Russian Navy Sinks Chinese Cargo Ship

What do you think about this incident? Could this lead to something bigger? The relationship between China and Russia is already very much heated up.

A Chinese cargo ship was fired by a Russian cruiser and sank off the water last Sunday near Russia's far-eastern port of Vladivostok. Eight out of 16 crew members on board were saved while the others remain missing.

The New Star was pursued out of port in Nakhodka in the Siberian Far East on Sunday by a Russian naval vessel which believed it was involved in smuggling. The pursuing ship fired at least 500 rounds, forcing it to turn back to port, but it sank on the way.

Link to the full story: www.telegraph.co.uk...

Link: en.wikinews.org...

Article with video: www.liveleak.com...








[edit on 19-2-2009 by thegreatobserver]

That could be interesting. But I have to correct you... Russia and China are good friends... for now.

Wait and see.

reply to post by Vitchilo


You are right, they improved their relationship to each other. Here some information on the relationship to each other. It's in above mentioned article.

The incident will cast a shadow over generally improving relations between the two countries, who have a long history of mutual distrust following border skirmishes in the 1960s. The two signed a major oil-for-loans deal earlier this week.

Russia and China have drawn closer in recent years, largely as a strategic alliance to counterbalance what both see as bullying American hegemony.
With four central Asian nations they have set up a regional security grouping, the Shanghai Cooperation Organisation, which some see as a future counterweight to Nato and which is due to meet next month in Moscow to discuss the situation in Afghanistan.

[edit on 19-2-2009 by thegreatobserver]

Really speaks to the gunner of the New Soviet navy. 500 rounds? Sheesh

Originally posted by FredT
Really speaks to the gunner of the New Soviet navy. 500 rounds? Sheesh

It could have been 500 rounds from a Phalanx-type weapon with a insane rate of fire (50+ a second according to wiki)

...that freighter hull would have been turned into a seive in a blink of an eye

This story tells you one thing: don't mess with Russians!
They don't even ask....

this sounds like a arrested vessel case.

Types of Improper Seizures
The most common type of improper seizure is one which results from a charter dispute. Usually, the charterer claims to have been wronged by the shipowner and has the ship seized by improperly influencing a local court. Also common are improper seizures which result from a dispute with a shore entity such as a chandler, agent, or stevedore. In almost every case, the claimant has a clandestine connection to the court, either through a local confederate or by paying a bribe. This type of seizure does not occur in well-regarded maritime jurisdictions due to counter-security requirements and sanctions available for wrongful arrest, but in other areas, such as Africa, South-East Asia and South America, fraudulent seizures are common.

Locals Benefit at the Shipowner's Expense
A shipowner must realize that no one loses when his ship is seized except himself and the crew. Local agents, lawyers, chandlers, ship-suppliers, and even the port itself (through dock fees, etc.) all benefit from the ship's arrest. The only reason why all ships don't get seized in corrupt ports is that local receivers would protest if shipowners refused to sail to the port due to hostile conditions.
Freeing Ships the Traditional Way
Usually the shipowner manages to free his vessel by resolving the underlying dispute and obtaining a release of claim—even if the owner is totally innocent. Sometimes even this will not satisfy the local interested parties, including the agent and the court. Often, the shipowner's only option is capitulation.


The last resort in some cases is for the ship captain to make a run for it.

In this case the corrupt port athoritys had the russian navy to back them.

www.vesselextractions.com...

Russian news are reporting that the reason why the Russian Border Guards intercepted the ship was because it left the Russian port of Nakhodka without permission. In doing so the ship's crew was in violation of international law, and had to stop and return to port immediately when contacted by the border guards.

Legally speaking the Russian border ships had every right to fire on the vessel after it did not heed multiple warnings and flares. China or whoever operated that ship have no legal recourse against Russian.

What is not clear is what exactly caused the ship to sink. It is very very unlikely that flares, tracers, or even machinegun rounds could cause a ship of that size to sink. Far more plausible is that it sank due to bad weather conditions.

Originally posted by FredT
Really speaks to the gunner of the New Soviet navy. 500 rounds? Sheesh

There is no New Soviet navy. Nor was this ship intercepted or fired on by a Russian navy. I have no idea why the article mentions "Russian cruiser" either.

It was the Russian Border Guards who intercepted the ship and fired. They are not part of the navy, and they do not operate the same equipment. They mostly have patrol boats armed with heavy machine guns.

reply to post by ANNED


It would be interesting to see if that is indeed the case. Wouldn't surprise me. However in terms of international maritime laws, the Russians' actions are still legal. The ship cannot leave Russian jurisdiction if not granted permission to do so by the government, and if it does leave it can be intercepted. The videos accompanying this story also show that multiple radio warnings in english were send to try and stop the ship peacefully, as well as flares fired.

Oh, this is gonna be interesting indeed!

Originally posted by thegreatobserver
This story tells you one thing: don't mess with Russians!
They don't even ask....

The chinese don't like to be insulted. Really they don't.


I would love to see who come up at the top, the chinese or the russians.

Oh, this is gonna be interesting indeed!

Hardly. If it was ever going to be an international incident it would be all over CNN and BBC by now. Read between the lines and don't be so naive.

Originally posted by sy.gunson
If it was ever going to be an international incident it would be all over CNN and BBC by now.

It doesn't matter whether it'll be an international incident (have CNN exposure) or not. This issue will be discussed mostly in private I believe, how the chinese react is surely will be interesting to me. (It's for me to know and for you to figure out).

Of note is the fact that such an event has escaped the media in the United States. If you study International Law, the sinking of a civilian ship by a uniformed armed force is considered an act of war. There has certainly been no love lost between the Chinese and the Russians for many years. They share a common border and the Russians have no desire for the Chinese to begin an offensive across that border which would endanger their petroleum fields. This incident bears watching closely. In numerous other articles on the Internet, the spin has centered around a "poor quality rice" transaction that went bad while in others the issue of smuggling has been raised and there is even banter about the cargo having WMD content. Such spin certainly provides fear mongers with ammunition to attempt to terrorize society. No good can come of it.

Originally posted by maloy
Russian news are reporting that the reason why the Russian Border Guards intercepted the ship was because it left the Russian port of Nakhodka without permission. In doing so the ship's crew was in violation of international law, and had to stop and return to port immediately when contacted by the border guards.

Legally speaking the Russian border ships had every right to fire on the vessel after it did not heed multiple warnings and flares. China or whoever operated that ship have no legal recourse against Russian.

What is not clear is what exactly caused the ship to sink. It is very very unlikely that flares, tracers, or even machinegun rounds could cause a ship of that size to sink. Far more plausible is that it sank due to bad weather conditions.

Originally posted by FredT
Really speaks to the gunner of the New Soviet navy. 500 rounds? Sheesh

There is no New Soviet navy. Nor was this ship intercepted or fired on by a Russian navy. I have no idea why the article mentions "Russian cruiser" either.

It was the Russian Border Guards who intercepted the ship and fired. They are not part of the navy, and they do not operate the same equipment. They mostly have patrol boats armed with heavy machine guns.

Actually, they do operate some of the same equipment, such as Krivak III frigates and other patrol vessels with larger caliber guns.
www.hazegray.org...

More than likely it took hits from a 100mm gun altho 500 does seem a bit high.


[edit on 10-3-2009 by Sakanas]