A Very Simple Question- Go ahead, Try To Answer

forum hiccup

[edit on 13-3-2010 by bigfatfurrytexan]

Originally posted by Annee

Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan


Perhaps if his team were giving the speeches on the campaign trail, he wouldn't have made so many "pie in the sky" promises.

That is the point of my post. He was inexperienced, and didn't conceptualize what it would take to deliver on what he promised. He just promised the chocolate milk in order to get elected (to use my previous metaphor).

That is not what your original post said or indicated.

Name one politician who does not do as you describe.

It is exactly what i was implying. Being the author, i suppose i would be in a position to know such things.

I cannot name a single politician who does not do this. Not a single one.

On the other hand, this does not in any way enable me to justify the behavior. Therefore, i do find it a little hard to understand your point?

A scoundrel is a scoundrel. And just because "everybody does it" does not make it right. I demand better for this nation. And I will be a restless voter until i get more.

reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan


Everybody doing it does not make it right.

General public expecting/demanding to be Schmoozed and told what they want to hear - - is what makes it wrong.

Not the politician doing what is NEEDED to get elected in order to make change.

Sheep can't handle 100% truth. I'd say 90% of humans are sheep.

LIfe/Politics can not live in the past. Only the now/future maters.

Ok, I did not read the entire 4 or 5 pages yet but wanted to weigh in on this one.

Now, I am no giant fan of this man we call our president either. Let's be fair here. You can't just expect the man to say "Ok, I'm President now, everyone come home NOW." You can't just expect him to up and leave Iraq and Afghan with the snap of a finger. That stuff takes some time and requires logistical planning.

I am not going to turn this into a "why we are there" thread as it really doesn't matter and contribute the the OP's thread. You can't just say you are bringing them all home and expect to see them in a few weeks.

All the OP's thread is meant to do is to call out all the Obama and military haters and turn it into a bash-fest. Find something more constructive to do with your time.

Semper Fidelis

-Nate

Basically put the responsibility where it belongs.

On people wanting/demanding to hear falsehoods that are un-realistic.

"People" who want to hear - what they want to hear.

They want to be lied to. They want the fairytale. The last thing they want is the truth.

Originally posted by Annee
reply to post by bigfatfurrytexan

 

Everybody doing it does not make it right.

General public expecting/demanding to be Schmoozed and told what they want to hear - - is what makes it wrong.

Not the politician doing what is NEEDED to get elected in order to make change.

Sheep can't handle 100% truth. I'd say 90% of humans are sheep.

LIfe/Politics can not live in the past. Only the now/future maters.

If i am not mistaken, you are saying that the ends justify the means?

If so, i could not disagree more. The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

As well, while 90% of the people may be sheep (i don't agree with that statement, but that is a whole 'nuther thread), it is still THEIR job to decide what is best. If people lie to get elected, then they are taking that away. You cannot just make decisions for people, using the "sheeple" excuse. I will never agree that any elected official should have the right to lie/steal/cheat to get elected just because they know what is best, and needs to save The People from themselves.

Originally posted by Annee
Basically put the responsibility where it belongs.

On people wanting/demanding to hear falsehoods that are un-realistic.

"People" who want to hear - what they want to hear.

They want to be lied to. They want the fairytale. The last thing they want is the truth.

No, i cannot put the blame on The People. They are not the ones who are acting unethically. They are not the liars.

I will not hold mankind in contempt. I will not blame 300 million people, and claim THEY are at fault when Obama lies. I wouldn't do it for Bush, i won't do it for Obama.

Either you are over philosophizing this, or you are defending Obama without cause. There is nothing else that i can think of, honestly.

When a man lies, HE is the one responsible, no matter how badly other people want to hear those lies. It is HIS lie. HE owns it.

Originally posted by captaintyinknots

Originally posted by TrueAmerican

Originally posted by captaintyinknots
it holds no water, until their time is over.

But yeah, I will agree, thus far, he hasnt lived up to his promises.

Uh nope, fail.

Right there in the video he says, and I quote "The first thing I will do..."

And to the other guy, oh, I see. So because it's a campaign promise, the very thing the people depend on to elect somebody, it's just fine and dandy to lie.

Hey, I didn't say Dem, and I didn't say Rep. I am holding a man to his word. No partisanship with this very simple question.

Becuase the president has the power to walk into office and do what he wants, right?

Uhhh...yeah he actually does for the most part. Executive orders can be abused quite easily.

Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan


No, i cannot put the blame on The People. They are not the ones who are acting unethically. They are not the liars.

Oh Yeah - they are. "People" want the dream - the fantasy.

It is their demands that make leaders tell them what they want to hear.

For you or anyone to try to convince that only Obama tells the public what they want to hear to get elected - - is laughable.

OH - and by the way - - - I am a 40 year Republican. Soon to become an Independent because there is no choice for "the one you think will do the best job to move us forward.

[edit on 13-3-2010 by Annee]

Originally posted by SmokeandShadow


Uhhh...yeah he actually does for the most part. Executive orders can be abused quite easily.

And your expertise is?

The Presidency is a group. It is not one man.

reply to post by Annee


I am well aware that Obama is not the only liar in politics. They all do it. But Obama is the topic of this thread. That is who we are talking about. If you wish to expand the topic, it would be helpful to know this beforehand. It makes it easier to discuss when we both discuss the same thing.

Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan
reply to post by Annee

 

I am well aware that Obama is not the only liar in politics. They all do it. But Obama is the topic of this thread. That is who we are talking about. If you wish to expand the topic, it would be helpful to know this beforehand. It makes it easier to discuss when we both discuss the same thing.

"Pass the Trash?"

No sorry. If the accusations were exclusive to Obama - you might be correct.

But you are not. The accusations fit every high level politician. There is no expansion of topic.

Evasion is child's play.

Originally posted by star in a jarThis guy is a turncoat and traitor, plain and simple. There's even a rumor floating out there that the real Obama was assassinated when he went to hospital for some procedure and spent far longer in the hospital than what was necessary, and this Obama double took over.

Let me guess...now Obama is reptilian too (along with Bush) niow?

I'll take a stab at it. He didnt end the war because when he was making the campaign promises as an inexperienced Senator, he actually thought the President had the power to make those kinds of calls. Which they do, in theory, but really our Presidents are only front men for the real economic powers nowdays. He was chosen to be the nominee because of his starry eyed optimism and his sincerity. He had to believe in those possibilities to sell them so convincingly to us.

After he was elected. he got schooled in who really calls the shots. And he decided he didnt really want to piss off people who could buy and sell Presidents.

Originally posted by Illusionsaregrander
I'll take a stab at it. He didnt end the war because when he was making the campaign promises as an inexperienced Senator, he actually thought the President had the power to make those kinds of calls. Which they do, in theory, but really our Presidents are only front men for the real economic powers nowdays. He was chosen to be the nominee because of his starry eyed optimism and his sincerity. He had to believe in those possibilities to sell them so convincingly to us.

After he was elected. he got schooled in who really calls the shots. And he decided he didnt really want to piss off people who could buy and sell Presidents.

LOL

Love your take. Now that's putting it in a nutshell.

I remember Randi Rhodes (who had met Obama) commenting how he changed after his first de-briefing in DC before being elected. Then there were lots of media comments about how drained he looked after his de-briefing when he became president.

I am not the only one calling a spade a spade (and no, that doesn't refer to color of skin):