Originally posted by Taupin Desciple
Personally, I can't think of a more legally binding life altering decision then that of choosing to have a baby. They are unfit to decide whether
they should accept money for sterilization but yet they are fit to have a child? How does that work?
It's not legally binding, you can give the child up for adoption. I didn't say they were fit to have a child, I said that they were unfit to sign
the contract. There are standards for what makes a person fit to sign a contract that the law has agreed upon. That's not a matter of opinion,
it's a fact. Contracts are almost always voided in court if they are contested and they were signed when a person was intoxicated or suffering from
mental illness which impairs their decision making. It seems clear to me that someone active in addiction is not making decisions that a sane,
rational, or reasonable person would make.
Besides, as you well know, having a child is often not their intention. Babies can be made by mistake. It's a mistake which is easy to prevent, but
the notion of "choice" implies intent. Often times people do not intend to have a child when they conceive one, it can be an unintended side effect
of having sex. Of course it would be nice if everyone thought everything through, but they don't. Sometimes people have kids without making the
conscious choice to have kids. People don't sign contracts without making the choice to pick up a pen and sign their name. A comparison between the
two acts is inherently flawed.
Besides which, have you ever heard of supply and demand? Get rid of the demand for drugs and you'll eventually get rid of the supply.
Yes, I've heard of supply and demand. I'm not sure I understand you here though, you think that offering drug addicts a few hundred dollars to be
sterilized will "get rid of the demand" for drugs? I'm hesitant to believe this is what you meant, as it makes so little sense, but no other
meaning is self-evident to me.
If you do, indeed, mean to suggest that offering addicts money to be sterilized will get rid of the demand for drugs, you are sadly mistaken.
They're not being paid to stop using drugs, they are only being paid to not have kids. If they want to have kids, they already can. If they want to
use drugs, they already can. If they want both, they can have both. If they want money more than they want kids, they can accept this offer. There
is no motivation whatsoever provided by this program to decrease their desire for drugs. "Drugs or kids" is not the choice they are being asked to
make. The choice is a few hundred dollars or kids. Unless those few hundred dollars are the last possible way for them support their habit(making
the money equivalent to drugs), they are not being asked to choose between using drugs and having kids. But, if this last situation is the case, just
don't give them the money and they will have no way to keep doing drugs. Under no circumstances does this program have any effect at all on the
people's motivation to do drugs. The offer is essentially, "You can do whatever you want, but if you're going to be an addict I'll give you money
to not have kids."
I just realized that you might have meant that by discouraging addicts from having kids, that will get rid of the demand for drugs in the next
generation. You could only mean this if you were operating under the assumption that most or all drug users are children of addicts, and that being
children of addicts is the primary/only cause of drug addiction. This is silly though and I'm not going to argue it, because you can glance at any
of the data that exists and find out that this is simply not the case. Many, many, users/addicts are the children of non-addicts.
This program does not get rid of the demand for drugs.
The bottom line is this. The U.S. simply doesn't have the money anymore to appease the bleeding hearts when they say "give everyone a chance,
everyone has a chance in life". The cold,hard fact of the matter is, no they don't. There are some people born into this world who have absolutly
zero chance of making a good, productive life for themselves or anyone else. You can ignore this truth all you want because it doesn't fit into your
utopian world view, but it's still here and it isn't going away.
I really wish none of this were true and that we would have no need for this type of discussion, but sadly,it is and we do.
My worldview is not utopian. I don't support entitlement programs and do support conservative fiscal policy. The policy in question is not taking
the hard line against socialist utopianism, it's the opposite. You want to give addicts more money that the government doesn't have(because you
think that the children of addicts are the ones causing all the problems?). This isn't a even a conservative vs liberal issue, it's that your
assessment of the situation is completely wrong. Many addict are not the children of addicts. Case closed; providing an incentive for addicts to be
sterlized will not solve the drugs problem. The only drug problem that can be solved is the war on drugs and symptoms of the way on drugs, and the
only solution to is recognize that no prohibition ever works - it's a complete failure now just like it was with booze - and we just have to
immediately stop doing what we are doing.
It's not me that's being unrealistic. Of course it would be nice if we lived in a world where people didn't need or want mood-altering substances.
After 5 minutes of living in this reality though, it becomes self evident that that is just not the world we live in. We don't have a choice to
make that world; every attempt has been an absolute failure. The choices we have are to continue the war on drugs or treat drugs like alcohol. A
good way of making decisions is to look at pros and cons. There are no pros to the war on drugs and an extensive list of cons. The situation stopped
making sense a long time ago. Support of our current system can only be held in conjunction with a hopelessly unrealistic assessment of the
situation. This new little gimmic described in the OP is an extension of that misguided understanding of the situation.