Chemtrail flights or regular military operations?

Or I suppose it could be some sort of flight school for civilian pilots. Anyway, this phot was taken in Richmond, Va.



It shows what I've been witnessing for the past two years. Several, usually 3, cargo/passenger aircraft flying circles in formation, one following the other. When I zoomed in on one of the aircraft it appeared to be a Boeing 737. I can not make out a logo but the tail appears to be all black. I assumed they were military cargo aircraft on training missions in the MOA over central Virginia.

The flights are almost always laying down trails. I'm not too sure about chemtrails, I need more solid proof, but if there are governemntal spraying operations, these damn sure fit the bill.

Anybody have any idea? I tried calling the AF National Guard but could only get a recording.

Probably a holding pattern. You didn't give any details of what's nearby but there are several innocent explanations to what you're seeing. I can think of several airlines that have dark tails and fly twin jets similar to a 737.

Those are actually called contrails.

If the government were spraying anything, they would use crop-dusters at night or early in the morning, flying at low altitudes, under the guise of spraying for Japanese beetles or mosquitos.

No, don't think it's a holding pattern. It's near Richmond Virginia and the airport doesn't see that much traffic. Plus it only happens in the afternoon.

reply to post by Jack Jouett


Holding patterns aren't necessarily over the airport that they're landing at. They wouldn't be that high if they were landing at Richmond and you are that close to the airport. They start their decent way out from the airport, so Richmond would be the LAST airport they would be landing at. They could be in a holding pattern for either National or Dulles in Washington. That would be a much more likely airport for them to be holding for, but it could even be for an airport farther North or South.

Early morning, and afternoon are when some areas see more weather delays. Morning due to fog afternoon due to thunderstorms that form as the day goes on. There are also flight patterns for that particular airport to take into account, they may have more flights come in during the afternoon so you see more delays then.

[edit on 3/11/2009 by Zaphod58]

I don't think planes in a holding pattern would be flying that closely. And I've never seen just one plane doing circles, like I said it's always been at least three.

Nice shot. Yes, these are chemtrails. One just need to look up.

Starred and flagged.

reply to post by Jack Jouett


Gday there

It certainly looks like a holding pattern.

Can I ask what date and time this was taken, so I can check it against the upper air observations to see if contrails were likely?

It was either March 7th or 8th I don't remember. It was taken in the afternoon, around 4:00 pm

How many flights hold a pattern at cruising altitude?

Or maybe these are low level contrails.

Ok, thanks

Im posting the upper air observations taken from one of the weather balloon soundings from Virginia on those days. Just posting the information from crusing/ holding altitudes that are likely.

400.0 7380 -26.9 -30.7 70 0.75 270 67 319.9 322.7 320.1
386.8 7620 -28.9 -33.1 67 0.61 270 62 320.4 322.7 320.6
370.6 7925 -31.4 -36.2 63 0.47 265 62 321.0 322.8 321.1
370.0 7938 -31.5 -36.3 62 0.47 265 62 321.0 322.8 321.1
336.0 8614 -36.1 -40.9 61 0.32 265 70 323.7 325.0 323.8
311.0 9144 -40.7 -45.7 59 0.21 265 77 324.5 325.3 324.5
300.0 9390 -42.9 -47.9 58 0.17 265 77 324.8 325.5 324.8
250.0 10590 -53.1 -58.1 54 0.06 270 86 327.0 327.2 327.0
223.0 11317 -59.9 -64.9 52 0.03 275 89 327.4 327.5 327.4
202.0 11929 -64.9 -69.9 50 0.02 280 91 328.9 329.0 328.9
200.0 11990 -64.9 -69.9 50 0.02 280 91 329.8 329.9 329.8
192.0 12237 -65.7 -70.7 50 0.01 275 94 332.4 332.5 332.4
190.0 12301 -63.3 -68.3 51 0.02 275 95 337.3 337.4 337.3
186.0 12432 -61.5 -66.5 51 0.03 275 96 342.2 342.4 342.2
179.0 12669 -61.7 -67.7 45 0.02 275 99 345.7 345.8 345.7
174.0 12843 -62.9 -68.9 44 0.02 275 100 346.5 346.6 346.5
170.0 12986 -62.1 -68.1 44 0.02 275 102 350.1 350.2 350.1
166.7 13106 -61.5 -67.5 45 0.03 275 102 353.2 353.3 353.2
164.0 13207 -60.9 -66.9 45 0.03 275 96 355.8 355.9 355.8
159.0 13399 -61.5 -67.5 45 0.03 275 85 357.9 358.1 357.9
158.7 13411 -61.4 -67.4 45 0.03 275 84 358.2 358.4 358.3
154.0 13597 -60.3 -66.3 45 0.03 275 84 363.2 363.4 363.3
150.0 13760 -60.3 -66.3 45 0.03 275 84 366.0 366.2 366.0
147.0 13886 -60.3 -67.3 39 0.03 276 83 368.1 368.3 368.1

As you can see the data points to very likely contrail development. The key is the temperature (third column) and the relative humidity (fifth column). The temperature needs to be below -35 degrees and the humidity needs to be about 60%. There is a small chance that contrails will persist, (over an hour) but its not very likely with these conditions.

So if the plane was flying in between 300 and 400 hectopascals (first column) then this is why you saw a trail

Hope that helps

reply to post by doctordoom


Flights hold at whatever altitude ATC tells them to hold at. If they are still a good distance away from their destination ATC is not going to have them descend just to hold and then climb back to their cruising altitude. There is absolutely nothing in any FAR that says holding patterns have to be low altitude.

Chemtrail flights or regular military operations?

hmm... or is it that chemtrail flights ARE normal military operations?

2nd line




EDIT for quote adding

[edit on 12-3-2009 by mostlyspoons]