Mozart's 40th symphony at a speed faster than light

reply to post by stander


You are funny. You're making stuff up as you go along, and believing it. It would be even more funny if it wasn't making ATS look pretty bad.

Originally posted by science lol

Originally posted by whitewave
The reason I ask is because Mozart lived 1756-1791 (or somewhere around then) and would most surely have used the 432 pitch since, as you pointed out, the 440 pitch was not adopted until 1925.

Why do you suggest he had A tuned to 432 Hz? en.wikipedia.org...(music) gives no mention of this ever being used. Neither does www.uk-piano.org...

Also I'd like to suggest that there is nothing special about Mozart's music, it was just used to give an example of the fact that actual 'information' in the form of music was able to be transmitted faster than light.

[edit on 18-11-2008 by science lol]

As far as I know Mozart played 432 Hertz.
The speed of light = 432 x 432 = 186624 miles / second.

I am wondering if this new invention is related to this thread:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Mozart had a lot of secrets still unknown until today.
Maybe he used some other frequencies.


[edit on 18-11-2008 by hawk123]

reply to post by hawk123


No, the speed of light is 186,282.397 miles per second, not 186,624.

reply to post by whitewave

There were several pitches pegged to A note to go by during Mozart's lifetime. The pitches varied considerably and the flute makers had to decide what pitch to use. That's why flutists had at least three instruments ready if they wanted to play elsewhere then in the the region where a particular A pitch was recognized. By the way, the symphonies performed at that time didn't really sound the way we hear them now played with state-of-art instruments.

It's only obvious that the standardization of the A pitch would take place and one particular wind instrument could be used to play in orchestras around the world. When the American music industry decided on the frequency of the standard pitch used in the country, the choice could be arbitrary, but it was not. Here is how they decided:

Classical musical composition relies on harmony, which is supplied by four basic voices: baryton, tenor, alto and soprano. The number of these voices was used for the first digit of the standard pitch. The rest of the standard frequency was arrived at the way I have already described: The Western musical scale comprises 13 notes, and so the musicologists wanted to append 13 to 4 resulting in standard pitch 413 Hz. But this decision met with objections due to the notoriety of number 13 -- the bad luck number. Since the scale comprises 5 chromatic and 8 diatonic notes, the musicologists decided to avoid the number 13 by multiplying 5 by 8, and appended the result to the first digit 4, and the standard pitch 440 Hz was born. So the standard pitch has two constituents: 4 and 40 where

4 = number of basic voices
40 = 5 x 8 = chromatic times diatonic notes.

Eventually the rest of the world adopted this pitch to tune the instruments.

Albert Einstein adopted the 440 Hz pitch sooner and re-tuned his violin accordingly. He knew how it came about, and as a genius, he knew that 440 can be expressed as 4[5 x 8] to reflect on the origin of the pitch. But the digits 458 looked familiar to him; it was like deja-vu. So he put the inequality symbols between the digits,

4 < 5 < 8

as any mathematician would do to analyze the figure. The 440.

This recognition led to Einstein's famous quote: "God doesn't play dice with the universe."

Albert Einstein was positive that it was the case, because "dice" is not a musical instrument.

If Albert Enstein looked to the right for the clue to the nature of 458, he couldn't find anything, but he didn't because of his ingenious idea to relate the digits to each other as 4 < 5 < 8. This led to another of his quotes: Any fool can make things bigger, more complex, and more violent. It takes a touch of genius -- and a lot of courage -- to move in the opposite direction.

Of course, Albert Einstein didn't know anything about quantum tunneling and the very strange occurrences waiting in the future to ambush the unbreakable speed of light.

Here is the question that haunted Einstein till his end days: If God doesn't play dice, what does he play? Flute?




[edit on 11/18/2008 by stander]

reply to post by stander


I am, but not in your case.

You can find whatever you desire in numbers to support your argument, just as literary works like the Bible can be used in every conceivable manner to support the popular ideas of the times.

I have been to Oz to see the wizard before.

Originally posted by Matyas
reply to post by stander

 

I am, but not in your case.

You can find whatever you desire in numbers to support your argument, just as literary works like the Bible can be used in every conceivable manner to support the popular ideas of the times.

I have been to Oz to see the wizard before.

That's why Stephen Hawking's paper theories are nothing but a religion. His number-supported theories about singularities and the end of the universe means nothing. It has only meaning to those willing to mindlessly accept his arguments, because he is one of the cardinals of the Scientific Church -- an authority.

reply to post by stander


He's not using them in an arbitrary fashion devoid of any factual basis. He's a scientist, not some pseudomystic.

Get a grip, man!

reply to post by hawk123


Tell me how a bunch of people playing string and wind instruments, conducted by a man with a stick, decide how many hertz they play at.

reply to post by rikk7111

It wouldnt sound to crazy in 1930, maybe to your average Joe but Nikola Tesla already had concepts of that nature 30 years earlier.

Originally posted by dave420
reply to post by stander

 

He's not using them in an arbitrary fashion devoid of any factual basis. He's a scientist, not some pseudomystic.

Get a grip, man!

Aha. Now we entered the "factual basis" territory. Does this term also apply to the occassion where a frequency measuring device reads 440 Hz when musicians play A4 on their instruments?

Your Bible comparision that you made in your next-to-last post is an illegal thought, because there is no evidence that all the interpretations of events described in that book really took place -- no "factual basis." Why don't you learn how to properly apply the terms that you come up with, if you want to use them as an argument?

Originally posted by Cyberbian
This is the reason I do not believe this story. It is simply too easy to implement a working device, and apparently no one has bothered to do that for many years.

Proven by scientific paper... Again the truth is hidden in plain sight-

Let those who are knowledgable implement a working device I say....

MoonMine

I think I need to understand first element 137 and the Feynman constant.

After that I need to switch to element 139.
Element 139 would still have electrons moving faster than light.

See Thread:
www.abovetopsecret.com...
with topic posted by a703o on 15-10-2008 @ 10:30 AM


[edit on 2-12-2008 by hawk123]

I have a book in my library titled The Stars; How to Know Them and to Use Them, with Copious Astronomical Definitions and Numerous Problems and Tables: Illustrated with Diagrams and Four Large Maps of the Stars. by W. H. Rosser, se, London, E. By James Imray and Son, chart publishers and nautical booksellers, 89 and 102 Minories. 1874. Wherein, the speed of light is listed at 191,500 miles per second.

Something to chew on for a while.

299,792,458 meters/440=681346.495454545454545454545
299,792,458 meters/432=693964.023138148148148148148

186,282 miles/440=423.368181818181818181818
186,282 miles/432=431.208333333333333333333


Aren't numbers fun? They numb me real good.

The speed of music depends on the concert pitch.

Say what now?
I was taught during the "Cert IV Music (Technical Production)" course at TAFE that:

Definition of sound
Sound is an Acoustic Kinetic energy.
A Complex series of waves travelling through a medium (usually air)
at a speed of 344 metres per second,
At a rate of 20-20,000 complete cycles per second,
At sea level,
Above 0dB/SPL,
Within the temperature range 15-18 degrees Celsius &
a relative humidity of 18%.

So sound itself is not defined by concert pitch, the frequency of cycles will increase but that does not imply the speed of distance travelled will be effected.

Music on the other hand, a compositions speed would be defined by the composer no?

"I feel like dancing, I'll take this music I wrote at in A=432Hz to a 86BPM drum beat and double the speed re-synchronising with the 72BPM drum beat at 172BPM...oh look its still A=432Hz!"

Perhaps it is a failure to comprehend on my part but it would appear instead that what you posted makes no sense. :O could it be your intent was to publish disinfo irrespective of your karmic responsibilities!!! :O
most likely.

Since the Western musical scale -- the building material that a composition is made of -- comprises 5 chromatic and 8 diatonic notes, and 5 x 8 = 40, the standard pitch frequency must end with number 40. Hence A = 440 Hz.

I've never heard of this 'western scale',
a composition is 'built' with whatever scale you want it to be.
The most common are pentatonic & even then often only a few notes will get used in a song...

5 chromatic & 8 diatonic?
as far as i'm aware:
'chromatic scale' contains all TWELVE notes in an octave,

'diatonic scale' refers mainly to the "Major[happy]Scale"
(white keys on piano) and a couple others that use predominantly white keys.

where the F*ck did you get 5+8 notes (13)
in an scale when there's only 12semitones/notes to choose from?

Disinformationalistik falsifier of truth. For shame.

I could continue to quote another dozen or so things from that same post that made no sense whatsoever but personally I think your just talking bollocks and having a good laugh at everyone who took the time to seriously consider what you had to say. Even your numerology (if you could call it that) bears little relationship to any numerological evidence I've ever witnessed anywhere else.

you sir, bad hat.

P.L.U.R.I
-B.Morrison [FF]

[edit on 7/8/09 by B.Morrison]

I wonder if this experiment could be reversed? Could you capture faster than light waves and transduce them down to audible sound? Wouldn't it be amazing if the universe were full of music and information?

Hi Stander

Actually the Sinfonia in g-Minor (completed July 10th 1788) also known as K. 550 is not #40 at all (although commonly called that !) but actually it should be numbered Sinfonia #62 since we have discovered at least 25 new Sinfonias (written between 1764 and 1777) since Koechel did his Catalogue and removed 3 young Sinfonias from the earlier original Koechel List as (2 of them) having been composed by one of his London mentors and teachers, Karl Friedrich Abel (both of these mis-attributed copies were dated from 1765) and one composed by his father Leopold Mozart in 1769 for the Lambach Monastery (the socalled Alte Lambach Sinfonia which Koechel ascribed to young Mozart, the son).

So all your numerological theories about 40s pertaining to Mozartean Sinfonias are totally in errore, sorry, at least as it pertains to this particular Sinfonia !

Mozart was able apparently to add Clarinets to the original score in 1789 (ink studies support this theory) which if true, means he must have heard it performed in his lifetime several times...why else would be change the orchestration so specifically for 2 Clarinetti---contrary to the popular mythological story among the masses for centuries that the great genius himself somehow never heard his last (3) Sinfonias performed live...!!

Let's stick to facts, shall we?



[edit on 6-8-2009 by Sigismundus]

Originally posted by stander

Aha. Now we entered the "factual basis" territory. Does this term also apply to the occassion where a frequency measuring device reads 440 Hz when musicians play A4 on their instruments?

Yes thats a fact, well done. But it was not a fact under dispute, your arguement reads like "my red balloon is god" someone reply's "your balloon isn't god" and then your defence "yes but it is a balloon, ha I win!"

Can everyone see that this guy could be intentionally talking nonsense to waste your time & have a good laugh at your expense? just a thought....

Your Bible comparision that you made in your next-to-last post is an illegal thought,

This I have a real problem with.
You could have chosen several ways to express what you wanted to say there..
"didn't abide by his own terms" for example....
but you choose to go with illegal thought....
Interesting....

Why don't you learn how to properly apply the terms that you come up with, if you want to use them as an argument?

the guy never broke his own terms,
you misread.

His argument was that YOUR METHOD is comparable
to the same METHOD used when people cite bible phrases
to explain ANYTHING, whether it makes sense or not...
or something like that,
Point is he wasn't using the bible in his own argument the way you say he did.
This is obvious to anyone who actually reads the post.

Originally posted by Sigismundus
Let's stick to facts, shall we?

agreed,

Although I perosnally doubt 'stander' ever had the intent of communicating any factual information when he started this thread. I still stand by the idea that this whole thread is stander's little joke on the ATS community.

Which bothers me because a joke is a joke unless it is never revealed as such and then its disinformative bordering on cruel at the most & at least it is easily detrimental to the cause of 'denying ignorance'.

Despite several factual posts made by different people arguing against
your clearly inaccurate information, new viewers of this thread are still being duped, so what happened to denying ignorance?

I'm an idealist granted, but it seems to me that standers behaviour & investigative method goes against everything that ATS stands for.

Its a shame people are letting him do it.

P.L.U.R.I
-B.Morrison. [FF]

[edit on 7/8/09 by B.Morrison]

[edit on 7/8/09 by B.Morrison]