Chief exorcist Father Gabriele Amorth says Devil is in the Vatican

'demons' I would probably call them 'Paedophile' and 'Cover-up'."

Exactly.


Again I agree.

Although to a degree as I think, I may be wrong, but I think that simply by perception, observance the "other" reality exists.

The five senses give you only one perception of truth...reality.

reply to post by jackflap


Yeah...its good stuff isn't it? The correlation is definitely there, I hope others will see it too.

Great movie.

Well once again I am left wondering how demons can be so bad if they lead people right back to God.

B/c of this, I read a lot of Papal decrees and 'stuff' last night and this morning. I became curious as to the reasoning of some of the decisions that the church has made.

In almost every case, I saw time and again a base assumption that nature was evil, or that the processes of nature were evil. THe other reasoning was then piled on top of that. Much of this reasoning is solid. Then on top of that, is always the authority of the church. Sin is always the rebellion against the church, and/or of God, since God ordained the Authority that is the church. Sin is always some result of a line of logic questioning that seems valid but isn't.

Well, now I know why I am not Catholic. I now realize why the concept of reincarnation is so dangerous to the Church.

I do not think the processes of nature are evil. People get old and sick and die because that is the way of nature, and it helps to make way for the young. If one sees themselves as being part of nature, and part of that cycle, then it seems less sinister than ever.

And if you kick that first basic assumption out - that the processes of nature are evil - well, the church is left standing on it's own sin, using it's own definition of how sin comes into being.

But I keep getting stuck on the idea of Satan entering in like smoke through a fissure, and I keep thinking of papal smoke, and a Pope that died way too soon, and of Satan being forced to wait in the wings during the reign of a Godly man...... Oh Yes, I think, Rat Slinger, You'd know all about the smoke, wouldn't you?

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07
reply to post by jackflap

 

Because both science and religion have been corrupted! Which has been corrupted more and/or less is an extremely difficult question to answer and is prone to bias.

More often that not I side with the church because it retains a connection to our creator. Mainstream religion maybe incomplete and misleading but it's much more than what mainstream science offers.

Be careful with the bad language. I didn't quote it here, and its better for me that I didn't. The Terms and Conditions clearly state that it is not allowed on this forum. Don't take that as me berating you, rather, take it as advice. That's all.

Now, I will agree with you that both religion and science are corrupted. But I think that religion has been worse with withholding information,providing all out lies, and being a facilitator of pure negativity. For instance: If you don't accept Jesus Christ as your savior, you're going to hell. (pretty negative stuff there.) A better approach would be to bring people in the fold out of love instead of using primal fear as the main method for recruitment.

Here are some of the differences that I see.

1. Science does not have a large number of its members that have a record of pedophilia.
Christianity does.
2. The Vatican has an entire library in its basement of ancient information that has yet to be released to the public. Makes you wonder about all of the stuff that they know about in their archives that you and I will never get to see with our own eyes. That's kind've bothersome.
For the most part, with the exception of military studies and applications of science, Science attempts to release new information to the public on a semi-regular basis.
3. Christianity uses a bible of very old text that has been revised numerous times, and many of the essential books are missing.
Again, science tries to keep the books updated to the best of its ability, with a few exceptions.
4. Religion has been the primary tool used in almost any war that has existed since the dawn of mankind.
Science has obviously contributed to wars as well, so, on that one, they are about equal.

Either way, both of these "religions" are primarily used for control and death. The only difference is, science at least attempts to stay up to date.

Now, I will agree with you on the idea that electromagnetism and many other forms of science needs to simply come forward and tell the world that there are different, and more efficient ways of using energy...such as free energy in which Tesla was highly known for. But, the fact is, if everyone started using it, the energy industry would collapse...which, is fine by me. But, the economy is one of the reasons why they don't release pertinent information to the public. It all always boils down to money. And that's the worse part of this silly society that we've all helped to create.

Nonetheless, I'm not sure which side I trust more...science, or religion. But, at least science is brought some sort of dependability.


[edit on 11-3-2010 by EvolvedMinistry]

reply to post by EvolvedMinistry


Oh come now - there is a core truth to religion and there's a core truth to science, and both are uncorrupted because they cannot be corrupted.

I've thought long and hard about this and the core truth of religion has to be the essence of the human experience, like the essential oil that comes from a rare and precious ingredient - US. Now you can put it in any bad perfume of control, dominance and hidden agenda and it will stink, but in it's primal state, it is wonderous.

There's nothing about science that has been corrupted. The scientific process is it's own wonderful primary ingredient. But like the finest saffron, if you put it in a soup of greed, corruption, and hidden agenda, you've got a nasty tasting recipe.

reply to post by CAELENIUM


None of these rituals show any supernatural activity so what are we left with? I suggest extreme mental health issues. Why are the exorcists so hell bent on not having proof of the supernatural? are they so arrogant in their faith or just stupid?

reply to post by Tiger5

None of these rituals show any supernatural activity so what are we left with? I suggest extreme mental health issues. Why are the exorcists so hell bent on not having proof of the supernatural? are they so arrogant in their faith or just stupid?

You would think with seventy thousand exorcisms, and all the strange goings on, that they would have video taped this stuff and started a serious inquiry into the goings on. I know I would have! I would have demanded that someone else be exposed to this creepiness, for my own sanity.

The fact is, they didn't. Or they do have the evidence but will not let anyone see the evidence. I seriously doubt this guy because he said he has been at it for twenty five years and has been involved in seventy thousand cases. Do the math, it's insane.

They do video some. And in prior times they took detail notes.

It just isn't available to you and I. Doesn't mean they haven't done it.

Originally posted by EvolvedMinistry
Be careful with the bad language. I didn't quote it here, and its better for me that I didn't. The Terms and Conditions clearly state that it is not allowed on this forum. Don't take that as me berating you, rather, take it as advice. That's all.

I don't have to sugarcoat everything I post! If you don't like my post then don't respond to it or report it to the mods and let them take care of it.

Your patronising methods are quite childish and pointless....

Originally posted by EvolvedMinistry
Now, I will agree with you that both religion and science are corrupted. But I think that religion has been worse with withholding information,providing all out lies, and being a facilitator of pure negativity.

No science is much worse!

Originally posted by EvolvedMinistry
For instance: If you don't accept Jesus Christ as your savior, you're going to hell. (pretty negative stuff there.) A better approach would be to bring people in the fold out of love instead of using primal fear as the main method for recruitment.

I am a "good" christian not because I fear going to hell but because it is the correct thing to do imo. It is my choice! Granted there are some religious sects were that happens but it is not the norm. Perhaps you are confusing religion with tv evangelists out to make a buck?

Originally posted by EvolvedMinistry
1. Science does not have a large number of its members that have a record of pedophilia.
Christianity does.

What do you mean by "a large number"? If 1%(just picking a number here) were proven child molestors does that negate the other 99% who are not?

Originally posted by EvolvedMinistry
2. The Vatican has an entire library in its basement of ancient information that has yet to be released to the public. Makes you wonder about all of the stuff that they know about in their archives that you and I will never get to see with our own eyes. That's kind've bothersome.

For the most part, with the exception of military studies and applications of science, Science attempts to release new information to the public on a semi-regular basis.

I am not aware of the vatican's "entire libarary". However there is a lot of fuss going around about the pentagon, cia, nsa, kgb, mossad and other agencies withholding lots of classfied science data for unknown reasons.

Originally posted by EvolvedMinistry
Either way, both of these "religions" are primarily used for control and death. The only difference is, science at least attempts to stay up to date.

Did you bother read my entire post? I gave more than one convincing example of science going backwards instead of forwards.

reply to post by jackflap


I know they are hiding something directly underneath the Vatican. It was built where it is to conceal some sort of religious relic important to the Church.

Maybe they do have the devil in a cage somewhere.

If so, and judging by the state of the world, I would guess they are using him for stud service.

Lots of little devils are running around these days.

reply to post by rusethorcain

Maybe they do have the devil in a cage somewhere. If so, and judging by the state of the world, I would guess they are using him for stud service. Lots of little devils are running around these days.

That would explain my wife's lone trip to Rome and the resulting litter! She told me that all babies can fly and set the curtains on fire. Dammit.