Zeitgeist Movement = most hardcore NWO propaganda ever.

Originally posted by TrueTruth
reply to post by dalan.

 

dalan-

I admire your commitment to your beliefs and ideals.

Wow, I take back what I said earlier The TrueTruth. You don't have to stfu after all. But you still have to provide links for your accusations, but you already know that.

IIB, I'm still reading through the vast material your links have provided and I'll be honest it will be a few days before I have a comprehensive reply. I will proceed diligently as I do not want to waste your time by you having to re-answer stuff you have already covered in your multiple links. I have some new ideas based on the reading your provided on trans-humanism. This area is key, it is a game changer and has fundamentally altered my view on the path we need to take. More on this later after I finish going through your objections and idea's. All I can say is these are exciting times.

reply to post by IgnoranceIsntBlisss


Not to mention anything relating to Venus makes me highly suspicious because its the "light bringer" planet related with the pentagram etc etc...Venus and Saturn typically give me bad vibes. Lucifer = light bringer etc...

Not that I believe all that stuff but I know OTHERS believe in that stuff...know what I mean?

reply to post by RestingInPieces


More of a slave than you are to the current system?

Think about your life and what you do in order to live it. Disregard the movie, conspiracy theories, ats, and any other form of nonsense.

Just think about it. We are slaves.

Now, how we go about solving the problem is anyone's guess. However, realize that you are being way to obvious in defending a system you were indoctrinated in. I'm not saying that the Venus project is the way to go, but I will tell you that our current system is not the way to go. Its not sustainable or even sane. To defend it, and to attack an attempt at problem solving is just so so....
Sheepish.

I encourage everyone to do critical thinking outside of this film, this current system, their hard grained beliefs. I encourage everyone to create their own "projects" for humanity. I encourage everyone to sit down and address the social and economic problems that plague our society. I encourage everyone to think of something new, something better....something that can truly make us happy, safe, FREE, and at ease. Forget the Venus project, Forget the Free Market, Forget Socialism, Forget Communism, Forget Keynesian Economics, Forget Competition. Think, and think harmony. Think, and think sustainability. And maybe, the creator of all that is willing, think....think LOVE.

www.infowars.com...

www.youtube.com...

I'm throwing a curve ball into this. I'm not really even one to believe what I'm about to say, but I'll try to be as reasonable and not-crazy-sounding as possible...

So the NWO is backed by Elitists but are probably Satanists. The Theosophy Movement is a Satanic Cult that is trying to create a one world religion by combining all existing religions into one. They claim that TRUTH is the ultimate being and Lucifer is worthy of worship...

“No one will enter the New World Order unless he or she will make a pledge to worship Lucifer. No one will enter the New Age unless he will take a Luciferian Initiation.”

—David Spangler, Director of Planetary Initiative, United Nations

I think they are all Satanists/worshippers of Muloch if you guys believe in the Freemasons being a satanic cult, theosophy is obvious a satanic cult, the whole bohemian grove thing points to our world leaders as Satanists, as well as the Elitists. According to Zeitgeist which lays down the plans for NWO very clearly, they want to usher in a new age, the Age of Aquarius. In this New Age, as Spangler has put it, there will be a One World government, religion, and economy, all of which will worship Satan... The UN will probably be this One World Government, Nato will be the One World Police, and they will probably use the RFIDs for their futuristic resource based economies. I find it highly suspicious that they attack Christianity so falsely and concentratedly, furthering my own skepticism that they are actually Satanists, since they are like the biblical arch enemies of Christianity. Everything in time points this obvious fact, since the times of Rome (Nero), to the Catholics banning the Bible and making it only in latin plus killing people who have copies and all the bull# the Catholics have pulled that completely goes against what the bible teaches such as not praying to dead people, angels, putting anyone on a pedestal like the Pope, ect. The dots are all starting to connect, but I could just be crazy, Idk what do you guys think?

reply to post by TheOneElectric


www.youtube.com...
www.youtube.com...

reply to post by freesprite


The UN Is definitely the apparatus of the NWO, One World Govt. Any time someone points to the World Court to prosecute someone (the libs were chomping at the bit to take Bush to the World Court) is just promoting One World Govt even if they don't realize that's what they are doing.
The Matrix anyone? If the Zeitgeist people are really promoting the idea of a Utopia, no matter how idealistic it is, it's still collectivism, which is communism. Communism failed in the Soviet Union. And why do people keep hoping that if just the right people are doing it, it will be better? What difference does it make if its machines doing all the dirty work so people can enjoy life, or it's dumbed down hamburger flippers who haven't got a hope in the world? It's still collectivism with the Elite at the top. It's the New Old Communism with a different face on it. It's devoid of the integrity and the individualism that made America great. I have heard it said that everything was grey and dull in the old Soviet Union. This is the pall of communism. The soul shrivels up and dies. I think it's great to have machines do heavy work, but someone has to maintain those machines. Any network admin knows what goes into maintaining the network infrastructure to keep 99.999 % uptime.
Atlanteans supposedly had a great deal of technological advancement, and it is said that that that technology advanced faster than their spiritual development.
Somehow we must keep a balance between our spiritual and our technological advancement.

reply to post by IgnoranceIsntBlisss

Do you think people like David Rockefellar would stop at nothing to live forever?

Heh heh, it would save him having to reincarnate over and over into the same bloodline family

reply to post by dalan.


Excellent points on rights of property and our Constitution. It seems this Zeitgeist thing is just another mask on the face of Marxism. Marx himself wrote in the Communist Manifesto that the ultimate goal of Marxism is the abolition of private (bourgeois) property. This is really the heart of the matter. All this Utopian discussion is really about control of the world's resources. Communists hate the bourgeois Capitalists because they amass so much wealth and control the resources, so they try to create a society where no one has private property and everything is divvied up equitably. Unfortunately in a system like that, no one will want to work hard for anything because their needs would (supposedly) be met. This is why Communism fails.

reply to post by someguy420


There is a huge difference between the limited govt our Founding Fathers envisioned, and the World Totalitarian movement of in-your-face domination of every aspect of our lives, eroding our liberties and even the very fabric of the soul. Secular Humanists tend to be more pro-Totalitarianism because it eliminates religion. Karl Marx said that religion was the opiate of the masses. There has been a systematic removal of all things Christian from our society as a result of Marxist cultural social engineering. What are they replacing it with? The Green Agenda of sustainability, which is really more Communism with an environmentalist twist, but in the end, it's still the Elite controlling all the resources of the world. It's a fact. Just google UN Agenda 21.

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
reply to post by someguy420

 

Something tells me that ZM people aren't very well trained in concepts like logistics. And I wish we could get more detail in functionality. Tossing cutsie ideas about a dream world around doesnt mean it will actually function. I'm not even sure what you mean by "we can all shape the world how we all want". You make it sound like the world will be a gigantic video game and we all have a controller. In practice, we'd all be jacked into the thing and it'd be controlling us like non-player characters who all think we're actual characters, as I've been warning about the future of the NWO for years.

I've listed ways and examples of it being communism, please explain how some of these arent. There's lots of material for you to pick from in this thread.

[edit on 29-11-2009 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

Hippies that became yuppies then became zuppies!

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
reply to post by dalan.

 

Excellent points on rights of property and our Constitution. It seems this Zeitgeist thing is just another mask on the face of Marxism. Marx himself wrote in the Communist Manifesto that the ultimate goal of Marxism is the abolition of private (bourgeois) property. This is really the heart of the matter. All this Utopian discussion is really about control of the world's resources. Communists hate the bourgeois Capitalists because they amass so much wealth and control the resources, so they try to create a society where no one has private property and everything is divvied up equitably. Unfortunately in a system like that, no one will want to work hard for anything because their needs would (supposedly) be met. This is why Communism fails.

It certainly took me a while to come to this understanding. I was very much so a supporter of the Zeitgeist movement, but after studying the history of American law I had to change my mind. Now I refuse to support any movement that does not hold the rule of law protecting the rights of the individual as their single most important goal.

There are still aspects that I like about TZM and The Venus Project, I do agree that technology can be applied to dramatically change the lives of people in a positive way; but that is something that can still be done in a lawful republic.

reply to post by dalan.


I think our current government should be completely overhauled and our Constution begun anew but keeping to its bare laws as it was created in Colonial days. Either we should incline our Congress to renew the Old Constitution, or we should and then I think we'd make dramatic progress.

Think about it guys, we have the internet, we have possibly every bit of knowledge that exists since biblical times and even further! If we attempt to rewrite a Constitution, THEN we could either present it to Congress by petition or protest at DC enmasse or if we decide to have a large scale revolution against the Globalists here at the homefront, THEIR homefront to be exact (since Federal Reserve Notes are the world's economy essentially, something like that?). Its easy to conquer a nation, maintaining it is the hard part... If we manage to have a successful rebellion (which I #ing doubt) we could have a head start by already having produced a Constitution. This means a halt to Globalization, Federal Government will permanent have its dick shortened, and power is restored back to the people.

I like the idea, but its a huge undertaking to be had. Well? Either we sit and talk about how #ed we are and how obviously we're being decieved and can't do anything about it, or actually use our time wisely. your call, guys, shall we save and restore the integrity of America?

Yeah, there was a really good thread on here a while back about how the Jesus section was all bs.

a] Yes, TVP is transhumanist. In his book, Jacque actually calls machines the next phase of human evolution. I'm not sure I agree, but it doesn't have me reaching for a shotgun, either. I happen to like computers, personally.

b] There is no inherent relationship that I am aware of, between transhumanism and selfishness. There probably are various reasons why transhumanist ideas would result in less physical, face to face social interaction, yes; but those are primarily technical, and not because transhumanists are inherently antisocial assholes.

c] Yes, Peter Joseph wants power, or did. I identified that fairly early on. One person being a megalomaniac, however, does not necessarily have any relationship with the ideas being discussed.

d] Automated labour is a wonderful idea. Stop and think for a minute; you can either manually chop wood, cook, or build houses yourself, or you can sit on the lawn behind your house, and smoke bowls with your friends, while robots do it for you. I know which of those two scenarios I'd prefer.

Speaking of which, if you have an electric can opener, you're already a user of automated labour. You'd better make sure you smash that with a crowbar to prevent the impending cybernetic revolt.

3. AGI (‘Skynet’) Supercomuters controlling most aspects of politics and society, including rationing global resources to global citizens. If they actually thought this out they'd know that soon enough machines will need more resources than humans.

Skynet wasn't strong AI. It was weak; very smart weak, but (broken) weak nonetheless. It ultimately couldn't adapt to John Connor's guerilla tactics, and it couldn't bring itself to stop mindlessly killing things, because that was what it was programmed to do. If it had succeeded in wiping out humanity, it would have started on feral cats and dogs, next.

Also yes, TVP is Utopian; but again, you say Utopian like it's a bad thing.

6. Cashless (non-backed by Gold/etc) economic system. A ‘Resource Economy’ has been tried before… in the Soviet Union.

Except Communism presupposed the Zero Sum Game; just an equal measure of said scarcity. TVP presupposes abundance. Ergo, people don't get an equal share of a limited amount of stuff, but as much out of an unlimited amount of stuff as they want. That is quite a large difference.

7. Population Control. To meet these targets as policy sounds like a slippery slope to me.

Not at all. Jacque thinks that Earth can sustain 10 billion people with his methods.

8. The global government run by a global 'god-on-earth' AGI computer network

No. Each city would be run by a priority weighted database (an element of weak AI) that is actually called an Expert System.

And that’s what I’ve gathered just glancing over it.

Yes; the level of depth with which you've looked at it, was fairly evident.

It’s already a worshipful, Cult-Of-Personality movement.

Yes, TZM was a cult. When I said so, Peter banned me from the forum, and threatened me with a lawsuit if I went back. Like I said, he had issues; but him having issues doesn't mean that TVP doesn't have good ideas.

Another interesting thing is that he claims that all humans can be re-educated to make them uncompetitive.

I would look at it more, as creating a scenario in which people were given incentives, to channel their competitive tendencies in other directions; like becoming known as someone who is able to produce the most awesome inventions. Competition doesn't *have* to be a bad thing, at all. It just needs to be constructive.

Global Peaceful Unification is the inevitable choice for mankind to the future!

I completely agree. A few years ago someone told me to watch the first Zeitgeist documentary. I started with the religion section and it was just absolute nonsense. So much of it was made-up garbage. I then went through and while watching it did the research to debunk almost 100% of it. The funny thing is that the guy who made it treats astrology like his own personal religion. And his religion section of the "documentary" was claimed to be designed to debunk religion, yet all it does is falsely attack Christianity. Why didn't he go after Islam? Perhaps he's a coward?

Originally posted by petrus4
a] Yes, TVP is transhumanist. In his book, Jacque actually calls machines the next phase of human evolution. I'm not sure I agree, but it doesn't have me reaching for a shotgun, either. I happen to like computers, personally.

Since you like computers that means you should chuck aside your identity and become one?

I know I like food but that doesn't mean i want to be food. But apparently your logic is catching on with all of the reports of cannibalism that have been going on lately. I still haven't checked whether or not theres actually been more incidents than normal or just more reporting on it than normal, but I read one where despite the problems they've been thru in Japan one 'man decided to chop off his genitalia and serve it up gourmet style to a group of people at something like $600 per plate, with a mob of spectators.

b] There is no inherent relationship that I am aware of, between transhumanism and selfishness.

You want to be better, meaning better than everyone else. YOU arent satisfied with your limitations, the same limitations everyone else faces. YOU want to be better. YOU want to live longer. For YOU to live longer other lives will have to be prevented or destroyed. For YOU or every other pperson to be smarter there will be thousands who cannot be, meaning they will never be able to compete with you or even keep up and that's only year 1.

Nothing selfish about transhumanism at all. Taking technologies designed to help disabled people try to keep up with society so YOU can be better, faster and stronger to outperform and outsmart everyone who will not or cannot confrom. Totally altruistic!

Automated labour is a wonderful idea.

Until nobody has a job.

Oh, bring in COMMUNISM! Yeah! It worked every time they tried and now its our turn at last!!

Stop and think for a minute; you can either manually chop wood, cook, or build houses yourself, or you can sit on the lawn behind your house, and smoke bowls with your friends, while robots do it for you.

Until the computer running all aspects of society and resources decides that...
... you're not worth the resources IT needs and its time for you to go.
... there arent enough resources to afford the water etc needed to cultivate the things in the bowl youre trying to smoke.
... there arent enough resources to manufacture the smokng devices you want.
... it's a waste of energy and resources building and operating slave robots to do things you can do and should do for yourself anyways. If you cant clean up after yourself or take care of yourself on a basic human level then some might say you're a "useless piece of skin", and if you think the world should conform to global dictatorial communism so you can be such you might keep that to yourself.

Skynet wasn't strong AI. It was weak; very smart weak, but (broken) weak nonetheless. It ultimately couldn't adapt to John Connor's guerilla tactics, and it couldn't bring itself to stop mindlessly killing things, because that was what it was programmed to do.

]
It's funny seeing you talk 'matter of fact' about the specifics of a technology from a movie saga that hasn't been refered to in said saga in any amount of detail for you to make those statements, but if anything quite the opposite. It's particularly amusing considering the saga hasn't even concluded for you to speak about it in a pure future outcome context. But if you get enough automation in your house to save from having to physically carry containers out to the recycle bin you might get enough time to watch the latest film where they show humans being rounded up for slave labor.

That's pretty smart as I was arguing for years before its release that the smart money would be on The Machine or TPTB deciding that'd it'd be more economically viable to use nanobots to turn the billions of existing humans 'into robots' rather than build all new robots to serve us. I was publishing this concept as a warning long before the 2nd Z film and all that came out.

TVP is Utopian; but again, you say Utopian like it's a bad thing.

Because every single time a Utopia has been attempted it has become a Dystopia.

TVP presupposes abundance.

We have 'abundance'. Cheap food with cheap Chinese products = good news for lazy people. No one can compete with Chinese prices so most of their products stay cheap and crappy. Products cheap and not worth the time to fix coupled with lazy people means wasted resources (AND FOOD). And you want to enable people to be even more lazy?

Meanwhile PJ's "abundance" is a pipe dream fantasy cooked up to put a nice icing on his big power hungry global communistic dictatorship 'cake'.

Read the thread. People begged the PJ'ites to bring data to show the basis of these assertions and nobody did.

Children dream of free candy and toys for life without having to take care of themselves. Some of them grow up, but not all.

Originally posted by gandhi
Your right, lets go backwards and try to live!
line2
line3

Obviously the world would be rid of the likes of you quickly and those like you who take up space. I would love to go back 200 years and live, more peaceful and it would be great. Knowing what I know now, I would know who to assassinate to make the world the place it ought to be.

Ever go camping? Rough it outdoors, hunt and gather your own food, berries, fish and the like? You have no idea what you are missing, technology SUCKS!!!! AND it is not needed nor wanted by many. Diversity in culture and hand grown and hand woven things, hand made things, are the greatest and will never be replaced by anything a machine makes, which is generic and boring.

Originally posted by Professor Tomorrow
David Bentley Hart wrote not too long ago that "postmodernism is the triumph of rhetoric over dialectic;" the ZM is precisely typical of the postmodern way-of-thinking.

What is important, in a culture primed by the messy (but exciting!) philosophy of G. E. Moore's Prinicipia Ethica is the emotive content of any given argument. Consider, ZM is for:

-only good things ever.

-the best things human beings are capable of doing.

...and ZM is against:

-all the bad things that happen to people.

-the worst things human beings are capable of doing.

When queried about the nature of their strategy, ZM supporters seem to think that:

-a totally equitable and scientific scheme to distribute the resources of the planet

-and super high-tech robots

...will solve the twin evils of "all the bad things that happen to people" and "the worst things humans are capable of."

Wow! Amazing post! Brilliant. Spot on.

The entire thing well said!

Damn zeitgeist movement deleted their forum into oblivion.

Thats some serious downturn #. That place was notorious for straight banning any and all dissenters even loyal members that would question any of their tenets critically. the design of their whole scene was PURE Communism, although the front constantly grandstanded that it isnt. I went raising hell in the forum several times, had big old impossible questions thread each time stumping their people when they'd run out of steam I'd call out open challenge peter joseph.... by the next morning id be banned all trace of my activity wiped out LOL. His design is build soviet style 'rational technical society' with AGI computers running every aspect and detail of society, micromanaging each person and every effing molecule of their resource usage in every which way, type bs. or more broadly, everything for years I had already been screaming about darpa nasa google etc silicon valley tech giants technocrat global control grid bs, thats what TZM was championing.

Its interesting to reflect on it post-SJW because seeing them out marching for communism to the tech giants drummer, oh noes no wonder they had to delete their forums in 2015 as i imagine people really started pointing out the parallels.