Kennedy bill would make employers provide care

Kennedy bill would make employers provide care

news.yahoo.com

Employers would be required to offer health care to employees or pay a penalty — and all Americans would be guaranteed health insurance — under a draft bill circulated Friday by Sen. Edward M. Kennedy's health committee

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Proposal would require all to have health coverage

So the House is busy putting the finishing touches on their draft of healthcare legislation (due by July 27th), and now the Setate releases their version. Tough luck for small business, the Senate version puts more load on employer then the house version.

The federal-state Medicaid program for the poor would be greatly expanded

The draft doesn't address how this will all be paid for

-E-

news.yahoo.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

[edit on 5-6-2009 by MysterE]

The main glaring question I have which you have addressed in your second post is, where is this money going to come from? China isn't going to finance us unless Timmy can come up with some really convincing voodoo math.

Also, if this passes it will kill small business. Not only that, but they will have other major problems on their hands. Oh well I guess we just have to sit back and see what happens.

I wonder if this will be challenged in court?

Originally posted by Hastobemoretolife
Also, if this passes it will kill small business.

You've got that right!

Small businesses, like my fAmily has owned for 31 years never could afford any health care insurance for our employees, not even me, a member of the family!

This is just going to KILL small businesses if this actually does end up being the "law"!

Killing small business is the point, is it not? America is supposed to fall and this is just another piece of the puzzle.

Good going, you thugs!

reply to post by Keyhole


Yes, it is.

Unfortunately, I have a feeling that everybody that wants universal health care is about to find out the hard way that there will be a huge shortage of doctors also. Less cancer treatment centers, less children hospitals.

I was talking to my mom the other day and she was talking to her doctor and he said if they pass universal health care he's going to take his earnings and run, along with just about all of his colleagues.

If you haven't ever read Atlas Shrugged now would probably be a good time to do it, because the productive class is about to pull a John Galt.

Originally posted by Seeker Mom
Killing small business is the point, is it not? America is supposed to fall and this is just another piece of the puzzle.

Good going, you thugs!

So its OK if small business kills me, the one who makes it able to go overseas on vacation, drive a luxury car, and have the best medical care- while I and my fellow workers go without?

Then small business is injustice.

Now if the US wants to SUBSIDIZE SMALL BUSINESS WORKERS by paying for our health care-

and if the legislation puts a cap on the Ferrari-driving doctors and health administrators-

and if my boss has to sell the second house and BMW to pay for it;

well, since I haven't been able to afford to go see a doc for 20 years-

lets just say I really don't regret voting for Obama-san.

reply to post by Chakotay




If you are working for a small business and you are barely getting paid enough to make ends meet then you're doing something wrong.

I hate to break it you but your own personal failures are not the businesses fault. Also doctors spend 100's of thousands of dollars to pay for medical school and it takes them years to get out of debt.

It's called unintended consequences, and when the wealthy stop working and therefore tax revenue drops to an all time low who is going to pay for all of this?



You have no idea what is coming around the bend if this passes. Meanwhile I will sit back and laugh while I listen to the cries of the progressive movement complain and moan and whine about how this isn't what they wanted.

Edit - grammar

[edit on 6-6-2009 by Hastobemoretolife]

Why is the responsibility on the employer to provide health care? That just seems like a cowardly way to pass the buck on to private enterprise. Also this is going to virtually destroy mom and pop and small businesses who won't be able to compete with bigger companies if they have to additionally provide health care. My parents own a moms and pops sound company (the best concert sound and light company in the world ) and something like this would devastate them. Also in a #ed up economy why are you putting more burden on the private sector. Why doesn't the government just man up and clean up and better regulate the health industry? Oh I forgot we are dealing with the American Government where lobbyists throwing cash at politicians is a major sport.

reply to post by Chakotay


Don't like it? Start your own business. Small business owners reap the rewards because they take the risk to start and run a small business. Man you know nothing about the world above the assembly line.

reply to post by CuriousSkeptic


They don't get it. They think politicians are looking out for us with this plan. What they don't realize and refuse to believe is that special interest are looking over their shoulder while they write this bill telling them what to put in it.

Apparently they think special interest doesn't exist when it comes to writing universal health care policy.

edit - spelling

[edit on 6-6-2009 by Hastobemoretolife]

reply to post by Seeker Mom


I agree with you 100%!

Our government should NOT require ANY business to pay for their employee's health care!

This is just ridiculous!

Especially small businesses that probably make up 90% of our countries businusses, these companies just can't afford it, and I know first hand, my family has run a small business for 31 years but have NEVER been able to even THINK about even offering health insurance to our employees, even me, a member of the family!

Some/a lot of small companies just CAN"T afford that extra burden!

What is the incentive to start a business anymore? Small businesses continually are getting screwed by the government through ridiculous taxes and legislation (the government is making it nearly impossible for new blood in private enterprise) and as a result a lot of the innovation and quality that small business offers is getting killed. Watching my parents sweat it out and have to comply with the ridiculous mandates but forth by the government and everyone of those #ers extorting them has really soured my view of this country. Also you have to think of all the non-mainstream industries. For instance my parents are in the live music business, a industry dominated primarily by small businesses. If this bill goes down, how many businesses in that industry are going to survive more than a year? And that's just one non-mainstream business. This is a horrible idea, and really just the result of ignorance and cowardice on the part of our government. Grow some balls, clean up the health industry, and stop passing the buck.

...how did I get on this soapbox?

If they are going to universalize health care it needs to be done through government-controlled insurance ala Japan or Sweden, and not in this manner.

The only feasible way of making this work is for them to subsidize businesses who cannot afford this, as in most small and many larger companies. Taxes will go up but taxpayers and insured persons already are paying millions of dollars per year to cover the expenses of the uninsured so what is the difference? It would force physicians to lower their costs since they will have to accept a standardized payment scale and the increased oversight would probably decrease the current practice of charging used medications, supplies and services to random patients to cover expenses (which can add thousands to your bill and risks not being covered by insurance depending on what was "done.").

The biggest problems of course would be longer waits to see a doctor for nonemergencies or elective procedures; a decrease in vanity procedures that already are not covered in most private policies; and denial of curative treatment for fatal conditions that cannot be treated or are lifestyle-induced which will decrease costs to the taxpayers.

Originally posted by Keyhole
...Some/a lot of small companies just CAN"T afford that extra burden!

Gee, when they face the facts of their inability to compete and provide a decent standard of living for themselves and their employees, they'll have to go out of business-

and then-

when I and my fellow workers aren't making them rich anymore-

they'll have to go out and get a job-

which if its at a business like theirs was, won't give them healthcare--

unless forced to by legislation.

Wonder if the ex-boss will want healthcare?

reply to post by secretagent woooman


Most physicians are just going to quit the business. They aren't going to be stuck with 100's of thousands worth of debt and no way to pay it back. They will just quit and go do something else.

Just the way it is. Government controlled anything is BAD. Look at Amtrack it was supposed to be profitable in 3 years and that was back in 1970, its just an endless bottomless money pit.

All they don't need to go after the doctors they need to go after the insurance companies. That is where the problem is. I read an article the other day how 60% of Bankruptcy's in the US are due to medical bills. The crazy thing about it is that was a 50% increase in 6 years.

The problem isn't the health care system it is the insurance system is what is broke. This is really really bad nobody will benefit off of this. Also if they would reign in the special interest and if we went to a fair or flat tax people would actually be able to afford stuff.

The problem is that people thing debt is good, and they are so far in debt when a medical emergency hits that it ruins them because they weren't being fiscally responsible. But the media wants to spin into health care is too expensive.

It is only too expensive when they legislate laws that allow them to make it too expensive.

Also medicaid and medicare are grossly over budget now. Universal Insurance or Health Care is the wrong move. The numbers don't lie and every country that has Universal Health Care it always runs over budget. There is noway for them to accurately predict how many and what kind of injuries will happen that year or how many babies get born, etc.

Also we are already broke, there is no money for any of this.

reply to post by Chakotay

Gee, when they face the facts of their inability to compete and provide a decent standard of living for themselves and their employees, they'll have to go out of business-

and then-

when I and my fellow workers aren't making them rich anymore-

they'll have to go out and get a job-

which if its at a business like theirs was, won't give them healthcare--

unless forced to by legislation.

Wonder if the ex-boss will want healthcare?

Wrong, they will just fire you and cut their overhead so they remain profitable. It's the way business works. Also they probably have bank so they can close down the business and go into early retirement.

It isn't the businesses responsibility to make your life comfortable. Making your life comfortable is your responsibility.

While I do agree that companies shouldn't be forced to pay health care....I think we all agree that something has to be changed.

A month ago, I went to the ER and spent roughly 5 hours in the hospital and had a small procedure done....had an x-ray...and 3 shots of painkillers.

I received the bill a week ago. Without insurance it would have cost me 5000 dollars...but even after...I still owe 1000 dollars. Ridiculous right?

Something has to be done with health care. I also don't agree with CEO's of healthcare companies making BILLIONS of dollars a year by not providing health care.

The number one priority of a business is to make a profit....and that is what is happening...at the cost of lives. I don't think the focus of an institution that's REAL purpose is to take care of the general population should be on profits.

I'm not sure what I'd like to see....I don't believe in government controlled health care....but I'd like to see it run by NON PROFIT organizations.

Medicare is unsustainable in it's current form. Something HAS to change.

Prices are far too high and much of that is at FAULT of medicare.

I'd love to see the ELIMINATION of insurance companies altogether....and to have it run by non profit agencies as I stated earlier.

We are a nation controlled by big government and big business. Siding with either is NOT the solution.

Both have to be small...and both should always have the best interests of the American people at heart.

reply to post by David9176


You pretty much got it. Nixon is the one that changed it to allow insurance companies to work for profit. They used to be non-profit. Back before that happened the health care cost was right with everybody else and socialized medicine.

They also need to reign in malpractice suits. That raises costs also. It's just as you said though everything is run by big business and big government. So no matter what kind of plan they draw up its still going to benefit those two entities.

They just need to let us keep more of our money and level the playing field as you said. Simple solutions just profit killers for business and gov. So it is completely off the table.

reply to post by Hastobemoretolife


Dude, read your sig:

"In life you have winners and losers, doers and takers. Doers always win even if they lose and takers always lose even if they win."

Workers are the doers.

There is a Bible Scripture that says,

Do not muzzle the Horse that treads the Wheat that makes your Bread.

Money is not flowing in this economy because the American workers have been strangled in greed.

Problem is, we ain't stoopid workers. We's right smart, and we vote.

And we won. So live with it for four more years.

And we'll keep on makin y'all rich.