Born into slavery

The perspective that most of earth's population are wage-slaves and debt-slaves is more understood around ATS than anywhere. I just wonder why you would bear a child into slavery. Is that not just as bad as selling someone into slavery?

And maybe for the fact that you didn't know better. A lot of ATS'ers will probably be able to make their children financially free by good education and teaching about debt. But the masses have no way out, they don't know it even if they wanted it, all they can do is birth people into slavery.

But you get a quick answer from the slave periods in World history/American history. It is clear that slaves had children mostly willingly, knowing their children would only be born into slavery. So all they had was the hope that one day their child would be free? And if they resisted in any notable or effortful way against this, it doesn't seem to appear in the history books.

People in history have children even when they know it's 9/10 odds that child will be a slave their whole life. What else is there to say?

Would you be willing to live life as a slave? Maybe life in prison, maybe life in solitary confinement. At what point do you admit life is (not) immune from negative value judgements? I really don't know what my point is, other than the fact that slaves who know their children will be born into slavery and likely never become free, will bring their own children into slavery.

Maybe it's profoundly hopeful, maybe it's very meaningful, maybe it's very cruel, maybe it's very selfish. All I know is that it touches on a lot of humanity's issues.

[edit on 3-3-2010 by Novise]

[edit on 3-3-2010 by Novise]

reply to post by Novise


i think the point for being against childbirth is the lies of nature life that you are meaning to face and stand

natural life mean that positive is always if you keep the march for tomorrow there would always be something you can use it there to invent the positive state reality of your means in being positive always

that as long as you have a superior sense about yourself you can always use anything there to keep living positively

it is also the lie of god as existence sense in men, stating how as long as you have a superior sense about you as free conscious fact you can always kill everything there and use that fact to assert yourself existance as a source of life reality

those gods are wrong, existance is about truth certainty of void fact, it is not about what awareness or conscious do, it is about certainty fact of awareness freedom being in positive truth always, it is the zero plus but always to more positive from its constance facts of certainty positive too

and life is about truth life certainty fact freedom, it is never about the living state one source but always about superiority life out of certainty freedom existing fact, the existant is not the superior living it is still the existing but knowing that superiority as objective freedom life of certainty fact in positive truth can reach infinite superiority life, loving that objective possibility is the simple existing that dont mean itself state as superior to state itself living, it is always meaning the objective reality life from meaning the superiority of objective reality in positive absolute truth reference life

so the point is to understand how truth matters, when everything and everyone die for sure what is the sense of existing or living, especially when objective reality is brought to life by powerful livings meaning themselves superiority and therefor children became slaves livings of powerful wills in lies

reply to post by imans


Well, you guessed my intentions first off in your first paragraph, but still is left more to discuss.

As I read the last part of your post, I began to wonder. Why do we need more than one expression of life then? Not to mention slavery, not to mention freedom.

Why is it all made so complicated? It shouldn't be about slavery or freedom, just life. It could all be very basic, and still be very fulfilling, even moreso. Instead you have complications and exagerrations, and some theories on the future are painted so that you couldn't even be sure to draw a line between good and evil, but there is always money.

reply to post by Novise


because of the superiority drive in truth, i guess people if they werent forced to act simply they would be wrong too and creators are really wrong, that is why the best are infants that still didnt realize existing yet or the naives that are too impressed to think being able to enjoy anything

to be right ones should always put superiority outside then just be positive to themselves which would allow a sense of identity true out of being positive living
but unfortunately to be able to do that you must love truth really to invent almost its objective presence in anything real you see
because everyone as aware of itself even gods sense their inferiority so the superior drive triggles and that sense of self pride is very appreciated so they cant be true
they surely thought that inferior awareness in humans would be the solution by training them of their own crimes, but that is stupid truth is absolute source so humans are in truth superior to gods and in real more acting for their inferiority than gods

the solution i guess is when every awareness would admit superiority being to truth abstract existent life, not gods life or one god this is wrong, noone is living but you the living one but truth life as superior life reference is right

those gods killed objective intelligence that is of truth source to confuse their positive drives with and profit from
positive drives must be totally separated from objective intelligence

truth existence and life as reference to superior existence and life is right because it is true, what is wrong become right when it is true awareness acting through

truth really exists means that what is certain evolve necessarly and positively until it becomes an absolute source asserting being living as a certainty more than certainty itself absolute fact

thanks novice for giving an attention to my posts that sound out of time and i look crazy talking about things that i invent
but this is also what gods do to depossess humans of their dignity and force them to act as tools, what do i care me about all that hein? im just an individual having individual rights

reply to post by Novise


The basic human drive is to have children - and to have hope.

These two things are innate.

Without hope, we are nothing - and without children we are nothing - I am not saying that people who cannot have children are nothing, I am saying that the human race is programmed to have children because without children we are over, finished, dead.

And without hope, nothing matters any more, so we are also over, finished, dead.

reply to post by kawacat


yes but this is the point, your children are not giving you prosperity and you surely are not thinking themselves lives as conscious individuals, this is illusion that you want to maintain but then you should not be self aware free expressions to say that
this is your choice then animals are programmed not awareness that say its reality objectively even with all the efforts need to do so, like you are aware of

and hope make you sense being true while you know it is a lie, hope is to mean the certainty effect as always better more, but that dont apply on us unfortunately we are ruled by gods egos life and not truth

so enjoying knowing that it would never move for better, and it is just a subjective pleasure of being through god suggestions life, is being literally against truth facts and that is the evil living growth in gods through men lives

Yeah, we're slaves. Always have been.

That's why so many of our corporate and government logos are ancient Egyptian symbols. They never went anywhere. The Pharaohs still rule us, that is why we have a "royal" bloodline.

Slavery has simply evolved. The master no longer whips his donkey to pull the cart, he dangles a carrot in front of it. Plus, when you have billions of slaves instead of thousands, the only way it can be done is to not let them know they're slaves.