Teen In Critical Condition After Botched Abortion

This same thing happened to me during a C section, in a hospital. My baby was alright but I almost died. Lots of surgeries go wrong in hospitals all the time. As for abortions in a clinic, still much safer than in some unsterlized backroom performed by those that are not even certified doctors. I sincerely believe birth control is the best way to prevent unwanted pregnancies - however to bring a unwanted baby into the world is not good either. If a person is not responsible enough to practice birth control how can they be responsible enough care for a child.

reply to post by crazydaisy


I absolutely concur!!

We do not have any "backstreet" clinics in the UK and we do not need them, the reason being that we do not have the amount of blinkered fanatics on our small island.

A baby should be brought into a loving relationship, anything less is tantamount to cruelty.

reply to post by igor_ats

Life begins at conception, the second the two cells join.
The death industry tried to only to recognize personhood after
the embryo is "implanted". in other words a woman might not even know
she is pregnant for an abortion to occur after conception.
Infertility clinics are hidden in the vast market of
"treatment centers".

Originally posted by Truth_Hz
If you actually look at the law (Sec 1841 Protection of Unborn Children) you will see:

(c) Nothing in this section shall be construed to permit the prosecution—
(1) of any person for conduct relating to an abortion for which the consent of the pregnant woman, or a person authorized by law to act on her behalf, has been obtained or for which such consent is implied by law;

The problem I have with this is that, afaik, if you're not a government licenced abortion practitioner helping the woman have an abortion without the government knowing makes you a murderer.

In other words women can't have medical abortions without the governments stamp of approval. So say a woman didn't want the government to know she's pregnant and gets a backstreet abortion, the practitioner will be charged with murder if caught.

This is from the UK, but I suspect the USA is the same:

news.bbc.co.uk...
"he had broken the abortion law by aiding an abortion without a licence."

Originally posted by Starbug3MY
reply to post by igor_ats

 

Life begins at conception, the second the two cells join.
The death industry tried to only to recognize personhood after
the embryo is "implanted". in other words a woman might not even know
she is pregnant for an abortion to occur after conception.
Infertility clinics are hidden in the vast market of
"treatment centers".

Life begins at conception but Catholics have no problem about the hundreds of thousands of "babies" killed in IVF clinics every year. So how do pro-lifers rationalize "sanctity of life from conception" with IVF? You'd be surprised at the damage control they give:

"oh. the aim is to create life (they're not already alive?) so it's ok to kill those babies deliberately created even though most of them will die".

When President Bush discussed this issue with the Pope back when he had to make the decision to sign the bill banning stem cell line creation, the Pope suggested that all of the embryos currently in deep storage in fertility clinics should be brought to life by other women who wanted to carry the children, and then put up for adoption by good Catholic families.

In other words women can't have medical abortions without the governments stamp of approval.

That is a good thing!! otherwise any Tom Dick or Harry could set up a backstreet abortion clinic with no medical training whatsoever.

Tighter restrictions need to be made on who is able to perform the procedure, in which case the poor girl in the OP would not have had to go through the trauma that she did.

Some things just NEED to be regulated.

Legislate reproductive rights and they could just as easily go the other way.

Eg. forced abortion.

reply to post by Starbug3MY


Ive always felt that people should have mandatory birth control, and have to apply to be parents. I know its not realistic, and everyone would rather live in a "free country." I know its not a good idea to have the government decide who can and cant have children, but maybe it would be better if kept on the local level. For example:

If I want a job (responsibility), any job, even as a fry cook at McDonalds, I have to submit an application, be subject to background checks, credit checks etc...

If I want to conceal/carry my firearm, I have to get the local law enforcement to sign off on it, basically vouching for me that Im an upstanding citizen who deserves a little responsibility.

With those two things in mind, its pretty ludicrous that the most irresponsible people can smoke crack all day and crap out kids non stop, and I have to pay for it, deal with it, hear about it.

No Thanks....

Parenting is a job, a huge one at that. Responsibility is key, and we have kids having kids....

A person you wouldnt trust with your car you are trusting with a life. How absurd

[edit on 7-9-2010 by WhiteDevil013]

reply to post by Whiffer Nippets


I was not suggesting introducing legislation on reproductive rights merely tighter restrictions on who is able to perform the procedure.

Originally posted by Starbug3MY
reply to post by igor_ats

 

Life begins at conception, the second the two cells join.
The death industry tried to only to recognize personhood after
the embryo is "implanted". in other words a woman might not even know
she is pregnant for an abortion to occur after conception.
Infertility clinics are hidden in the vast market of
"treatment centers".

Your first sentence is a religious belief, not a scientific fact. And I think maybe you meant to say micarraige and not abortion. But maybe not

[edit on 7-9-2010 by 4nsicphd for spelling]

[edit on 7-9-2010 by 4nsicphd]

reply to post by Truth_Hz


My comment was directed to the general readership here. And the OP who has made clear their perspective.

Originally posted by NovusOrdoMundi
If there were no moronic couples having reckless sex, there would be no abortion clinics.

Because we all know that birth control is 100% effective and rape is just a myth perpetuated by the MSM.

reply to post by Truth_Hz


oh yay post-pick-a-part my favorite game.

tell that to a rape victim, to a young girl who was taking precautions but the condom split or the pill failed, or to a girl who's partner has walked out on them and they cannot look after a child on their own. ADOPTION I hear you scream. in turn have you thought about the mental implications of having to give up your child.

everything you just listed could be easily avoidable by not having sex or sterilization.

as for rape. it seems more proactive to me to spend energy as a society fixing the rapists, rather than allowing them to rape and just "fixing" the result of their act.

mental implications? i would have thought they reviewed those as they took off their pants and climbed into bed. but of course not, that would be responsible, why be responsible when the state takes care of everything for you!

What exactly have I made sound ridiculous, I have quoted your countries laws and used common sense.

just because its written as law doesn't make it common or the least bit sensible. if you would like i can provide a list of even more ridiculous laws you most likely didn't even know are on the books.

the law is ridiculous to this particular discussion because it takes the position of suggesting that a male is not needed in the propagation of human life, as the mother is the only one recognized.

I have suggested no such thing but babies are not always made out of "love" or in stable relationships.. you go on about the "murder" of these "babies" but do you stop to think for a second about the mothers and the intense mental pressure they are under?

i ask you this in a general sense (although if you'd like to pull up the numbers be my guest)

how many out of all total abortions do you think are due to rape?

maybe.....10%? and thats probably a very generous estimation.

i have no problem with a rape victim getting an abortion as that is a result of force. nothing else you've presented is a result of force, but a result of irresponsibility that could have easily been avoided had correct precautions been taken (IUD)

not unless he's qualified

so your saying that so long as im qualified, i can strap down my girlfriend against her will and preform an abortion? even though she wants to keep the baby? pretty sure ill go to jail for murder, although you seem to be the law expert so ill let you tackle that one.

hahaha, I didn't write the laws, I merely brought them to attention.

further bringing rise to my point. the law is ridiculous, and just because its on the books doesnt further your position any. perhaps im suggesting a change in the laws would be a more proactive solution to this issue for society, which by the way isnt a new issue, its just being addressed by an alleged new "solution".

perhaps a police report should be a pre-requisite for an abortion.

I am in no way advocating abortion clinics as a "quick fix" alternative to contraception however certain circumstances dictate a necessity.

i fully agree with you, however they inevitably become "quick fix's". perhaps i just live in an area where my peers are more promiscuous than others, but where i live planned parenthood seems to know people on a first name basis.

i suppose another possibility is that you live in an area with substantially higher rape statistics, and much more responsible couples. However i must admit i doubt that to be the case in this day and age.



[edit on 7-9-2010 by RelentlessLurker]

reply to post by RelentlessLurker

I like the way you think! Ive never thought about it that way and it makes sense. Truly denying ignorance !!!!!!!

Originally posted by Starbug3MY
reply to post by igor_ats

 

Life begins at conception, the second the two cells join.
The death industry tried to only to recognize personhood after
the embryo is "implanted". in other words a woman might not even know
she is pregnant for an abortion to occur after conception.
Infertility clinics are hidden in the vast market of
"treatment centers".

Yes, after conception there is a living cell, that's life.

My intestines are full of living cells, bacteria which live inside each of us. Every time I poop many of them are released and die, does that mean I should stop pooping?

My nose lining is full of stem cells, any of which could potentially be used to clone a child, does that mean I must not blow my nose?

A cell, even a group of cells, is not a human, not even if it may eventually grow into a human being.


Make of this what you will, but when I was 5 months pregnant with my 3rd child, lying in a warm bath, I had the weird and wonderful experience of the child's soul visiting me and introducing himself to me before he inhabited the little body inside me.


Personally, I'm against abortion but pro choice. I have three children who were all the results of birth control failures, and had them in circumstances where I could not provide a stable home for them, and I adore all of them. However they have had to endure many difficulties, and I've had to give up a career and rely on a government pension in the early days to get us through. Adoption, so often advocated by anti-choicers, would never have been an option even if I'd wanted because the handicapped babies don't get adopted. Adoptive parents want perfect babies, and two of mine are handicapped and the other was believed to have Down's syndrome (before tests were available,) but it turned out later her chromosomes were normal, she only had the mongoloid eyes, different palms, and quiet nature, without the Down's chromosomes.

It's a complex issue, and more harm is done by legislating against womens' freedom to choose what for them is the lesser of two evils than by making safe, early abortions available.

reply to post by Starbug3MY

I think the teen would have botched the job if she had done it herself. Doctors are regulated. Now you know.

reply to post by RelentlessLurker


and....
what do you say to the couple, who really wanted the child...but then well, the doctor comes up to them and tells them that unless an abortion is done, the mother will die???

I knew a mentally ill women who was really quite distraught after the state forced her to have an abortion....ya see, the meds she was on just about guarenteed they child would develope horribly deformed....
think about just how many meds are out there that warn pregnant women not to use them...
only sometimes they are necessary, to enable the person to function, and occasionally, to live...

and well, the only birth control that I know of that is 100% effective is abstinance....so, I guess if we don't want to have a baby.......I'm sure all the men will understand.....if we just don't have sex!!

Originally posted by Truth_Hz

In other words women can't have medical abortions without the governments stamp of approval.

That is a good thing!! otherwise any Tom Dick or Harry could set up a backstreet abortion clinic with no medical training whatsoever.

Tighter restrictions need to be made on who is able to perform the procedure, in which case the poor girl in the OP would not have had to go through the trauma that she did.

Some things just NEED to be regulated.

A woman can self-induce an abortion legally, but if someone helps her they break the law.

There are good reasons for that, like other complex medical procedures I guess - black market (money), health risks involved etc.

Thing is, if abortion is a matter of the right to privacy and bodily integrity, a person should have the right to have an abortion without the governments permission. They do - women can self-induce an abortion legally, but if she wants to do it with some help outside of the government I believe she should be able to have help. Indeed it probably is better the way it is currently and I do concede how it can be abused, I just get an uneasy feeling that a "fundamental right" is treated this way.

For example you can refuse medical help even if it means you will die, but helping a woman terminate her pregnancy is illegal.

reply to post by RelentlessLurker


Then you will be more willing to shell out money so young women have access to birth control clinics?

Hard to get birth control when the clinic is 20 miles away and you dont' drive.
You should also be willing to ship out money for sex education, and therapy. Because most women who end up young and pregnant have been abused, sexually abused, and are uneducated.

reply to post by nixie_nox


no i think they should just learn the hard way and have the kid, struggle, and be a shining example of what not to do, shunned and outcast from society.

its harsh, but it will correct the problem quickly.

that or go to jail for murder.

you know, the old fashioned way.