How can you be 'pro-life' and 'pro-war'

Originally posted by ManBehindTheMask
reply to post by washingtonsghost

 

There in lies the problem tho, its not logic that youre thinking with, its a bias.

You believe that were over there killing babies, which isnt true, sure bad things happen, but were not over there doing that.

no offense intended if i did.

Pro-life seems like a pretty straight forward term. I think it means don't kill people. war means kill people. So if you are pro-life, you can't be pro-war. That is basic logic. Stop making excuses for the HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF CIVILIAN DEATHS, Thats not pro-life. Iraqi casualties

Why are the same "anti war" and "pro choice" crowds in favor for human rights and freedoms for ALL people in this world and not just Americans. But when those same people are asked to shed some blood to give others in this world a chance at those same freedoms they so dearly enjoy and advocate for, they quickly turn yellow and run away with their tails between their legs...?

Originally posted by JohnPhoenix
reply to post by washingtonsghost

 

Are you going to respect life so much that you let another person or country come over to you and have their way with you?

If you and your family was about to be killed by a madman with a butcher knife and all you had was a shotgun are you telling me you would sit there and let this madman kill you and your family - if so, you sure won't be respecting your families life.

It's the same with governments.

I never said I was "pro-life" just that I respect it... And It's not the same with governments, because Iraqi civilians never threatened anybody...

reply to post by washingtonsghost


Wrong, saving the lives of the multitude at the cost of a few IS pro life. I see this just seems to be an Anti War post in the guise of a genuine question looking for answers by your peers.

Youve already made up your mind, and no amount of logic or answers by anyone will change that, or make you think........

So my question is to you, if you have already made up your mind and arent open to any other lines of thought........

Why ask it in the first place?

Originally posted by washingtonsghost
With all the uproar over the potential for state funded abortion, I was wondering where are all these 'pro-lifers' are with regards to the US state funded terrorism in Afghanistan and Iraq? What about the real Iraqi and Afghan children that US tax dollars are killing and injuring in the thousands? I think when God said 'thou shalt not kill' he also meant dont bomb the s@%t out of people. I for one am sick of the hypocrisy!

I think you need to give people more credit. I don't know a single person... even those that buy the 9.11 official line or that we are at war with some mystical group called al Qaeda, that are actually 'pro-war'.

It is however, politically expedient to label all those you may perceive to be your enemies. You wage war on them, they wage war on you, we all wage war on this country or that.

It keeps us busy so that we don't have the time or the will to pay attention to the guy pulling the levers behind the curtains.

Best

Edit: typos







[edit on 16-11-2009 by redoubt]

Originally posted by ManBehindTheMask
reply to post by washingtonsghost

 

Wrong, saving the lives of the multitude at the cost of a few IS pro life.

151,000 is a few? Reminds me of Stalin, "1 death is a tragedy, 1 Million is a statistic." I just don't think you should be pro-life, and pro-war. It doesn't make sense.

Pro lifers are also against social programs that help out when the unwanted child is born. So it's "Thou shalt not kill a collection of cells in YOUR womb, but don't come ask me for a free hand out, you lazy loser!"
Just once I would like to see a person protesting at an abortion clinic say to a young mother, "Keep your child and I will pay for it all the way through college." Don't hold your breathe!!

I am pro-life and anti-war. I have risked my own life over getting a Dr. recommended abortion, but if someone is threatening my family, I'll choose my childrens lives over theirs. I think thats where most pro-war people are coming from. The look at it as self defense because thats what they are told we are in this war for. I don't think they think about the children being killed. They push that out of their minds. They have fallen into the fear mongering trap placed by the media, and think, "Its them or us."
Now do I think those in government perpetrating these wars are truly pro-life? No I don't. They ride that belief knowing if they didn't make the claim they would lose support since most of their voter base would vote for the other guy if they knew the truth.

reply to post by 12GaugePermissionSlip


To be fair there are organizations that offer to raise a child rather then see them aborted. They are few and far between, but they do exist.

reply to post by washingtonsghost


Yeah I dig. Like I said in my first post, civilians should never be targeted.

How can you be pro liberty, and freedom, and yet are unwilling to fight and die to keep it, when some despot moron / religious lunatic, wants to Nuke you, or cut your head off because you don't think the way he does? ( Everyone who enjoys freedom, should be required to defend it...especially when the nation is at war.)

Warfare IS DEATH...stop trying to pussyfoot around that fact. Wars are violence taken to the extreme against oppression, or the resulting reactions from being attacked.

Civilians die. They voted for (usually) the leadership who is taking them to war. They support it. They become the military machinery of their nation. They produce the equipments and supplies, and pay for the war with their national money. It is only right, that they too die. This PC crap about not causing collateral damages is hog wash.

Civilians harbor and conceal the enemy from being found...thus, they are enemies also. Don't want your women and children killed, stop hiding amongst them...

You ambush and kill our personnel and then run and hide with the old, and women and children...we'll level the whole damned village to the dirt, with massive deadly firepower so awful, you'll think HELL on EARTH has come.

What in the HELL is war supposed to be about? Dropping peppermint gum drops on the enemy? Saying to them; "Oh! Pretty please with sugar on top,
(the Obama way, as he bows like a little girl ) don't attack us?

Or, do you send in a full contingency of Americas best mechanized warriors, and then give the enemy a full faced hammer blow to the leadership? Send ing them, and its people the message," You brought this on yourself" Want more? Keep it up!

This garbage about them loving death, and not fearing it, is total bullcrap.
You put the barrel of a .308 to the forehead of some radical terrorist, or enemy, and look him square in the eyes, as you begin to squeeze that trigger, and you'll see his fear of death alright, I guarantee it.

Not every human has the right to exist, if they are out to kill as many non combatants as they can, with road side bombs, car-truck bombs, back pack bombs, vest bombs, hi-jackings, kidnapping hostage taking, and sniper fire...then they are open to being blown to hell. It is that simple. They are spared no quarter, or given any legal rights. Just as painful a death, as they have inflicted upon others.

The cry baby pansies in the USA, who only want to suck on lattes, while hooked to some coffee shop WI FI hookup, and then navigate all the chat sites...criticizing the US efforts to stop terrorism from washing over the USA, make me sick! Yeah, you want your precious freedoms alright, but are to self absorbed, and to full of yourselves, to step up to the plate when the nation needs you most.

Today's men and women who enlist,(volunteer) are the true patriots...those that sacrifice their lives, are the real hero's of the nation. The cry baby pansies...are simpering traitors. It is that black and white to me.

Hoo Rah!

Kill `em all, let God sort `em out!

reply to post by Confused and Dazed!


While I think your post was out of context a bit to the topic, I agree with most everything in it. Get ready for some softies to appear and try to get hard with you though.

How can you be pro abortion and anti death penalty?

I don't know how you could kill a unborn child who have nothing to do with her/his mother going to the bar getting wasted and bringing home the first guy shes sees, but yet be aganist putting to death cold blooded murders who do not wish to be reformed

[edit on 16-11-2009 by Alien Mind]

I am pro-choice but i don't believe in the government funding abortions. I think that should be a personal matter left up to the woman and she should pay for it if that's what she wants. I think the government should stay far away from the abortion issue.

As far as war is concerned I believe in only using it as a very last resort after all other efforts have failed. And even then there should be as few civilian casualties as possible.

But if I had my way there would be no unwanted pregnancies or wars to begin with. Sadly that's not how it is in reality.

[edit on 16-11-2009 by elaine]

Originally posted by 12GaugePermissionSlip
Pro lifers are also against social programs that help out when the unwanted child is born. So it's "Thou shalt not kill a collection of cells in YOUR womb, but don't come ask me for a free hand out, you lazy loser!"
Just once I would like to see a person protesting at an abortion clinic say to a young mother, "Keep your child and I will pay for it all the way through college." Don't hold your breathe!!

Who says pro lifers are againist social programs? You?

I'm pro life and all for social programs (as long as they work).

I think the OP is using the term "Pro-Life" a bit too broadly. That term is used for describing people who believe that aborting babies is wrong. In this context, it does NOT mean "people who dont want to see anyone die".I think that is where the OP is getting confused.


I am Pro-Life. I believe that if a woman spreads her legs and gives consent to have sex, she and her partner are responsible for the consequences. Period. Some may call a fetus just a collection of cells in a womans womb, and that is a correct statement. But that collection of cells happens to be a human being, with rights the same as anyone else. And calling it a "fetus", rather than a "baby", only continues the misconception that it is not a living being with a soul.

In my opinion, the better question is "How can Pro-Abortion folks be Anti-War?" Because they must have lower value to life if they are willing to kill innocent "fetuses" just because they think it was "an accident" that they shouldnt have to own up to. To me, that is much more cold hearted than men killing men on a battlefield.

I think the logic is that it's only OK to kill people *after* they've been born.

The Commandment isn't "Thou shalt not *kill*"; it's "Thou shalt not *MURDER*". Big difference. Murder is unsanctioned killing. In the Bible, God commands people to kill sinners, and to wage wars. Obviously not all killing is forbidden. What is forbidden is killing that is not approved.

I like the old saying, "If you don't believe in abortion, then don't have one".

I always wondered how someone could be 'pro-life' for unborn, but 'pro-death' for adults? Can't have your cake, and all that... I guess it is only 'murder' if doctors and nurses do it? As long as your opposed to abortion, it isn't murder if you kill the people involved with abortions? Somehow that 'logic' doesn't fly.

Chrono

Originally posted by washingtonsghost
With all the uproar over the potential for state funded abortion, I was wondering where are all these 'pro-lifers' are with regards to the US state funded terrorism in Afghanistan and Iraq? What about the real Iraqi and Afghan children that US tax dollars are killing and injuring in the thousands? I think when God said 'thou shalt not kill' he also meant dont bomb the s@%t out of people. I for one am sick of the hypocrisy!

The fact that you can call our MIL operations "State funded terrorism" really shows that you have no understanding of the word "Terrorism", and that you obviously must consider 9/11 to be some "Inside job".

Also, "Pro-War" is a disingenuous misnomer. It is not a fact of being For or Against War, but rather the issue is with being Pro-Action, vs. Pro-Inaction.

Originally posted by Sir Patrick Henry
Will all the ladies please chime in ?

I believe the whole abortion issue is something that men like to talk about and generally ignore the views of women. I'm not pro abortion, but believe there are circumstances where an abortion should be allowed. I know friends who have had abortions and it still scars them to this day, but it's the women who have to go through the pregnancy and bring up the child, most men neglect their responsibilities so most women are left alone to make a heart breaking decision.