Bias and bigotry in academia

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A decade ago, activist Ron Unz conducted a study of the ethnic and religious composition of the student body at Harvard.

Blacks and Hispanics, Unz found, were then being admitted to his alma mater in numbers approaching their share of the population.

And who were the most underrepresented Americans at Harvard?

White Christians and ethnic Catholics. Though two-thirds of the U.S. population then, they had dropped to one-fourth of the student body.

Comes now a more scientific study from Princeton sociologists Thomas Espenshade and Alexandria Radford to confirm that a deep bias against the white conservative and Christian young of America is pervasive at America's elite colleges and Ivy League schools.

Wake up! This is the reality of what Christian students face in the secular world of academia.

The Espenshade-Radford study "draws from ... the National Study of College Experience ... gathered from eight highly competitive private colleges and universities (entering freshman SAT scores: 1360)," writes Princeton Professor Russell K. Nieli, who has summarized the findings:

Elite college admissions officers may prattle about "diversity," but what they mean is the African-American contingent on campus should be 5 percent to 7 percent, withHispanics about as numerous.

However, "an estimated 40 percent to 50 percent of those categorized as black are Afro-Caribbean or African immigrants, or the children of such immigrants," who never suffered segregation or Jim Crow.

To achieve even these percentages, however, the discrimination against white and Asian applicants, because of the color of their skin and where their ancestors came from, is astonishing.

As Nieli puts it, "Being Hispanic conferred an admissions boost over being white ... equivalent to 130 SAT points (out of 1,600), while being black rather than white conferred a 310-point SAT advantage. Asians, however, suffered an admissions penalty compared to whites equivalent to 140 SAT points."

"To have the same chance of gaining admission as a black student with a SAT score of 1100, a Hispanic student otherwise equally matched in background characteristics would have to have 1230, a white student a 1410 and an Asian student a 1550."

Is anyone surprised by these numbers?
I have a question for ATS members. At what point, does this stop being "affirmative action", and become discrimination?
I'll give you my opinion. this is outright discrimination, no questions asked.
If you are a white Christian conservative, good luck getting your son or daughter into a top notch college, and you'll need a miracle to get them a scholarship, regardless of whether they are highly qualified or not.

Mmm, Pat Buchanan. Not the most reliable of sources but ok. I am sure the thrust of his argument is correct but he fails to mention where, when and how long this study was.
I think this paragraph sums it up pretty well:

"Lower-class whites prove to be all-around losers" at the elite schools. They are rarely accepted. Lower-class Hispanics and blacks are eight to 10 times more likely to get in with the same scores".

If you're poor and white, fuggedaboudit! Join the military and go to college on the G.I. bill. Unless you have astronomical test scores you're not going to an Ivy league school.

More institutionalized racism, hardly surprising. We need to level the playing field not only in college admissions but everywhere, especially in government and private hiring practices.

[edit on 20-7-2010 by Asktheanimals]

I always thought affirmative action should be based on economics, not race. I went to school with a Black kid whose parents were both surgeons. He was a decent student, but not a great student. He ended up going to a very good school because of affirmative action. He did not need affirmative action to break the shackles of racism.

On the other hand, there are plenty of poor white people that are born with the deck stacked against them. They have to deal with the things that hold many minorities down like poverty, crime, drugs, and even discrimination.

reply to post by Asktheanimals

Mmm, Pat Buchanan. Not the most reliable of sources but ok.

Forget Buchanan. The study was done by Prof. Russ Nieli, a highly respected professor and author. One of his books, by the way, Contemporary Voices of White Nationalism in America, also decries the white nationalist movement in America. He is not a biased person, but has studied and written about bigotry and bias from ALL points of view. The fact that Buchanan quotes him takes nothing away from this study.

Affirmative Action is contradictory to itself as of about 30 or 40 years ago.

www.answers.com...


It is supposed to be about "separate but equal"

The Civil Rights Act did not provide criminal penalties for employers that discriminated, nor did the civil remedies established by the act include compensation for pain and suffering or punitive damages. Rather, the act sought to establish a conciliation process by which victims would be restored to the situation they would have had in the absence of discrimination.

So which is it? Is it about equal rights or is it about "lets get whitey?". They may not get money from the law but they damn sure get it from lawyers!

I know people RIGHT NOW that are in need of disability help. They paid into the kitty for 40 years.

No, sorry. You didnt work enough.

Well, I worked small jobs when I could and was a house wife? My husband worked?

No. sorry.

(translation)

You are entitled due to the fact you are white. Life was soooo much easier than anyone elses. If you didnt live up to you "whiteness" I'm so sorry for you.

Meanwhile down on the border......


>>voice of carnival barker

As the poster above shows, it is discrimination that stems from White Guilt. People with white skin made to feel so guilty for how their ancestors treated non-white people. This is the justification for the over-representation of minorities at the expense of the majority population.

If this was about "evening" the field for minorities in terms of academic opportunity, why are their numbers over-representative of their population in the academic population?

Since the victims happen to be white, this is one type of bigotry that is allowed...

[edit on 21/7/2010 by Dark Ghost]

In many circumstances middle aged, middle class, white males have become an oppressed minority... they don't get the same scholarship or student loan opportunities other ethnicities might get, and likewise, there are a number of such programs available to women regardless of race that men can't apply for.

This is why I'm going to apply at Harvard next year as a proud african-american. With a 1370 SAT score I'm bound to get in!

Originally posted by JoshNorton
In many circumstances middle aged, middle class, white males have become an oppressed minority... they don't get the same scholarship or student loan opportunities other ethnicities might get, and likewise, there are a number of such programs available to women regardless of race that men can't apply for.

I think the idea is that the middle class should, with some good financial decisions, be able to send their kids to college sans scholarships.

Maybe it would help the middle class to think of themselves as getting "screwed" because they're not getting a hand-out like everyone else and instead feel grateful that these programs exist and are helping them out indirectly.

For every poor child that they help rise above their current station in life, there is one less person and potentially all their descendants who will be a drain on society. One less branch who won't be on welfare or rob them at gunpoint.

If living in a good neighborhood, being able to pay your bills on time while having enough money left over for "toys", and go on the occasional vacation is "oppressed", then I want to be oppressed.

Originally posted by Mayson
For every poor child that they help rise above their current station in life, there is one less person and potentially all their descendants who will be a drain on society. One less branch who won't be on welfare or rob them at gunpoint.

If living in a good neighborhood, being able to pay your bills on time while having enough money left over for "toys", and go on the occasional vacation is "oppressed", then I want to be oppressed.

This would only hold true if all aspects were considered equally. Unfortunately they are not.

The fact that universities have not grown in relation to the population + affirmative action is the problem. Neither is a problem in and of themselves, it's when the two combine that you get problems.

Example: For that "poor kid" to get into the university to better his/her life, a middle class person will have to be denied access. And this will happen regardless of which applicant is a better performer. This occurs due to limited space at the university plus the need for that extra affirmative action grant money.

So in effect, affirmative action + limited academic space has led to a change of classes, not raising everyone to the same level.

reply to post by peck420

One of the things that people fail to understand is the fact that private Universities and Colleges are in the business of making money. Any time that they can get someone that is a guaranteed payer, they will take that, over someone who may be a risk. Government funded students are manna from heaven to colleges, as they know that the government will provide the funds. Lower-middle class students are the biggest risk, because many of them don't qualify for government aid, and their parents are living on the edge, trying to give their child the opportunity of college. Unfortunately, that is exactly the situation which makes it hard for such students to be accepted. It is a rotten shame, but it is the reality. In addition, the last thing that colleges want is a lawsuit alleging bigotry, so again, white lower class students are expendable, in favor of poor and minorities.
Given two students who are equal in qualification, the minority will almost always win that selection.

reply to post by ProfEmeritus


I like when we agree, I just hate that you are so much more eloquent than me .

It is a terrible shame that a noble program has been basterdized by greed.

Originally posted by hotpinkurinalmint
I always thought affirmative action should be based on economics, not race. I went to school with a Black kid whose parents were both surgeons. He was a decent student, but not a great student. He ended up going to a very good school because of affirmative action. He did not need affirmative action to break the shackles of racism.

On the other hand, there are plenty of poor white people that are born with the deck stacked against them. They have to deal with the things that hold many minorities down like poverty, crime, drugs, and even discrimination.

Yes I agree 100%, it's simply racial discrimination against whites. White males face constant discrimination.

Let's say the black kid graduates medical school because of affirmative action all the way through. Would you want him operating on you? Probably not! And the rare competent minority, who "would have" made it without affirmative action, has no way to distinguish himself from the rest.

The rational consumer of medical care, or legal services, or whatever would avoid the black or hispanic provider because of the strong statistical inference that this person would not even have been certified without lots of help, many times, from pervasive affirmative action. I've heard that a black patient refused a black doctor and asked for a "real doctor." They know it. It's just rational choice as a consumer.

Originally posted by Jupiter Crashes
This is why I'm going to apply at Harvard next year as a proud african-american.

With a 1370 SAT score I'm bound to get in!

Let's hope a white with 1400 SAT "passes for" black and takes your spot. Hey I'm light skinned, I'm albino!

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
reply to post by Asktheanimals

 

Mmm, Pat Buchanan. Not the most reliable of sources but ok.

Forget Buchanan. The study was done by Prof. Russ Nieli, a highly respected professor and author. One of his books, by the way, Contemporary Voices of White Nationalism in America, also decries the white nationalist movement in America. He is not a biased person, but has studied and written about bigotry and bias from ALL points of view. The fact that Buchanan quotes him takes nothing away from this study.

One can decry white nationalism for various reasons, but it exists for a reason. It exists to counter discrimination.

End the discrimination, end affirmative action, anchor babies, etc., and white nationalism will hardly be of interest to anyone. Until then, it will probably get stronger.

Originally posted by ProfEmeritus
reply to post by peck420

 

...
Given two students who are equal in qualification, the minority will almost always win that selection.

Does it make a lot of difference what sort of minority it is? A black, a hispanic Mexican, a hispanic Spaniard? Or are they all equally good for getting extra brownie points?

Originally posted by peck420
...
Example: For that "poor kid" to get into the university to better his/her life, a middle class person will have to be denied access. And this will happen regardless of which applicant is a better performer. This occurs due to limited space at the university plus the need for that extra affirmative action grant money. ...

What affirmative action grant money? Are there grants for that? Paid directly to the college? Or do you mean affirmative action scholarships from outside agencies that come with the students?