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Religious Leaders Call for Civil Disobedience if Laws Don’t Respect Faith

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posted on Nov, 23 2009 @ 02:01 AM

A formidable coalition of 150 Catholic, Orthodox and evangelical leaders are calling on Christians in a new manifesto to reject secular authority – and even engage in civil disobedience – if laws force them to accept abortion, same-sex marriage and other ideas that betray their religious beliefs.

On Friday, these leaders released a 4,700-word document – called the "The Manhattan Declaration: A Call of Christian Conscience."

The document was signed by leaders ranging from evangelical leader Chuck Colson to two of the leading Catholic prelates in the U.S., Archbishop Donald Wuerl of Washington, D.C. and Archbishop Timothy Dolan of New York, and calls on Christians to engage in civil disobedience to defend their doctrines.


The Bible tells us to "Obey the leaders appointed above us", in Romans I believe. Someone correct this if I am wrong.


I will not do anything that is morally objectionable to me, whether it is ordered by the Government or not. This action though, comes across as a little harsh to me.

Even in the Marines, we were taught that we did not have to follow orders that were...
1. Illegal
2. Unethical
3. Immoral


[edit on 11/23/2009 by semperfortis]

posted on Nov, 23 2009 @ 02:17 AM

if laws force them to accept abortion, same-sex marriage and other ideas that betray their religious beliefs.

If such laws pass it is God's will, so they basically need to stfu.

posted on Nov, 23 2009 @ 02:31 AM
reply to post by reasonable

HA! That's both funny and True. It always seems to me that that particular Religion is one of the First to Forget 'The Golden Rule'. Not that other Religions don't do it as well, but being an American does not go hand in hand with being Christian.

posted on Nov, 23 2009 @ 02:32 AM
They list abortion and same-sex marriage as a call for disobedience?

The stupid churches need to get there act together and actually focus on the subjects that are ACTUALLY AFFECTING THEM, how does same-sex marriage or abortion affect them in anyway? What's immoral is what our government is doing to our country, and that has little or nothing to do with these petty issues the church listed, Once again this makes me look down on the church even more, shows you just where there priorities are.

Listen up evangelicals, this isn't Iraq or Afghanistan, legislating morals is what will become the downfall of our republic, i'll quote someone.

"Stop trying to legislate morality. You are free to believe what you wish, but forcing an ideological viewpoint through law is detrimental to a free society. People can govern themselves, that was the the original idea here." --Seiko

Crazy far-right religious lunatics.

posted on Nov, 23 2009 @ 02:36 AM
I guess "turn the other cheek" doesn't really apply in todays society anymore.

All this stuff is SUPPOSED to happen, why are the religious trying to suppress the fulfillment of prophecy?

posted on Nov, 23 2009 @ 02:37 AM

Originally posted by reasonable

if laws force them to accept abortion, same-sex marriage and other ideas that betray their religious beliefs.

If such laws pass it is God's will, so they basically need to stfu.

Some religious fanatics would like to live in a country where we have a form of sharia law I guess, where the law has to obide by there religion and if it doesn't...VIOLENCE. This country is going down the crap-hole and the religious right are helping move it along.

Like I said, what does gay marriage or womens rights have anything to do with the Church, this isn't 1700 Britain, this is exactly what our ancestors fought for, freedom of religion, we might as well just be spitting in there face and stomping on there graves. The whole damn world is going back in time.

[edit on 11/23/2009 by Uniceft17]

[edit on 11/23/2009 by Uniceft17]

posted on Nov, 23 2009 @ 02:42 AM
reply to post by Uniceft17

It is a fact that historically the "Christian Puritans" were little different than the Sharia followers of today


posted on Nov, 23 2009 @ 04:03 AM
reply to post by semperfortis

Well everyone has a right to civil disobedience if they want to protest that way and face the consequences, but it's not something I'll be participating in because this is dishonest and someone is hijacking my religion again. The conservatives in fact. That's why they're so quick to bring up Obama and I don't want to here it.

I might be against certain things, so I don't do them, but when it comes to other people especially non-Christians I'm not to judge and am supposed to turn the other cheek. Not force my ways on other people unless of course they wish to convert to God's way, but that's another story.

Of course this is all political. It has nothing to do with religion and these people know it. They are hijacking Jesus to attack Obama and that's crap. Using the name of Jesus to make a political attack on someone is just about unforgivable.

These aren't religious leaders. These are conservative leaders in disguise who've propped themselves right up on a pedestal where they don't belong and they care more about politics than they do God.

If God wants me to protest something then he can come down here and tell me himself. I don't need a bunch of pretenders in night gowns telling me what to do.

Not like I like Obama's politics much either, but this is just TPTB using religion to politically attack a political opponent and if they want to do that, they can do it without me. I don't see any turning of the cheek going on from their part. Just because I believe in Jesus doesn't mean I'm too stupid to see what they're doing.

They want people to commit civil disobedience? Why? Because they don't have the power to do something about their problems so they need backup?

I can understand them not supporting abortion, even though the Bible doesn't really say anything about abortion, but to attack Obama? Why? Because they think a conservative would do better?

They want to blame Obama for abortion, the divorce rates, infidelity, and child birth out of wedlock? Come on? Really?

Hmm, last I checked we've had conservatives in power before. In fact we've had a few Bushes and a Reagan and once upon a time the Republicans even had a majority!

Even though all the conservatives run on these issues time and time again, and promised the people over and over they'll fix these "problems", what have they done again?

The reps had the power. Did they ban abortion even though they promised they would time and time again? Nope. Bush promised and even got RE-ELECTED and still couldn't do it? What, can't he get it done?

Well how long was he planning on waiting? How long do they want me to keep voting rep over and over and over to see no results?

Did they ban infidelity? Did they outlaw unwed mothers and pre-martial sex? (not that I would, but that's not my point) What did they do? NOTHING! They were all re-elected time and time again and did NOTHING about these issues!

And now, NOW that they're out of power and can do even more nothing they want me to help? I have no power? They want to come in and say hey YOU, yeah YOU, you need to protest!

I need to protest? Protest what? For their agenda? So they can get more power while I still sit here underemployed?

I have no power. The conservatives could have changed everything with a swipe of a pen when they had a majority, but instead they started a war and blew every fake dime we had and didn't do one thing about the "issues" so important to them when they had a chance, and now that they've blown it they come back on me and say hey buddy, it's all Obama's fault and whatcha gonna do about it? Seriously? Really?

What am I gonna do about? I'll tell you what I'm going to do about it! I'm gonna vote for Obama again!

I might not support abortion and infidelity, but since the conservatives say they'll do something about it and don't even after they serve multiple terms, well at least Obama is honest. He'll tell you right to your face he supports abortion.

I might not agree with him all the time, but at least I know where Obama stands!

When the church "leaders" actually finds someone in politics that'll do what they say, then they can talk to me about politics and Obama.

[edit on 23-11-2009 by tinfoilman]

[edit on 23-11-2009 by tinfoilman]

posted on Nov, 23 2009 @ 04:51 AM
I remember sitting in a church pew one sunday morning and listening to the preacher talk about how the christian was to live in this world, but not of it. They were to be God's ambassadors to the world..

guess this preacher didn't know too much, huh....
since when do ambassadors start telling the people running the country how to run it, when did they start breaking laws in an attempt to coerce the gov't to run things their way???

it's christ job to built God's kingdom on earth, not the christians, and every time they try to take on this task it just leads to alot of hypocrisy which people eventually point back to when they want to degrade the religion.

Come back to me when the gov't is FORCING YOU into a gay marriage, or abortion, ect.....then I will be happy to do a little civil disobedience on your behalf!

posted on Nov, 23 2009 @ 05:11 AM
Didn't ghandi practice civil disobediance for his beliefs?
Christians have to be more peaceful than Ghandi now?
I guess they don't have a right to civil disobediance anymore. Not like all you other posters. I'm sure you all have your issues. I'm sure you enjoy your right to protest, or to whine about stuff anyways.
People bash christians on these boards so much it actually makes me chuckle.

posted on Nov, 23 2009 @ 07:46 AM
When push comes to shove people will fight for what is closest to their hearts. Obama and his henchmen are hell bent to divide this nation along a secular line. Religious liberties are at stake for all of us.

Perhaps a little civil disobedience is what this administration needs to realize that the voice of the nation has been ignored since his inauguration and people have had enough. This frustration is coming from both sides of the aisle. Plenty of democrats hold true to the fundamental beliefs of their faith.

This is from the source.

"Throughout the centuries, Christianity has taught that civil disobedience is not only permitted, but sometimes required," says the document which cited civil rights icon Martin Luther King and his willingness to go to jail for his beliefs.

"Because we honor justice and the common good," it states, "we will not comply with any edict that purports to compel our institutions to participate in abortions, embryo-destructive research, assisted suicide or euthanasia or any other anti-life act; nor will we bend to any rule purporting to force us to bless immoral sexual partnerships, treat them as marriages or the equivalent, or refrain from proclaiming the truth, as we know it, about morality and immorality and marriage and the family."

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