European Court of Human Rights Bans Crucifix from Classrooms

Archbishop Paul Cremona said today that the decision by the European Court of Human Rights to ban crucifixes was a new form of censorship.

"We have come to a situation where you can express yourself on everything, except religion," Mgr Cremona said on the PBS programme Bongu.

www.timesofmalta.com...


I take exception to the second statement in the quote. For many generations discussing religion was taboo. As a matter of fact, people were not even allowed to question church doctrine nor a preacher's interpretation and church rules. To do so would mean ostracism.

I think we are just getting started as far as being able to express ourselves and to question many of these religious doctrines that have been subtly enforced upon us through fear and peer pressure.

I must also say that I agree with the Courts decision. I do not think religious icons should be shoved in your face day after day in any environmental setting.



[edit on 6-11-2009 by Alethea]

[edit on 6-11-2009 by Alethea]

Can't read the article...work blocks news sites (but not ATS hehehe). Is this banning in the government? Or are they banning every day folk from wearing a crucifix? The latter I would think is a very egregious example of censorship.

I don't know - I think it might be a good thing to ban all public religious symbols and signs, whatever they may be. Not just crucifixes, but all symbols and clothing that separates one religion from another, or that separates religious from society. Let them practice privately, at home or in their churches, but keep it to themselves.

All too often these religious trappings simply perpetuate the bigotry and violence of intolerance. If you want to be religious, by all means, go right ahead. Just do it at home or in your church.

I don't think this is "censorship". It's just a way of reducing the amount of religious bigotry in society. There is no need to publicly display the symbols of your religion. You can be a good Christian or Muslim or Jew or whatever, without wearing a cross, star and crescent, or Jewish star. If you feel you must wear such an article, do so under your clothes where it isn't publicly visible. How hard - and how harsh - is that?

Well ain't that SSSPPPECCCIIIALLL.

I am sure teaching children making love to an adult is fine.
I am sure teaching children when their 6 that having sex with their same gender is fine and should be encouraged.
I am sure burkas will be fine.
I am sure sharia beheadings will be fine.
I am sure animal sacrifice will be fine.
I am sure Obama worship will be fine.
I am sure fetus soup from China will be a big thing in the Future New World.
I am SURE PEOPLE WILL REJOICE WITH THE DESTRUCTION OF CHRISTIANITY

And so it begins.

They are trying to start a religious war.

Jump on the bandwagons idiots.

We all know you are out their. No need to hide. Tell us how Christians throughout history have rounded up others and killed them. Tell us how Christians have slaughtered 10's of millions of babies. Tell us how Christians killed.......................OH WAIT! I got it wrong, Christians have been rounded up and killed throughout history. Others have killed 10's of millions of babies.

Yes, I believe you can do what you wish with yourself, but so help me. You have no right to tell others what they do!

ALL I HAVE TO SAY---THE ENDISNIGHE

Originally posted by chiron613
I don't know - I think it might be a good thing to ban all public religious symbols and signs, whatever they may be. Not just crucifixes, but all symbols and clothing that separates one religion from another, or that separates religious from society. Let them practice privately, at home or in their churches, but keep it to themselves.

Sure.

That would be great.

Why don't we just ban any sort of identifying marks ?

No religion allowed.

No political inclinations either so no open speech on government.

No cultural diversity allowed.

No clothing or accutrements of ethnic background.

No indicator of sexual orientation so no wedding rings or indicators of any kind that might show which way you swing.

No indicators of where you are from so we all have to wear the same clothes and masks to cover our faces as well as speak in an unaccented world language.

No indicators of wealth or poverty should be allowed so we should all drive identical cars and live in identical, government designed, green leaning, eco friendly homes.

Of course there would be no allowances for identifying or displaying interest so things like book covers and product packaging must be uniform and bland.

Lets just make everybody do all of the same things at the same time in the same way then nobody will be offended by the fact that somebody else is different.

Or we can just make it against the law for anybody to do anything.

reply to post by endisnighe


Took the mouth right out of my words.

I think I will keep my HANS Device around my neck for reasons other than cars and bikes.

I will probably also help protect me from Public Stoning events.

Spot on endisnighe.

i can see you all READ THE DAMN ARTICLE

FROM THE ARTICLE YOU DIDNT READ:
The European Court of Human Rights (the court of the Council of Europe not the EU's European Court of Justice) in its ruling yesterday (Tuesday) said that Italian schools should remove crucifixes from classrooms, sparking uproar in Italy, where such icons are embedded in the national psyche...The court ruling, which Italy said it would appeal, said crucifixes on school walls,

its banning crucifixes.

from being hung on classroom walls. it mentions no other place. read the article. is that so much to ask?

and nice straw men. no crosses in classrooms = teaching pedophilia.



theres no excuse for this type of behavior. ATS is about DENYING ignorance instead of promoting it.
[edit on 5-11-2009 by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest]

[edit on 5-11-2009 by ELECTRICkoolaidZOMBIEtest]

reply to post by Alethea


EU Court of Human Rights Bans Crucifix

At first glance at the title of the thread , i thought it read " EU Court of Human Rights Bans Crucifixion "

Oh thank goodness for that !

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally posted by endisnighe
Well ain't that SSSPPPECCCIIIALLL.

I am sure teaching children making love to an adult is fine.
I am sure teaching children when their 6 that having sex with their same gender is fine and should be encouraged.
I am sure burkas will be fine.
I am sure sharia beheadings will be fine.
I am sure animal sacrifice will be fine.
I am sure Obama worship will be fine.
I am sure fetus soup from China will be a big thing in the Future New World.
I am SURE PEOPLE WILL REJOICE WITH THE DESTRUCTION OF CHRISTIANITY

And so it begins.

They are trying to start a religious war.

Jump on the bandwagons idiots.

We all know you are out their. No need to hide. Tell us how Christians throughout history have rounded up others and killed them. Tell us how Christians have slaughtered 10's of millions of babies. Tell us how Christians killed.......................OH WAIT! I got it wrong, Christians have been rounded up and killed throughout history. Others have killed 10's of millions of babies.

Yes, I believe you can do what you wish with yourself, but so help me. You have no right to tell others what they do!

ALL I HAVE TO SAY---THE ENDISNIGHE

I may be wrong, and correct me if I am but, I'm pretty sure I remember learning about how the Christians torture Jews, and force them into religion. In fact the more that I think about it, Jews have been the ones rounded up and killed throughout history. Also, weren't the Christian Crusades like, dedicated to killing non-Christians? Again, correct me if I'm wrong. I joined this forum to learn.

Originally posted by keeblerelf

I may be wrong, and correct me if I am but....

Yup you are wrong.

Though I am sure you could have easily corrected yourself.

Originally posted by chiron613
I don't know - I think it might be a good thing to ban all public religious symbols and signs, whatever they may be. Not just crucifixes, but all symbols and clothing that separates one religion from another, or that separates religious from society. Let them practice privately, at home or in their churches, but keep it to themselves.

All too often these religious trappings simply perpetuate the bigotry and violence of intolerance. If you want to be religious, by all means, go right ahead. Just do it at home or in your church.

I don't think this is "censorship". It's just a way of reducing the amount of religious bigotry in society. There is no need to publicly display the symbols of your religion. You can be a good Christian or Muslim or Jew or whatever, without wearing a cross, star and crescent, or Jewish star. If you feel you must wear such an article, do so under your clothes where it isn't publicly visible. How hard - and how harsh - is that?

I absolutely agree with everything you said.

As a matter of fact, I think this very agenda you outlined is on the UN "to-do" list.

Also included is no prostelytizing in the public square. Which means people will not be knocking on your doors to give you warnings from their god.

Religious icons have their place. Let them stay in their place.

reply to post by Alethea


You left out an important part from your title.

"...from classrooms"

Also this is the Court of the Council of Europe, and not the EU's European Court of Justice.

Yay, misleading and incorrect titles on ATS!

If the crucifix is banned, so must all other religious symbols be banned - that includes Sikhs wearing turbans, and probably all manner of other things.

I say ban religion altogether because religion has caused more wars than anything else. As well as a lot of suffering.

And churches are built upon false gods.

reply to post by TheWalkingFox


Thank you for the correction.
I edited to reflect my omissions.

I think if we're going to ban religious symbols we should ban all religious symbols not just Christian ones. The Cross isn't technically Christian anyway though, its part of that whole zodiac solar deity deal that Constantine supposedly saw in a vision.

On the one hand the banning of the crucifix seems silly, why should we ban every little thing that might sit wrong with someone? Its not like visually seeing a crucifix is an oppressive thing but at the same time I find it kinda creepy that many of them actually show Jesus on them, staring at a broken man nailed to a cross might send the kids a message about what happens when you step out of line.

My question is what happens when they teach math class and need to draw a plus sign

[edit on 6-11-2009 by Titen-Sxull]

You can believe anything you want, just keep it to yourself and in your home.

Originally posted by damwel
You can believe anything you want, just keep it to yourself and in your home.

When people say they they normally mean You can believe in everything i believe in and if you believe in something else i don't want to hear it or see it?
Athiest's have a different deffinition of free speech. When an athiest speaks nobody should tell him to shut up because that is censorship. If someone talks about religion they should be shot for shoving god in their face and there should be laws preventing them from showing and talking about religion.
Yeah lets try removing all religion from classrooms so we do not offend everyone.

Mrs. Johnson, why did people not accept evolution when the theory first came out?
What book did you read that from? It is not allowed in school! Evolution went over great and nobody said otherwise
Why do our history books have huge sections missing like everything in rome after 313 AD? And why all the AD and BC dates, what does that stand for? And what is with the crusades? It does not say why they were fighting just that everyone was fighting?
Nothing happened in rome after 313, BC and AD are just letters they do not mean anything. Your history book needs to be updated but those crusades never happened

Yeah so removing all religion out of school would be a bad move. Im sure kids woud love being dumber than hell, but at least they would not have religion shoved down their throat. So lets just rewrite some history books so it does not offend any athiests, after all Stalin would rewrite history all the time and he was a great guy. I know he killed some millions of people and was athiest but hey of those millions that lived through his rule none of them had to put up with those christians.