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U.S. to house detained migrants in converted hotels

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posted on Oct, 12 2009 @ 09:10 PM
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Concern over medical care and confinement means illegal aliens get better treatment that the hundreds of thousands of American inmates being "detained" for petty crimes like possession.


The United States, criticized for holding illegal immigrants in overcrowded and poorly run jails, on Tuesday announced plans to convert hotels to detain some noncriminal immigrants.

About 32,000 immigrants to the United States are held at any given time in about 350 local jails and private prisons, which have been criticized for providing poor medical care and oversight.

President Barack Obama is currently seeking support among Democratic and Republican lawmakers to overhaul the broken immigration system in the United States.

He supports offering illegal immigrants in good standing the chance to pay a fine and become citizens, at the same time cracking down on employers hiring undocumented workers and hardening security on the porous Mexico border.

www.reuters.com...

If you get stopped, deny you're a citizen, you get a hotel room or an ankle bracelet.

Makes perfect sense.

jw




posted on Oct, 12 2009 @ 09:34 PM
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I have been thinking of calling myself Juan Juarez Martinez(no downgrading meant) and start looking for a yaub asking for 4 dollars an hour since I cannot find one as myself.

Also, maybe if things get real bad I can turn myself in and get one of these hotel rooms/medical plans.



posted on Oct, 12 2009 @ 09:59 PM
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reply to post by jdub297
 




If you get stopped, deny you're a citizen, you get a hotel room or an ankle bracelet.


You are looking at this in an illogical way.

If you commit a crime you go to jail no matter if you are an immigrant or a citizen.

If an immigrant is caught working illegaly then they get to stay in a hotel until they get deported.

That means that you can't steal something, deny that you are a citizen and stay in a hotel.

Is your hate against immigrants making you not think logically? After all, we are all humans born in the same planet.



posted on Oct, 12 2009 @ 11:03 PM
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reply to post by danielsil18
 
Both of my parents are children of immigrants. Many of my relatives do not speak English.

I and my children are multi-ethnic, and multi-lingual.

You don't even see the hypocrisy in your post, do you?


If you commit a crime you go to jail ... .
If an immigrant is caught working illegaly then they get to stay in a hotel until they get deported.


So, Americans ACCUSED of illegal behavior deserve jail, and aliens CAUGHT here illegally get better treatment!

That's the way YOU want it?

NOTE:
MOST people in jail are either awaiting trial (not guilty of ANYTHING) or guilty of a petty crime (misdemeanor.)

Why should a criminal from another country (as in "illegal immigrant") get preferential treatment?

The only "hate" in this thread is directed at Americans in YOUR posts.

Deny ignorance.

jw



posted on Oct, 12 2009 @ 11:06 PM
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They should be sent to labor camps, rather than hotel rooms. 6 months of hard labor might be an effective deterrent, rather than catch and release, or housing, feeding and giving them medical care. Perhaps Sheriff J. Arpaio could be hired to run them.



posted on Oct, 12 2009 @ 11:26 PM
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I wonder if they get to collect points at the hotel? Then they could use them for free rooms back home!

Is it like the Eagles, "Hotel California"? You can check but never leave...


Kick out all 25 million, (oops officially it's 12 mil), and have some jobs for the 10's of millions out of work.

I am glad they get yet another comfort by our Govt. that will not enforce the laws on the bottom or the top. It's the middle that always get the shaft.



posted on Oct, 12 2009 @ 11:40 PM
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reply to post by j2000
 
To be fair, if the gov't would kick the teeth in of a few of the biggest employers who use illegal alien labor, that would be the biggest deterrent to new ones coming in.

Of course, the administration has issued new orders to STOP all enforcenment action against employers.

So, cops can't enforce the immigration laws, Immigration can't enforce immigration laws, DHS wants to cater to the illegal immigrants.

Any idea what they think about immigration "reform?"

jw



posted on Oct, 12 2009 @ 11:55 PM
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I think the entire illegal immigration situation is being handled the wrong way. You need to discourage them from coming in the first place. Regardless of how you deal with them it's going to cost lots of money and not dealing with them costs money because they don't pay taxes and use services. Cracking down on the businesses who exploit the situation would be a good place to start, take away as many economic incentives as possible.



posted on Oct, 13 2009 @ 07:13 AM
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reply to post by jdub297
 


You still don't get it.

Immigrants come here "illegaly" to work and if they get caught working without papers then they are going to be deported.

Are they criminals? only by law.

If there is a law that says that you can't hugh anyone and you do. Are you a criminal? Did you do something bad?

Same with some immigrants, some come to work. Those are the ones that should not be in jail.

But if someone else commits a crime (steal, kill, rape) then that person should go jail.

What is happening here is that those that don't commit a crime should go to the hotel, and those that commit a crime should go to jail.

It's funny that you say that I'm attacking Americans because I don't separate people by countries like you do. I only see good and bad, not Americans, Brazilians, Europeans or illegal "aliens".



posted on Oct, 13 2009 @ 07:25 AM
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Doesn't the government have plenty of Fema camps around? send the illegals into those female camps after all is my darn tax payer money paying for the luxury of a darn hotel accommodations.

What a whole bunch of crap, here we are facing the worst economic downfall and we the tax payer have to come out with money that we don't have from our pay checks to pay for the corruption going on in government and now the government is slapping us in the face with our own tax payer money to make illegals happy and comfortable.

What a whole bunch of crap.



posted on Oct, 13 2009 @ 08:57 AM
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reply to post by 4ortunate1
 

Cracking down on the businesses who exploit the situation would be a good place to start, take away as many economic incentives as possible.


Really, it is the ONLY place to start.

While we should no doubt continue efforts at isolation and deportation, if it weren't for employers willing to break the law to maiximze profits, there would be NO incentive for anyone to cross the border illegally, except to deliver drugs to their distribution network.

jw



posted on Oct, 13 2009 @ 09:19 AM
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reply to post by danielsil18
 

Immigrants come here "illegaly" to work and if they get caught working without papers then they are going to be deported.

Are they criminals? only by law.


Is there something wrong with you?

If not "only by law," what ELSE makes certain CONDUCT "illegal?"

Illegal describes CONDUCT; it means "against the law."

Please explain what makes some illegal conduct "only by law," and some not. (I will not wait for your explanation, because you never will give one that makes sense.)

Your reply amounts to nothing but senseless blather. It is pure misdirection; an attempt to derail the thread, and you know it.


If there is a law that says that you can't hugh anyone and you do. Are you a criminal? Did you do something bad?


Bad? That's an value judgment.
Criminal? Yes.


Same with some immigrants, some come to work. Those are the ones that should not be in jail.


OK. So, if I have a job, then I can break laws without fear of going to jail.

I want to work (and rob and sell dope, and steal) in YOUR country.


But if someone else commits a crime (steal, kill, rape) then that person should go jail.


By "someone else" you mean those who DON'T "come to work?"

Great. I'll only steal, use dope, when I'm not at work. Sounds like a plan. How do I get there?


What is happening here is that those that don't commit a crime should go to the hotel, and those that commit a crime should go to jail.


So, if coming here without legal documentation is a crime, then a person doing that "should go to jail."

I'm glad we finally agree on this.

I'll enter your imaginary country legally, get work, and NEVER go to jail if I steal, use dope, or rob (as long as I keep my job).

I can't wait. Where are you?

jw



posted on Oct, 13 2009 @ 09:26 AM
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reply to post by marg6043
 

What a whole bunch of crap, here we are facing the worst economic downfall and we the tax payer have to come out with money that we don't have from our pay checks to pay for the corruption going on in government and now the government is slapping us in the face with our own tax payer money to make illegals happy and comfortable.

What a whole bunch of crap.


But it's OK if we pay for their (and everyone else's) health care.

(I think that's the gist of some of your other posts, no?)

jw



posted on Oct, 13 2009 @ 09:34 AM
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reply to post by jdub297
 


NO, sir, I already pay for the health care others is call Medicare and Medicaid, what my husband is getting out of it, guess what his military benefits that are supposed to be protected by congress will be stripped with the health care reform so he has to pay for his own private coverage because that is how government is gong to save more money.

Can I say bend a littler more? for all the tax payers in this nation, I think if I bend a littler bit more I will be folded in half.

My husvand served this country and so most of the males in my family including the three that already die for this nation and we get to be screw by our own government.

Guess what, my friend I happen to be a Latino women that believe illegals are braking the law when they come into this country un invited and without asking for the tax payer in nation permision.

How about that.



posted on Oct, 13 2009 @ 09:48 AM
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reply to post by marg6043
 
Forgive me for my misinterpretation.

I am Hispanic as well, from my mother's side.

We spoke Spanish at home, as did her brothers and sisters.

We never asked the gov't for anything other than defense of the nation and defense of our borders.

I guess we won't even get that anymore now, will we?

Lo siento. Con permiso, por favor.

jw



posted on Oct, 13 2009 @ 10:23 AM
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First off I want to say I'm sorry that things are bad in Mexico or wherever and I do feel bad for the people struggeling to get by.
This however is not our resopnsibility. Our families Are and we're struggeling as well.

Please watch Immigration Gumballs - Immigration by the Numbers; excellent film!

video.google.com...#

END Birthright Citizenship:

Enforcement Through Attrition

www.nafbpo.org...

Can we gently compel illegal aliens to leave?

Yes, and that will leave our enforcement personnel free for the harder tasks of removing them when they won't leave on their own. But to do it will require firm, relentless pressure over a period of years, not months.


The very gradualism of enforcement by attrition makes it an attractive optionin a number of ways. It will work to the advantage of society, employers, the alien himself, and the foreign country to which he is returning. American society will avoid the social shocks that would flow from sudden removal. Employers, knowing what is coming, can plan how they will deal with the new labor model. The alien can plan his own departure, more or less in his own time, and there will be no rending of families (which usually happens when an alien is arrested and refuses to say where the rest of his family is). The foreign countries, particularly Mexico, will have time to realize that they must, at last, make reforms to create a country a person can live in reasonably. In short, it will send a message that the party is over.


Illegal aliens now have nearly free access to all the conveniences of modern life in America. Here are the major ones.

Jobs (although it's illegal) because as a practical matter, the government does not enforce the laws against employing them in any meaningful numbers.
Licenses are freely available to them in most states, from driving to business to fishing.
Places to live are readily available.
Banking services are unrestricted.
Credit, including mortgages, is not only available, it is offered.

We must remove those things from their reach. There are techniques that can be used; here are a few.

Begin a real program of employer sanctions, and make the aliens as well as the employers the targets. No administration since the law went into effect in 1986 has directed the proper agencies to make it happen. When INS was reorganized out of existence and the new Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) assumed its functions the Customs personnel took over most management slots in ICE. Customs personnel have never had any interest in immigration operations and that lack of interest shows now. That must change or it is the single rock upon which this ship of reform will founder.
Levy adminstrative fines against aliens who have illegally take employment. Since 1991, that law has been on the books. It has apparently never been used, and certainly not in any meaningful fashion. Take the profit out of illegal employment by levying fines in the amount that they have earned. Even if it is not collected, the judgment remains outstanding should he return after deportation, and any wages earned at that time are forfeit.
Encourage states and municipalities to pass laws similar to those that have come into vogue recently to control the presence of illegal aliens. When they are sued over them, remove the case to federal court and defend them there, or reimburse the state governments for defending those cases.
No bank (and certainly not one federally chartered) should be able to provide banking services to an alien who cannot prove legal status in the U.S.
No federally-insured or chartered institution should extend credit to someone who cannot prove legal status here, nor should any money from a federal source be passed along or insured.

This approach will work if applied comprehensively. As this is written, Oklahoma and Arizona have laws that make those states unattractive to illegal aliens, and the aliens are leaving them by the thousands. The political battles to make it happen will be awesome, and there will be much rending of garments and gnashing of teeth as adjustments are made, but they will be made. People will become accustomed to the new reality and wonder how we had ever let things get so far out of hand. American will benefit in measurable ways from it.

I like that idea of work camps as well; employers and landlords included.

And to danielsil18:
"Are they criminals? only by law". Yes they Are criminals - by Law and it's past time the law is upheld.

Illegals, Go Home and fix your own laws or make yourself welcome here by following the immigration procedures that Every Country has (even yours) and become an American citizen.
We're sick and tired of families going without in support of criminals; Yes, Criminals...

Prepare your U.S. Citizenship Application Online!
www.immigrationdirect.com...


Downsizing Illegal Immigration
A Strategy of Attrition Through Enforcement
www.cis.org...


ImmigrationCounters.com
provides the key numbers resulting from illegal immigration in the United States.

www.immigrationcounters.com...

Free action tools and Great information:
www.numbersusa.org
www.numbersusa.com

Atrition and NOT hotels

We need More Sheriff Joes' ...



posted on Oct, 13 2009 @ 11:29 AM
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reply to post by AmericanDaughter
 
I agree generally, but fail to see any "attrition" until the flow in is less than the flow out.

To reduce the flow in, aside from border enforcement, the US DoL and DHS must alter their focus.


Begin a real program of employer sanctions, and make the aliens as well as the employers the targets. No administration since the law went into effect in 1986 has directed the proper agencies to make it happen. When INS was reorganized out of existence and the new Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) assumed its functions the Customs personnel took over most management slots in ICE. Customs personnel have never had any interest in immigration operations and that lack of interest shows now. That must change or it is the single rock upon which this ship of reform will founder.


Much as I hate to add to the already overburdened criminal justice system, full enforcement requires criminal charges related to false identification, forged documents, and theft of services.

Tax laws have penalties with teeth.

Until we fully deploy the resources we already have at hand, new "remedies" won't help.

very well thought-out post
s4u

jw



posted on Oct, 13 2009 @ 01:16 PM
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reply to post by jdub297
 




If there is a law that says that you can't hugh anyone and you do. Are you a criminal? Did you do something bad?


Bad? That's an value judgment.
Criminal? Yes.



This is my point.

There are some immigrants that don't do something bad, but they are "criminals" because the law says so.

Should you go to jail for hughing someone just because the law says you are a criminal?

I'm not saying Americans should go to jail for petty crimes, what I'm saying here is that noncriminal immigrants should not go to jail when they haven't done anything bad.

I knew an immigrant who was around 50 from Argentina and he came with a visa. He worked hard for his kids, he never talked bad about someone else. He is a good person that payed taxes, speaked english, stayed here for 9 years but he didn't have papers but he worked everyday.
One day he was taken to jail for weeks to get deported. Let me tell you that he should have never been in jail with someone else that was taken to jail for a petty crime.

There are immigrants that shouldn't be treated like criminals.

Those are the ones I'm talking about.

I know others that do drugs and steal. Those immigrants should go to jail to wait unitl they get deported.



OK. So, if I have a job, then I can break laws without fear of going to jail.
I want to work (and rob and sell dope, and steal) in YOUR country.


Are you saying that all immigrants rob, sell dope and steal?

I'm talking about those that only come here to work and don't do anything bad.



So, if coming here without legal documentation is a crime, then a person doing that "should go to jail."


If they are immigrants paying taxes and don't do anything bad, are they hurting anyone?

But they are still "criminals" because the law says so.



I'll enter your imaginary country legally, get work, and NEVER go to jail if I steal, use dope, or rob (as long as I keep my job).


You completely misunderstood my post. Read my post slowly next time.



posted on Oct, 13 2009 @ 03:14 PM
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Originally posted by danielsil18
reply to post by jdub297
This is my point.
There are some immigrants that don't do something bad, but they are "criminals" because the law says so.


No, your point is that if the only laws aliens break are immigration laws, naturalization laws, and identity theft laws, and forgery/use of false documents laws, and theft by deception laws, then they "don't do something bad."

To come here and earn $$ working, they must represent themselves as someone with a SSI number/card.

If they work "under the table," then they are violating tax and census laws as well.

But, that's not "bad," according to you.

THAT is "your point," no?


Should you go to jail for hughing someone just because the law says you are a criminal?


If the law says "hughing" is illegal, then I guess you do. You must not.


I'm not saying Americans should go to jail for petty crimes, what I'm saying here is that noncriminal immigrants should not go to jail when they haven't done anything bad.


OK. How many, and what kind of laws need to be broken before someone's conduct is "bad?"

What about the guy ho is who he says, has documents, and needs the job the alien "stole?"

This isn't a "victimless crime," or "status offensse," like truancy.



OK. So, if I have a job, then I can break laws without fear of going to jail.
I want to work (and rob and sell dope, and steal) in YOUR country.


Are you saying that all immigrants rob, sell dope and steal?


You don't see the fallcy in your argument, do you?


If they are immigrants paying taxes and don't do anything bad, are they hurting anyone?


Ask the Americans who need jobs: "are they hurting anyone?"


But they are still "criminals" because the law says so.


Can't say it any better than that.


You completely misunderstood my post. Read my post slowly next time.


No, I understand your post perfectly.
You want to ignore the law, and make some criminal behavior legal.

See above. I guess the question REALLY is, "which ones?"

Deny ignorance.

jw







posted on Oct, 13 2009 @ 04:28 PM
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I get it, for you every immigrant sells dope, steal, use false documents, etc.

You can tell me whatever you want about your mother's side being hispanic but that doesn't change how you separate yourself from people born in other countries.

You are angry that they don't applicate to everything that you had to do because you were born here. Anger then leads to hate.



If the law says "hughing" is illegal, then I guess you do. You must not.


Either that or you are a person that would accept any laws a goverment gives you for the exchange of "security".

If hughing is illegal then you should protest about it, not let it be and say "oh well, that's the law"

Maybe when you grow up you will start to be aware that we are all humans born in the same planet.

Looking at their nationality, race, religion, physical apparance as a difference is ignorant, and no those from other countries are not "aliens".



Ask the Americans who need jobs: "are they hurting anyone?"


I have a friend who owns a farm and he hires people to work in the farm. The government one day told him that he would be fined if he didn't fire the immigrants working right there.
Do you know what he told me? He said that he rather have immigrants work there, not because he pays them less, but because they work harder than citizens. They could have three brakes, they would only use one to finish the work while the citizens would not waste one second of their breaks.

In my opinion the good working immigrants only need an ISS number and they are set for everything here and I'm sure they would still take American's jobs because they work hard.

I also here a lot of citizens of how our tax money is wated on immigrants. But the goverment has stolen more. Most of the income tax is spent on the military (what a waste since they can't still find the man in a cave).

The dollar is collapsing and a depression might be coming in a few years.

The least of anyone's complains should be immigrants, that's unless you hate them.

I know how you are because I've met other people with the same thoughts (is it a coincidence that he told me that half of his family is also hispanic?).




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