I suggest you think agian after hearing what is happening right now in Michigan. Things are going to get real ugly here over this.

Blue Care Network, a "co-op", basically a State government subsidized non profit health care "company", added "Healthy Blue Living " to their line of standard expensive crappy plans, a few years ago. It was very affordable if you qualified so a huge majority of employers moved to it. There have been private health care companies that have moved out of state because of this.

It wasn't super difficult to qualify, you could basically have one of the "major health issues" over weight, high blood pressure, etc) and still qualify with no snafu. Ok, seemed good, you were being given good rates for remaining relativley healthy.

NOW, that they have gotten most of the state on it, they have upped the requirements on the things most people have an issue with and I bet 75-85% of those currently on it will no longer qualify for it. Oh, they will let you stay on it if you subject to their humiliating, time consuming, requirements like multiple online surveys appraisals, doctors visits every six months or more often, medications, etc. Its designed to either fit you into their "norm", or more likely, to cause you to give up and go back to their crappy expensive plans, now that the competition is out of the way. Fit body builders will NOT meet the requirements of qualification for this plan now!! IT is a NIGHTMARE!!!


So for those of you who still believe obammy, liberals in congress, and the rest of the "do-gooders" that things will be better than before with their new and improved super socialistic health care reform, , it WON"T!!!!! We are Living their dream here now and I can't tell you how infuriating it is (and I don't have any issues other than a little extra weight that I am now being FORCED to lose ).



[edit on 16-10-2009 by I_am_Spartacus]

[edit on 16-10-2009 by I_am_Spartacus]

You're right, we should stay with what's working so great for all of us right now, no change is needed.

-pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

Originally posted by Rhetoric
You're right, we should stay with what's working so great for all of us right now, no change is needed.

-pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

Yep your "name" says it all. I give proof of how it "REALLY" works but no no, we should all just "look away".

Healthy Blue Living is blue cross/blue shield. It is absolutely not government run. It's run by private insurance. I think you have made the case for a public option.

edit: I also notice you starred and flagged yourself.

[edit on 16-10-2009 by damwel]

I dont know, but social security for everybody has been the norm for most western countries for ages now. Its a ethical issue in my opinion. Why live in a society if you are not going to help each other?

Even people living in tribes helped each other when in need. Its the right thing to do. Pretty simple. Yes, you will get people who exploit the system, but the majority wont.


[edit on 18-10-2009 by Copernicus]

So ya want health care controlled by insurance companies who are only out to make a buck and screw you?

That is what we have had up till now and look at what a mess it is.

Without a viable public option to keep their feet to the fire the insurance companies will subvert any change that is made.

[edit on 18-10-2009 by grover]

Originally posted by Copernicus

I dont know, but social security for everybody has been the norm for most western countries for ages now. Its a ethical issue in my opinion. Why live in a society if you are not going to help each other?

Even people living in tribes helped each other when in need. Its the right thing to do. Pretty simple. Yes, you will get people who exploit the system, but the majority wont.


[edit on 18-10-2009 by Copernicus]

Charity should not be mandated by the government!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

A decline in a moral/ethical society and the drop in universal charity is directly proportionate to the decline of religions that preach charity. For all its flaws, religion has its place (and I am not religious)

Government is trying to take religions traditional role and I think this may have been behind the TRUE meaning of our Founding Fathers desire to create a "Separation of Church and State". It was NOT to keep religion out of the state as the modern "liberal" contends but to keep the state out of the role of religion.

Originally posted by grover
So ya want health care controlled by insurance companies who are only out to make a buck and screw you?

That is what we have had up till now and look at what a mess it is.

Without a viable public option to keep their feet to the fire the insurance companies will subvert any change that is made.

[edit on 18-10-2009 by grover]

No the government would never "screw" us.....

Again, the system is mucked up by the government giving the insurance companies preferential treatment, not allowing competition from the doctors and hospitals themselves, setting prices and wages, and allowing rampant abuse of the tort system.

A free system where companies survive based on their merits and good business practices will ultimately provide the lowest priced care for the most amount of people.

A small security blanket system for the very REAL unfortunate is not argued against by most people.

If people have no investment in the system, they will abuse it.

[edit on 18-10-2009 by I_am_Spartacus]

BTW, states can opt anything passed by congress due to their powers as independent states they enjoy, so don't even think that Michigan have to change whatever in the hell they are doing because congress is passing a bill, they have the choice to keep whatever they have right now if that is what the state politicians wants and is enriching their dirty pockets.

If Michigan have a problem that is at state level is the job of the citizens of the state to fix it.

Ge a littler education on how states powers are when it comes to what they do within their borders.

[edit on 18-10-2009 by marg6043]

Excuse me, you're talking to me??? Hmmmm, I think you need to take your own advice and get a "littler education" about REAL state "powers"

First I would like for all of us to at least have our disagreements based on truths.
1. There will be NO government run health care. There might be health care bills PAID for by the government if the bill passes. That in no way means the government will be making health care decisions like our insurance companies currently do by denying coverage.
2. A mandate to have health insurance will be the ultimate screw-over if a public option isn't added in the plan. Insurance companies will be handed 48,000,000 new customers to rape.
3. Socialistic health care programs ALREADY exist in this country and seem to be pretty popular, (Medicare, Medicaid, All Kids, VA, etc) so why not one for everybody else? Are we not important enough? Are we not worthy? If you ask me, Medicaid only for people over 65 is age discrimination.
4. It will NOT be free health care. Everybody will still be expected to pay a premium, only it will be to the government like we do for our taxes that go to pay for cops and firemen.

If we are going to argue about this topic, let's at least argue about facts and truths, and also remember that all these same negative arguments were made about Medicare 40 years ago. (It's socialism, it's unconstitutional, it's the government getting between you and your doctor, etc.) It didn't work then, and I sincerely hope it won't work this time.

Originally posted by Copernicus

Even people living in tribes helped each other when in need. Its the right thing to do. Pretty simple. Yes, you will get people who exploit the system, but the majority wont.

Yes, but the people in the tribes keep 100% of what they make for themselves. They have complete control of what happens to their "earnings". If they don't want to help someone who isn't trying, then they don't have to. But if they see someone in trouble, then they have the choice how and how much to help.