People on welfare don't have excess money to take them into a productive job in the workforce Ie: education. Day care is expensive and is not available to most on a limited income. Here's my idea. Give those that would like to be day care providers that are on welfare free day care as they are training to be day care workers. Make this avenue public, government run. Like unemployment insurance.

Now that we have people being productive, working towards a solution, day care for welfare recipients, we open it up for those that can have the option for education. Be it computers, hospitality, whatever. The can now be schooled while receiving welfare and day care. The goal is for them to get off welfare, be more productive and have better lives.

There would obviously have to be regulations. People that are fired or quit their jobs wouldn't be allowed. People that are laid off and have proved that they HAVE attempted to get another job once their unemployment insurance has run out will qualify, IF their occupation is outdated.

Some might say that this infringes on the market but it's the opposite. These people couldn't afford day care in the first place. It's a new market, one that is being created to get people off welfare, the public coffers and gives them a better lifestyle. It would mean a short term pay out for a long term gain. Reducing the drain on public money.

Does this make sense?

for this to work you have to make several aasumptions

eveyone who is on welfare, has a kid.

everyone on welfare want to go to go onto higher education/find work

everyone on welfare is able to physcally work.

the amount of people on welfare with kids, who if the majority get back into work. would actually make a significant difference to the public spending on welfare.

its doesn't work out. and is quite and ignorant idea.without seeing any ACTUAL research i dont see this ever being feasable/worth doing.

im suprised to get this from a mod.



[edit on 3-10-2009 by MR BOB]

[edit on 3-10-2009 by MR BOB]

Originally posted by MR BOB
for this to work you have to make several aasumptions

eveyone who is on welfare, has a kid.

everyone on welfare want to go to go onto higher education/find work

everyone on welfare is able to physcally work.

You have to make different assumption. First off that people want to be productive. Want to provide better for their families.

its doesn't work out. and is quite and ignorant idea. im suprised to get this from a mod.

Your point? You would rather have the status quo than looking for solutions? You support no reform to welfare? Public money going out and nothing coming back? What does my being a mod have to do with anything? Do we have a problem?

IF

we were not wasting all the money that went to all those who produce nothing in corporate ameriKa or the the Federal government... including the flavored sugar water proprietors, and all of Goldman-Sachs, including Bernanke and his Puerto Rico Corp. The lobbyists and the whores...but I repeat myself..


AND

were not losing the money taken by every fraudster, scam-man, con-man, ponzi-artist, or scientology center....


AND

If every manufacturer of weapons that create misery - armaments - were to instead create photovoltaic cells..

THEN

There would be enough to feed even those who are unable to feed themselves AND educate everyone who desired it.

But THEN

we would not be slaves

Originally posted by Asktheanimals
depends on whether you want to trust your children in the care of the people who are on welfare. Were it my kids , no.

Trained and certified. This stigma about welfare people is there because of a few. What about those that want to better their families? And society? There's a defined loop that people on welfare get into. Breaking that circle is the only way to deal with this imo. Like I said, make it public, that makes it governable.

Originally posted by intrepid
People on welfare don't have excess money to take them into a productive job in the workforce Ie: education. Day care is expensive and is not available to most on a limited income. Here's my idea. Give those that would like to be day care providers that are on welfare free day care as they are training to be day care workers. Make this avenue public, government run. Like unemployment insurance.

So you want to train people to be day care providers, and give them free day care while doing it? Okay, fair enough. So then, once they're trained, then what? Who pays them? Other parents on welfare (who can't afford day care)? Welfare programs?

Now that we have people being productive, working towards a solution, day care for welfare recipients, we open it up for those that can have the option for education. Be it computers, hospitality, whatever. The can now be schooled while receiving welfare and day care. The goal is for them to get off welfare, be more productive and have better lives.

So in otherwords, we're creating a self-perpetuating day-care system: as more people qualified to be day care providers become day care providers for others who want to be day care providers... ad infinitum.... Or, do you draw a line somewhere and say no more day-care providers?

There would obviously have to be regulations. People that are fired or quit their jobs wouldn't be allowed. People that are laid off and have proved that they HAVE attempted to get another job once their unemployment insurance has run out will qualify, IF their occupation is outdated.

Some might say that this infringes on the market but it's the opposite. These people couldn't afford day care in the first place. It's a new market, one that is being created to get people off welfare, the public coffers and gives them a better lifestyle. It would mean a short term pay out for a long term gain. Reducing the drain on public money.

Does this make sense?

Yeah, it makes sense... and is almost the same system we have in place now.

There is a program called "G.A.I.N." which provides day care for children and career training for recipients, just like you're suggesting. Sad thing is that it doesn't work like intentioned- many people going through the program return to welfare quite quickly. And the problem is not necessarily the job market, though the training received is rarely more than necessary to get minimum wage, but more due to the attitudes and dedication of the participants in the program. They get one job for 20 or so hours, can't make it on that and quickly fall back below the poverty line, out of a job, and back on welfare instead of looking at a second job as an option.

Simple solution. Abolish minimum wage & shut welfare totally down after one year for people that cannot prove physical or mental disability. Give dollar for dollar tax breaks for charitable contributions and provide free vocational training, child care and job placement if satisfactory grades are maintained. Otherwise, The government will pay you an additional 6 months welfare if you are voluntarily sterilized and after that, if you don't want to work you starve.

You would see people get their butts in gear real quick. As far as crime, it would be a problem until the working populace realized they could defend themselves, their families and their property with realistic laws in place. It would be a very painful process for a number of years but this is the only way I see to break the cycle of multi-generational "welfare dependent families" and rid the society of people that will not voluntarily expend the effort to feed themselves and instill an honest work ethic to their offspring.

Sorry for being crass but I am tired punishing a productive society by mandatory support of freeloaders.

Here's a better idea make Welfare a direct tax that is taken out on every individual. Make the tax about 100 dollars a month for every person in this country over 18. It doesn't matter if You have a job or not and the only people that are exempt are the people on welfare. Now if everyone pays and the tax never goes up it leaves a limited pool of money to be put into the system. The more people that get on the system the less money is doled out per person. This will accomplish two things it will make sure everyone pays their fair share and when the pool gets low it will encourage people to go out and find work. The system as it is now is very unfair and the people that suffer are the middle class whom are not eligible for the benefits and pay the highest percentage of their living wage...

My only issue with this is that it leads to larger government, with them having even more influence on my children.

We both know that if "The State" were to enact this, they would somehow, inevitably, carve out a bit more power for themselves.

That being said, my son goes to daycare. I will estimate that his facility has twenty people on staff.

Of this twenty, roughly half have their state certification. The other half are just as caring and loving as the certified, however they are more like teachers helpers. Assisting in getting kids down for naps, pouring juice and mild, heating up foods, lending a hand during bathroom runs, etc...

Perhaps a position like this could be a starting point for any welfare recipients to begin at.

While working as these aides, the state could subsidize training costs for the welfare recipients.

It would have an added bonus of "weeding out" those not truly committed to bettering themselves, by providing a type of work track record.

Those that show up when scheduled, on time, and show a willingness to strive would be kept in the program, maybe even given the option to chose training outside of the childcare profession.

Those that do not show for work, or are just poor employees would be removed from the program before large amounts of public resources were wasted.

At least we'd be receiving something for our dollars.

The biggest problem I see with this is that I would be leery of leaving my children in the care of someone on welfare. Is that biased? Yes. I, however, reserve the right to be biased when I feel it is detrimental to my family to not be biased.

The assumption that welfare recipients want to better themselves is, IMHO, a far stretch. I have (unfortunately) known many welfare families. The vast majority have no drive to better themselves. They may have the desire, but desire without drive is about as useful as nipples on a male hog.

Quite a few don't even have the desire.

Many years ago I was one of those people who felt sorry for the homeless, for the guys holding out the "Will work for food" signs, the people living in poverty. But after I tried many times to help these people, I finally realized that they have no desire to do or be anything more than they are at present.

I have picked up people who wanted to 'work for food', and taken them home to mow a yard for a meal. A small yard, for a fine meal, all tools provided, and we went all out on that meal. What I got was complaints about how the mower wouldn't start (it started fine when I pulled the cord), how they couldn't get it to cut right (even though it cut fine when I pushed it), and how they needed a break after watching me mow the yard. And of course, once I finished mowing my yard and we all got finished eating, I got to take time out to drive them back to their intersection. I would have been better off giving them $20 for a restaurant and mowing the yard myself... I would have taken far less time and I could have actually gotten more done!

I have offered jobs to people who were on welfare. Paid under the table so their benefits wouldn't be cut, easy work, just something to help them out. What I got was no work done, had some stuff stolen, and if something did get done, it was at the expense of a lot more being torn up.

I once befriended a guy who was living under a bridge. I did everything in my power to help him. His response was to try to get me in trouble with the law (by blaming his drugs on me; I was able to avoid trouble thanks to my reputation vs. his), to steal from me, and to finally, after I personally managed to get some past behavior problems smoothed out with the local charity for the homeless, to storm out on those who were giving him a place to live because he wanted a drink!

No, the homeless for the most part are homeless for a reason: they want to be homeless. Those on welfare are on welfare for the most part because they want to be on welfare. I realize that a small percentage are the exception to this rule, but how do you sort through hundreds in order to locate those precious few you can help?

I know people who are not homeless, just of lower income. Most of them have children who will follow in their footsteps, because their attitude toward them is "soon as they hit 18, they're moving out and getting a job". They have no intention of their children going to college or even training for a trade career. They throw a fit if their child needs paper and pencils for school. Now, if they exhibit an attitude that I find repulsive toward their own children, how much more would someone of even lower status have a similar or worse attitude towards someone else's children?

IF you could find that one person out of hundreds who is just down on their luck, your idea would be wonderful. Unfortunately, I don't think you'll find them. And even if you do, you can only help people who want help... and that leaves out the vast majority of welfare recipients.

At least I can give you kudos for trying though.

TheRedneck

I would agree with the idea of government sponsored day care for those on welfare to enable them to receive schooling or even give them daycare while they work if their job doesn't pay enough to allow for it.

BUT and it's a big but, where are the jobs??? There are no jobs for educated people coming out of college, where are you getting the jobs to give to the people to get them off of welfare?