Over-population IS a myth.

Time and time again I see people fall for this all over ATS, increasingly I see people thinking the world is becoming 'over populated'. The NWO puts this out their and people still fall for it. Even if we do suffer more severe droughts, and if global climate change is real. Humans will adapt, that's what we are good out, we make the enviroment around us suit our needs.

The problem isn't over population, the problem is our technology. In the future in envision sky scrapers as tall as the eye can see built specifically for the growing of crops, I see a much more eco concious human race, I see cities the size of new york that float on top of the ocean, and I see more humans living in the ocean than on land.

I don't see this too far off into the future either, within in 60 years I could see things like this happening, I don't envision people living on the moon or mars by then though, I picture that further down the road when we've been able to master technology further. Water will be a key issue over the next century, ocean water distilleries are going to become common sight, and when we master that technology there will be nothing to stop the human race.

The only problem is money, money is the root of all evil, and in the future I see money being obsolete, I don't see any form of money in the future, I see us working together for the betterment of our whole species, working like a hive. Money will become a thing of the past, and when that happens then our problems will become a thing of the past.

I'm sure it's hard to envision their being no money, it's hard for me to, but that is the root of the worlds problems, and our future genenrations will eventually see that and change the system to better suit the betterment of human kind. I hope I see that day, but I still think that's a little far off for my life time.

The floating cities are already being talked about, I'll have to find a link but I saw it on either the history channel or Discovery. I'll check on it.

Overpopulation is not a myth, it's the reality we live in with our current system. Is population control required? No.

However, there is a need to change the system in order for it to support so many of us at one time, this is the problem that has arisen.

There are enough resources for a plethora of humans, scarcity is a myth as well. I think it comes down to what you have discussed.

The removal of money and profit from the system, as well as a move towards eco friendly culture..

~Keeper

reply to post by Uniceft17


Granted, that we have enough space for much more than 6.7 billion. Space isn't the problem. What the problem is the needs of that 6.7 billion. Some of us are lucky that we can get what we "need". Others, are starving and don't have clean water, or even a place to live. I guess its the price they have to pay for us to live in such luxury. But wait a second, they didn't consent to such a thing.

Overpopulation is a Myth. Our planet can sustain at least a hundred if not a thousand times more population at our current level of Technology.

However, increasing population puts demands on changing of patterns, and forsaking living in the manner in which the Western World has grown accustomed to.

The challenges to sustaining a larger population would be the following:

Desalination of Sea Water and Recycling of Water from Waste. We already have both of these...it's just that no one wants to implement them.

Growing Kelp and Algae on the Ocean. Although this may not be necessary if we are willing to give up Farm Subsidies and growing inefficient Agricultural Products such as Corn and Wheat. The United States alone could provide sufficient food to the entire world population, and even to 10x the entire world population by shifting production to different Agricultural products such as Quinoa, Kamut, and Hemp, rediscovering the purpose of Crop Rotation, and using Bio-Dynamic Agricultural methods.

Housing. We can no longer rely on Wood for our primary building material nor can we continue to reside in single-family homes. Multi-generational homes will become a necessity. Arcologies will be the new form of housing for many until we learn to build cities either on the Ocean or under the Ocean surface.

We need to utilize better, more efficient forms of producing Electricity. We already have this in Solar Power and Wind Power. The Chinese have a small, safe and portable Closed-System Nuclear Power Plant that generates no waste, has no risk of melt-down, and cannot be used to create "dirty" bombs. Unfortunately, after the 3-Mile Island and Chernobyl incidents, the word "Nuclear" has a bad rap.

Education is the next biggest difficulty. India is experiencing this first hand right now. If they had enough Educators to instruct their population in basic Agricultural and Infrastructure fields, they could easily sustain their population, but as they do not, they are in a Catch-22.

Waste is the final concern. Our Carbon Footprint and the amount of Waste we generate is sickening. Until we are no longer using Fossil Fuels and Coal, and are recycling more than we consume, this will remain the only true limiting factor to sustaining significantly larger populations. Although the technology exists to do this, changing our habits is the greatest difficulty. Can we give up the latest and greatest gadgets every 3 months and a new Hummer every year? Can we actually sort our garbage and compost what we can and recycle the rest?

Over-population is a myth in idea, but in practice, until we change the way in which we live it is a reality.

Actually without immigration the US population would be declining. We dont have as many kids as our parents or grandparents did. I think the average US household is having something like 1.9 kids. The third world is where the overpopulation is happening.

Originally posted by crw2006
Actually without immigration the US population would be declining. We dont have as many kids as our parents or grandparents did. I think the average US household is having something like 1.9 kids. The third world is where the overpopulation is happening.

Actually it's not just in 3rd world where it's happening......... it's happening right here in England and this is not a 3rd world country

Re-post from another thread::

Having said that, keeping in mind the plethora of conspiracy related topics regarding the who and why of "depopulation" and related nefariousness, I recently ran acroos this fascinating counter-assessment:

Empty Playgrounds: Global Populations in Decline

I found it a fascinating an informative read, one that if accurate, would make a whole range of "depop" and "scarcity" premised conspiracy theories rather moot. And of course could by definition, create a plethora of new considerations and extrapolations.

[edit on 18 Aug 2009 by schrodingers dog]

I already did a gigantic thread on overpopulation:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

The problem is partly space.
All humans do not like living in condos, which is what it would have to come down to.
You all advocating continued human proliferation must be very young and have no love for natural beauty of the world. You must want to see horizon to horizon housing developments.
I really wonder why you think that increasing numbers of humans is such a good thing.

You must be masochists of a high order to wish such punishment on yourselves, and sadists to want to destroy the habitat of our lovely wildlife.
Already the usually harmless Black Bear has been attacking humans because his food supply has to be shared with so many other bears in a much smaller area.

I l ived in the good old days when I could drive from Wisconsin to Florida in 32 hours, and that is sleeping over 2 nites, and on some stretches of 2 lane road I didn't see another car for miles. Going thru Nashville was a breeze, Atlanta was a little trying, and from there on it was clear sailing. Clearwater Beach had clear water and there were no lawn watering restrictions anywhere. Florida had the cleanest air in the Nation.

With our population today, we have factory farms where animals live their whole life shoulder to shoulder, some never see day light' they wallow in their own feces 24/7, and the meat must be treated with chemicals to kill the bacteria so you don't get sick. Your veggies are chemicalized so that you don't even know what the original of the species even tasted like.
YOu douse it with more chemicals to make it palitable which ultimately give you some degenerative disease and you die young. My son has at least 6 of his friends who have died, several who are invalids from conditions that only used to attack old folks.

You know, I really, really hope you get to live for another 50 to 75 years so that you can wallow in you ill thought out wish.
Why don't you visit India....you will get a taste of what it is like to be in an area about the size of the US with a billion or so people. Tell me how you like the stench of human feces that hits you as you step off the plane.
And all those street people who fornicate and defacte on the streets.
Tell me how you like them, or do you have some sort of majical solution to the problem....you are going to give eveyrone a good paying job?

reply to post by fraterormus


Wow - you just made an entire list of assumptions based on no research which is almost entirely fictitious. And rather than just immediately retorting that oh yes you have, you've read lots and blah blah - be really honest with yourself - you haven't read anything of a serious nature which contradicts the world view you WANT to have.

Let me begin - the current production of food by countries such as the US what is known as Industrial farming - it is also the result of several technological breakthroughs in hybridization which averted catastrophic starvation predicted in the 70's through overpopulation and food scarcity.

Last year the world for the first time in many years since this revolution underproduced food.

Further if we were to shift from industrial farming to "sustainable" farming then our output would be more sustainable and environmentally sound but HUGELY less that what it is currently.

Further vast areas of the planet are facing water shortages and over the next two decades there will be a reduction of water supply of such huge magnitude that there will - without doubt - be global endemics of starvation.

Pakistan, northern India and large parts of western China and regions of the "Stans"" all rely on glacial melt water - we are talking hundreds of millions of people who are simply going to starve to death in two to three decades as the glacial melt waters retreat to trickle. You would have to have desalination plants the size of the moon to rectify this.

The American mid west is also going to start returning to the dust bowl it once was - there is a reason why people don't live in the desert.

The Colorado river is no longer a river, but simply an irrigation channel which is being used at full capacity - it is retreating very quickly and the consequences will be massive over the coming years.

Further the artesian basin in India has also been literally drained by cheap pumps from japan over the past two decades - the consequences for this are also going to be catastrophic - the basin is replenished by the monsoon however it is becoming more and more erratic - with devastating flooding which is causing run off (as seen this year) and then years of very low yield.

Further the industrial scale farming, which produces hundreds of times more than traditional, sustainable farming, has also devastated the arable land - vast areas are being lost to salinity and in fact is already dead and relies solely on fertilizer produced from petrochemical production. This is also producing what is known as dead zones - vast tracts of the worlds oceans are dead through fertilizer run off causing algae blooms which in turn feed plankton and bacterial blooms - these starve the ocean of oxygen and kill every living creature in it for hundreds of miles .

Again, the oceans are also being rapaciously depleted with industrial fishing ships, literally permanent floating fish factories dredging the remaining ocean stocks to feed an insatiable global population - there is literally no way we could supply even a small fraction of a percentage of fish the ocean supplies artificially - even then we would do it untold harm, most fish farms already really on fish food which is highly destructive to the ocean both in its origin and its consequences. Tuna, anchovy, sardine, and cod are all at critical levels - these were fish so abundant that one could literally walk across the water on them (see the book Salt). Vast areas of the world rely on the ocean for sustenance, humans evolved along the coast line for a reason -

Further 300 football fields a day are being cleared from Indonesia to make way for Palm oil, the Amazon basin is being decimated for crops and of course beef - both of these areas are tropical, which means the soil is exceptionally fragile and once exposed has only one or two rotations before it is dead.

Further Australia, which has been for a long time a major global grain producer is starting to fail as a producer, drought ravaged this country for well over ten years and is expected to return.

I'm sorry for being so harsh on your assumptions but they are misguided ideological myths which have no basis in reality - what is required to bring about the water and food required to sustain the current human population is literally impossible, the shift required into production and fueling desalination plants and mineral extraction for construnction coupled with the variation in productive labor would send humanity into a cataclysmic pollution spiral, we would be forced back into an agrarian lifestyle of the most impoverished imaginable.

Also be aware that countries such as Japan, Saudi Arabia, UAE and many others have been buying vast areas of fertile countries in the third world for food production - yes literally purchasing the land from the entire nation to ensure their own survival as they know food is going to become major global problem

Here are some resources for you : Please take the time to become informed rather than spreading misguided ideology.

www.redorbit.com...
www.latimes.com...
www.independent.co.uk...
www.theage.com.au...
www.soschildrensvillages.org.uk...
www.abc.net.au...
www.marketoracle.co.uk...
www.wired.com...
www.nytimes.com...

Originally posted by bobbylove321
I already did a gigantic thread on overpopulation:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

And it was the most ridiculous thing I have ever, ever read - pretty much based on the assumption that there is secret technology that will save us, that the whole worlds food supply is monopolized by a nefarious cartel etc,etc,etc will you tell me how old you are ?

Like i have said before,if we used technology to our advantage and spread wealth and resources equally.The earth could support 30 billion people and we would still have plenty of food,clean air,no pollution,lots of land,nice house for everyone and all the modern things we like.Problem is people don't want equality in the world...think of all the bailouts that have happened.Lets just say it amounts to 8 trillion dollars.That sort of money invested properly would create a world that wouldn't be recognizable in 30 years time.

[edit on 18-8-2009 by Solomons]

Originally posted by Solomons
Like i have said before,if we used technology to our advantage and spread wealth and resources equally.The earth could support 30 billion people and we would still have plenty of food,clean air,no pollution,lots of land,nice house for everyone and all the modern things we like.Problem is people don't want equality in the world...think of all the bailouts that have happened.Lets just say it amounts to 6 trillion dollars.That sort of money invested properly would create a world that wouldn't be recognizable in 30 years time.


[edit on 18-8-2009 by Solomons]

Where are you going to get the water from ? The energy to create it, transport it, the resources to manufacture the things we make the energy with that makes the water ? Where are we going to find the land - population projection for 2030 is 10 billion here is the math for the land required

we still need 2.1 global hectares (0.021 km²) in 2050 per average person, we need 10 billion * 2.1 hectares = 10 billion * 0.021 km² = 210,000,000 km². This exceeds the amount of land we have in total by a whopping 6,106,000 km².

from here :
www.abovetopsecret.com...

What is the cost of transferring all our resources into food production, an end to transport, building, medical, etc ?

You people need to wake up to the fact that there is NO overpopulation HERE:
www.youtube.com...

And that changes everything, unless you think kneeling towards Mecca with your ass in the air five times a day is a great way to spend your time.

Originally posted by schrodingers dog
Re-post from another thread::

Having said that, keeping in mind the plethora of conspiracy related topics regarding the who and why of "depopulation" and related nefariousness, I recently ran acroos this fascinating counter-assessment:

Empty Playgrounds: Global Populations in Decline

I found it a fascinating an informative read, one that if accurate, would make a whole range of "depop" and "scarcity" premised conspiracy theories rather moot[/url]. And of course could by definition, create a plethora of new considerations and extrapolations.

[edit on 18 Aug 2009 by schrodingers dog]

Yeah, but we already knew those conspiracy theories were lacking in intelligence.

Good link!

[edit on 19-8-2009 by Tussilago]

im 29 and i have 2 sons, we are starting to work on our third child, we have no problems getting the wife pregnant, my friends are having children, and their friends are having children.

i have studied geografy and demographics, and i agree that we are seeing a decline in the children being born OVERALL in the western contries, we get children later, and we dont get as many.
but i have no fear, my genes are being brought forward, and i am sure that my children will provide me with grandchildren.

there currently is an overpopulation going on, not in the western world, but in africa, south america, india, pakistan, china etc.

reply to post by Tetragrammaton


There is over-population going on here in England!! How many times do i have to say it?

It's the Africans & Pakistanis who are over here now.......

This is not racist chant...... it's the truth.... i see it everyday........

well depends on your pow.. but i agree, that if the stats continue, we as a western civilization will be outbred in our own lands, this has nothing to do with racism, just simple math.

quit the apology re racism.

Truth is truth.

Personally, I think there is something to be said for balancing the races.
There should be a near equal number of each of them.

And they should each have their own lands and be forbidden to live int he lands of another.

i both agree and disagree with this. i believe that the urban areas of the world are extremely overpopulated and the original architecs, never believed that our civilization would reach this size. the only thing that can really be done is to move ourwards beyond the suburbs of metropolitan areas. the only thing with this is you encroach on the natural habitats of millions of species of flora and fauna, and that opens an entirely new can of worms. what i think that we need to do is discover different means of expanding our cities but also protecting the earth and her natural resources. i can believe that i just said that, i am probably the biggest hippie hater in the world and this just made me look like a liberal pussy.