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Originally posted by ZeroKnowledge
This is all very nice, but US is a melting pot for gozzilion different cultures for centuries.
Lots of Chinese live there for example. And do not get radicalized for some weird reason.
Look at history - every new group that came to US (Irish, Polish,Russian and ctr) was discriminated against - culturally and financially, at least in the beginning. Vast majority choose to work hard and integrate while maintaining some of their original values despite it all.
Funny thing - contrary to your presentation ,vast majority of Muslims also choose to work hard and integrate.
So no need to feel all soft and sad for radicals and fanatics - they make their choice in exactly the same conditions other people made the opposite one.
So this is not problem of society - this is their PERSONAL problem if those individuals cannot coexist with majority.
Islam makes sense when it is in it's proper context ie. in a Muslim society everything around you complies with what you learn from your religion. Men and women are separated, men wear a beard etc. etc.
Now imagine being forced to leave the country. The first generation of immigrants didn't have to much difficulty holding on to their believes because they do not interact with their new society (or hardly). They just keep to them selfs and continue to practice their believes and values in the privacy of their own home or in small groups of like-minded.
Now imagine being born a son of this family. As a kid you will learn the morals and values of your religion and this shapes your world. Being immigrated to a European country you are expected to attend school, interact with society etc...This is where the trouble starts.
What is surprising is the fact that most Muslim girls and women are having no problems adapting and even using the system to get a higher education. ( ).
It is once again the adolescent male scr*wing things up here. Religion is a wonderful excuse to condemn those things that you would/could never have (naked women, being gay, alcohol etc). So you hook up with like-minded adolescent Muslims and you express your disgust of this society.
If you are lucky, your society will have an Imam who holds a more radical view of the Islam and you will have conformation of your disgust. And of like with all groups of young men, the more radical you are (read: the more you dare) the cooler you are!!
Pffff....that was a lot. If you are still here, I would like to suggest that we move to a society similar to those of elephants. A matriarchal society where all young men, having problems restraining their hormones, will be shipped of to the Sahara or Siberia where they can choose from an array of weapons to survive the wilderness for a couple of years....have at it!!
And when you are done raging, you can come back to finally be a contribution to society instead of being a burden on society.
So to state that America has American values is incorrect?? The whole of American society is merely a collection of different societies with different values??
Maybe because their morals and values are more in line with the American standard?
Integrate?? Ever hear of places such as "little China", "little Italy"?? That is NOT integration!! Are you going to deny that immigrants tend to form groups of their own for security and comfort. (You and I would do it as well)
You never heard me say anything about work ethics, now did you? Where are you getting the information that the vast majority of Muslims is trying hard to integrate? Not attacking, just asking.
That is an ignorant thing to say!! indoctrination goes a long way.
And eventually it will become society's problem. What's your point??
Originally posted by ZeroKnowledge
Indoctrination to foreign radical ideas in democratic country is a personal choice. Nobody forces one to listen to internet lecture of fringe cleric or to go to some underground secret meeting. People are responsible for choices they make.
Well - society has tools to deal with this, ensuring that it stays problem of individual.