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Warning That Pakistan is in Danger of Collapse Within Months

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posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 12:54 PM
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Warning That Pakistan is in Danger of Collapse Within Months


www.commondreams.org

by Paul McGeough Chief Correspondent In Washington

PAKISTAN could collapse within months, one of the more influential counter-insurgency voices in Washington says.

The warning comes as the US scrambles to redeploy its military forces and diplomats in an attempt to stem rising violence and anarchy in Afghanistan and Pakistan.
(visit the link for the full news article)




posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 12:54 PM
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This is a pretty scary scenario. Pakistan is estimated to have over 100 nuclear weapons. Islamic zealotry is mainstream and the government has virtually no control over large swaths of the country.

If the government collapses it's plausible the US would have no other option than to secure their nuclear arsenal. The violence seen in the invasions and occupations of Iraq and Afghanistan would pale in comparison to this possible nightmare.

www.commondreams.org
(visit the link for the full news article)



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 01:17 PM
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Oh just you wait, Obama will fail forward and send more troops in Pakistan, maybe even call for a draft for that or pull a false-flag a few weeks after Pakistan collapse to have a reason to go there.

He said he would go there, HE WILL.



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 01:20 PM
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I've always maintained that Pakistan is on the fast track to becoming another failed, Islamic state in which it will become the perfect breeding ground for radicalism to rear it's ugly head and just mushroom the Middle East's problems into the Indian subcontinent.

Pakistan's being pushed from three sides whichever way you look at it:

1. The Taliban growing ever stronger from their turf and threatening to take hold of not only the autonomous provinces but major cities now.

2. India constantly pointing the finger at Pakistan for every firecracker that goes off.

3. The US not only violating Pakistan's sovereignty by just bombing targets with their borders at will but then demanding that Pakistan "gets it's act together" and starts obeying US directives to combat the problem in Afghanistan, which of course means a huge campaign to clean up insurgency in places like Waziristan.

I've always thought Pakistan is a US Ally simply by necessity, not by way of choice or ideological affirmation.

America's presence in Afghanistan for the meantime, keeps Pakistan relatively stable and gives a much bigger target for the Taliban and radicalists to target.

Pakistan also desperately needs America's arms deals to counter India's large-scale modernisation programme with Russia.


When America leaves Afghanistan (if ever), we're going to see Pakistan slip through the cracks so fast it'll make your head spin and it'll just become another drop in the sea of ex-Allied, Islamic Fundamentalist states like Iran, Iraq and Afghanistan.



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 01:21 PM
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reply to post by milesp
 


well, This time we know there are WMD there , who's to say before Obama's

imperilist army gets to them, they wont be deployed



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 01:24 PM
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Pakistan also desperately needs America's arms deals to counter India's large-scale modernisation programme with Russia.

They don't need America, they have China. And China will willingly sell everything to Pakistan... even if it will increase tensions... after all, who cares if India and China go at it? They both have too many people. Half-kidding.

America gave Pakistan nukes, they should take the nukes with them when they leave. All of them. Anyway, I doubt America will ever leave the middle-east. Even when america is bankrupt, they'll stay there.



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 01:27 PM
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reply to post by Vitchilo
 



They don't need America, they have China.


That relationship constitutes a piss in the ocean compared to the extent of America's arms sales to Pakistan.

Pakistan NEEDS American support and technology. Full stop.

Without it they will wither away and succumb to the vastly superior Indian Force and the insurgency problems plaguing their borders.



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 01:30 PM
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Originally posted by Vitchilo
Oh just you wait, Obama will fail forward and send more troops in Pakistan, maybe even call for a draft for that or pull a false-flag a few weeks after Pakistan collapse to have a reason to go there.

He said he would go there, HE WILL.


Right, my friend. However, I'm afraid he will not have to use a false-flag, this is a republican thing, remember ?
Anyway, for as long as terror-preachers will have the control of the religious schools in those countries, no wonder why 14 year-olds blow themselves up at checkpoints...



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 01:48 PM
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That relationship constitutes a piss in the ocean compared to the extent of America's arms sales to Pakistan.

Well... it's more the US taxpayers paying for it... then the arms are going in Pakistan. Anyway, if the US gets out, maybe China will step in. Anyway, who cares if Pakistan fails and their nukes are taken out of the country?


Without it they will wither away and succumb to the vastly superior Indian Force and the insurgency problems plaguing their borders.

So what? Let India, Iran and China take care of it. It's their area. Here we have Mexico to take care of. They can take care of that (snip) afghanistan/pakistan.

Why would we care? Do we care about Africa? No? So why would we care about Pakistan and Afghanistan? Because this is big bucks for the US militaro industrial complex? Yep.



Right, my friend. However, I'm afraid he will not have to use a false-flag, this is a republican thing, remember ?

A republican thing... well maybe with all the koolaid obamabots are drinking they won't need a false-flag. Clinton talked us into a dozen wars without any false-flag... so yeah.



Anyway, for as long as terror-preachers will have the control of the religious schools in those countries, no wonder why 14 year-olds blow themselves up at checkpoints...

Yep. American foreign policy backfiring once again.


Mod Edit: Profanity/Circumvention Of Censors – Please Review This Link.


[edit on 13-4-2009 by mrwupy]



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 02:04 PM
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reply to post by Vitchilo
 



Anyway, who cares if Pakistan fails and their nukes are taken out of the country?


So you're perfectly fine with the idea of actual, ready to launch Nuclear weapons falling into the hands of Islamic Fundamentalists?

You might be... but this problem will come back to bite the US in the ass if it's not taken care of currently.


Why would we care? Do we care about Africa? No? So why would we care about Pakistan and Afghanistan? Because this is big bucks for the US militaro industrial complex? Yep.


You just answered your own question.

That's precisely it. Our government profits from military sales and exports and our government profits from military contractor operations in Afghanistan.

And Congress is filled with lackeys for the Military-Industrial Complex who pass any motion they can just to see their shares invested in Lockheed Martin, Boeing, Halliburton or Rayethon rise in value.


Yep. American foreign policy backfiring once again.


It will in the future that's for sure.

Pakistan will just go down in history as another former US ally turned arch-rival.



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 02:09 PM
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So you're perfectly fine with the idea of actual, ready to launch Nuclear weapons falling into the hands of Islamic Fundamentalists?

That why I said, ``take out their nukes``... destroy them or bring them over here... no, i'm not that crazy to let them fail with nukes in their hands.



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 02:17 PM
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reply to post by Vitchilo
 



That why I said, ``take out their nukes`


Easier said than done mate.

They're not lying around in the open or in some backwater village where Special Forces can blow them up.


no, i'm not that crazy to let them fail with nukes in their hands.


Why do we have to be responsible for creating another failed state?

The American Invasion unleashed the fury of the Taliban on Pakistan and no you're content with just packing up and moving on and letting Pakistan deal with the mess the US started?

Bit contradictory there.

Funny how our Allies in need never get any help from us, but those that aren't get all the help in the world. *ahem* Israel.

[edit on 13/4/09 by The Godfather of Conspira]



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 02:28 PM
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Guys, let's not forget the past and present.

The U.S. installed Musharraf as a dictator in Pakistan while he had less than 4% of votes.
After installing a puppet govt. into Pakistan the people got angry and many are now what you call "islamic fundamentalists".

Many say that islamic terroism started when the U.S. installed the Shah of Iran.

I'm sorry, but just blaming "islamic fundamentalists" is barely even being on-topic.

What is so obvious to many in the middle-east and to many here on ATS and the rest of the world is simply ignored or denied by many or most Americans, with the help of dumbed-down corporate news media that isn’t much interested in discussing such issues.

Although I do understand everyone's stance on the issue it's just damn sad to take this position, despite it making sense.

It's like Country A puts an airborn virus into Country B, and everyone in Country B either attacks each other, and those not infected fights Country A. So country A says "let's bomb the hell out of these savages".

It's not right man.



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 02:54 PM
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So this is possible the real reason for troop deployment in the Afghanistan, I don't believe they need so many troops to keep insergeants at bay and keep the poppy conveyor flowing. With an estimated 100 thousand on the ground, international forces in Afghanistan by July we could be looking at a few search and retrieve ops. Of course we won't find them all the Bilderbergers will be planning the ground zero points although I'm no too sure what the endgame will be surely all we can do is secure the area and enforce some kind of governance, unless they wanna spread bird flu there. Pakistan is listed as a easily contagious country, with a population of 179 million.

Anywho CIA World Factbook - Pakistan



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 03:10 PM
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They're not lying around in the open or in some backwater village where Special Forces can blow them up.

Well I heard that they were guarded by US special forces. Anyway, if you can destroy a country, you can surely get those nukes out of there, there's only about 60s. Or sabotage them.

And the CFR called for 100.000 more troops in Afghanistan. So you can bet that Obama will ultimately send 100.000 troops, now he's at +31.000.



Why do we have to be responsible for creating another failed state?

Well it's american policy. The US is doing everything it can to bolster the extremists. Bombing civilians without any regards for anything.



The American Invasion unleashed the fury of the Taliban on Pakistan and no you're content with just packing up and moving on and letting Pakistan deal with the mess the US started?

I'm in Canada and my brother is in Afghanistan, do I want him to die so they can continue their bankrupt and corrupt BS? No thank you. American policy backfired in Iraq, it led to an invasion and 6 years and counting of occupation... do you want that in Pakistan, a country with much more people, much more extremist and the resistance much better armed?

An occupation of Pakistan? That's what you want? Because that's what will be needed in the end if you don't want Pakistan to fail. IMO the cost is too great, but eh, I'm not a general in the Pentagon.

But in principle, I agree with you that the Talibans are among the worst human beings on the planet.. that and the wahabists saudis. If america was really for humans rights, they would stop being friendly with Saudi Arabia. Saudi Arabia is just another Pakistan, but the dictatorship is holding.

[edit on 13-4-2009 by Vitchilo]



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 03:19 PM
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I'm no military or psychological expert, but what did we expect to happen when we have drones bombing the "terrorists" over the Afghani border? Did we think the Pakistani people would simply overlook bombs and missles dropping on their heads?

Let's say Russia was flying drones over to the U.S. to take out insurgents here, and our government wouldn't do anything to stop it... wouldn't we do the same thing and try to take our government out of power? If our government did nothing to stop it, I would expect an overthrow.

Oh, yeah... if we do go into Pakistan, where are our troops going to come from? I'd bet we get sucked into sending troops into the Israel-Iran war that seems more and more likely by the day, and Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Iraq. Do you think they'll reinstate the draft? I'm not fighting for the this government. With they way our Gov. is treating us now, why should I?



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 03:56 PM
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reply to post by spitefulgod
 



I don't believe they need so many troops to keep insergeants at bay and keep the poppy conveyor flowing. With an estimated 100 thousand on the ground, international forces in Afghanistan by July we could be looking at a few search and retrieve ops.


Think again.



Notice the most dangerous parts of Afghanistan are the regions bordering Pakistan.

It doesn't matter how many boots we have on the ground, the Taliban are staging all their operations out of Pakistan now.

Everytime we manage to uproot them from a particularly territory, they simply cross the border, re-arm and regroup and come back to reclaim their old positions from Coalition forces.

Solution to this problem requires the effective clearing out of the Pakistani autonomous provinces via a large campaign to isolate the Taliban into just Afghanistan and pin them down. The borders would also need to have far stricter security placed on them.

This of course though has about as much chance of happening as hell freezing over.

Pakistan's sovereignty is continually violated by covert US attacks which serve little purpose except to aggravate the Pakistanis and make them less motivated to cooperate with the US in performing operations within their borders.



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 05:38 PM
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reply to post by The Godfather of Conspira
 


Good Ole mighty where have you been. Pakistan created the Teliban and still gives them orders today, The U.S. has even said this of late but now Obama wants to give them 5 billion dollars for weapons.

This crap is not a war, Its a sick game that these punks are playing. Obama has said that he will now only send four thousand troops into A-stan not 30,000. They just want to string this crap along while our good men die.

If we wanted to take out Pakistan's nukes that are sitting in plane hangers we could easily do so with our stealth bombers or fighters as overflights by them happen all the time.

I'm waiting on the war here at home because the crap going on overseas now is nothing compared to whats coming soon. ICBMs will be our response to Pakistan when all this hits the fan if they make one dumb move.



posted on Apr, 13 2009 @ 05:48 PM
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reply to post by Sky watcher
 




Good Ole mighty where have you been.


Miss me?
No need to answer that one.


Pakistan created the Teliban and still gives them orders today,


Indeed, the Pakistani ISI was effectively the enabler of the Afghan Mujahideen during the Soviet Invasion. In fact, the Soviets maintained they directly clashed with Pakistani Special Forces (known as the "Black Storks") numerous times during the 1980's, and they found evidence of the Pakistani government directly funding, aiding and training them.

Many of the same brothers who formed the Mujahideen are now part of the Taliban.


They just want to string this crap along while our good men die.


Lot of money to be made out there to line the pockets of those shareholders of Halliburton, Blackwater, Rayethon, Lockheed, Boeing and ExxonMobil all sitting in Congress.



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