
Re Neo Christian

There are a few details, you and I could spend eternities arguing about, but that kind of nitpicking doesn't appeal to me. It never leads to anything apart from enforcing already entrenced positions.

The appeal is in the rose category, 14 gygri seims heim nó, and a Kilkenny for sleep. Sleep well.