Missing Aircraft Designations

Anyone heard of the F-13 or F-19 designations? They've never been used to my knowledge and the F-13 is said to have not been used for conspiracy reasons.

Since when did our government become worried about conspiracies? They're the ones covering things up from the public... whether or not now there will be an F-13 I don't know does anyone else?

Find more information on this here:
www.designation-systems.net...

The F-19 was a Navy plane produced by Lockheed at the same time as the F-117A. They built 62 of them and as far as I know there has never been any information released on it. It was the airplane that General Bond was killed in mid 80's. It had some stability problems. Haven't heard of the F-13.


john lear

As I do remember lear... that's something that I'm gonna look into. Thanks.

Originally posted by Shugo
As I do remember lear... that's something that I'm gonna look into. Thanks.

At the time they said that Gen. Bond was in a Mig 23 but he was in the F-19.

I remember hearing something about the F-19 designation not being used due to the MiG-19.

However, one problem I find with this thory... is that we have the F-15 and similar fighters. That and I find it hard to mess up a MiG-19 with an F-19.

I do have an F-19 model with the name of the F-19 Tomahawk. Whether it's real I don't know. But, the look between the F-19 Computer Model and this die-cast model is immense.

Originally posted by Shugo
I remember hearing something about the F-19 designation not being used due to the MiG-19.

However, one problem I find with this thory... is that we have the F-15 and similar fighters. That and I find it hard to mess up a MiG-19 with an F-19.

I do have an F-19 model with the name of the F-19 Tomahawk. Whether it's real I don't know. But, the look between the F-19 Computer Model and this die-cast model is immense.

Is that the Testor's model?

No it was a basic model you could get a the Cracker Barrel Gift Shop. It wasn't a special type of model.

Originally posted by Shugo
No it was a basic model you could get a the Cracker Barrel Gift Shop. It wasn't a special type of model.

OK. I remember that one. The F-19 was a bat wing shaped aircraft with the same engine, landing gear etc. of the F-117A. That way Lockheed could obscure its developement alongside the F-117A.

Originally I thought they were calling the Northrop Have Blue Prototype the YF-19 there for allowing it to be used as F-19.

"F-13
The designation F-13 was definitely not used. The Navy's F-14 Tomcat fighter would have received this number, but F-13 was rejected by Grumman and/or the Navy (obviously for superstitious reasons). Since that time (late 1960s), it is an unwritten rule that "-13" designators are always skipped. This eventually also lead to the omission of C-13, G-13 and V-13."

This sounds pretty straight foward. I mean there would be allot of people that wouldnt go on an airplane with the number 13 on it, even pilots. The same thing happens sometimes with floors in big buildings, hotelrooms or some people even make their kids be 12, 2 years in a row before they turn 14. Its a crazy world out there.

The F-19 you can go and get yourself, though I miss the point to this thread. Why hide designations if you want to build a secret plane? That would just make it more obvious
that there is a plane missing or hidden.

Flame

I know... but, since when were all of the AirForce, Navy, and the rest of the government worried about 13 designations.

I still don't buy the F-13 conspiracy... I'm looking further into it.

I'll ask my uncle, hes a Nam vet and is now still flying troops to Kuwait (allthough hes a captain by Delta Airlines). I vagley recall a conversation between him, my dad and me about this and I'm preaty shure he said something about the F-13. I could take a couple of days though as he is a busy man.

Originally posted by TheDarkFlame
I'll ask my uncle, hes a Nam vet and is now still flying troops to Kuwait (allthough hes a captain by Delta Airlines). I vagley recall a conversation between him, my dad and me about this and I'm preaty shure he said something about the F-13. I could take a couple of days though as he is a busy man.

I understand... that'd be great if you could get me some information. Like I said... I find it hard to believe the US Air Force would frown upon making an aircraft with the designation being F-13. The government upon all of its cover ups does not seem to be the type that would cancel out a designation just because of a little conspiracy.

Check out the following site which chronciles US military aircraft designation since its beginnings. The system most people think of is the current Combined Services System which started in 1962

www.driko.org...

As regards F-19 it says in the end notes
The F-19 designation is rumored to have been skipped in order to promote the F-20 as a "new generation" fighter. This has since been confirmed by Andreas Parsch through an FOIA request to the DoD. Apparently, Northrop requested the number "20" versus "19" to avoid a confusion with the MiG-19, which may sound a little unusual, but is apparently the case. See Andreas Parch's excellent summary of "unknown designations" for a more complete explanation. The F-19 was earlier assumed to be the designation for the Lockheed Stealth Fighter, now properly known as the F-117A. By skipping the F-19 designation, the U.S. was able to truthfully deny any knowledge of an "F-19 Stealth Fighter." (See note 12 for possible explanations of the F-117 designation)

As for F-13 one of the older system does use it.

Thanks for the site popeye.

Although it is stated in a good majority of sites. I still do not believe that the USAF's real reason for no F-19 designation was because of the MiG-19's. Though I may be wrong in this theory I still find that hard to believe, but thanks for that site. It helps.

"F-19 - No such animal. It is officially undocumented, but generally assumed that the F-19 designation was skipped in 1982 in order to honor the Northrop F-20 (qv) with an even "next-generation" number.

Striving to keep pace with technology, Testors hit the market with an F-19 kit based on eyewitness reports from "usually reliable sources," research, gut level guesswork, and patterned it after the smooth-surfaced Lockheed SR-71. By May 1986 their kit was on hobby shop shelves and nearly 700,000 were sold in 18 months. However, somebody had pulled a plug in the Pentagon.

Stealth technology at the time was one of our military's worst-kept secrets, and it was assumed that F-19 had been reserved for that department. There was so much speculation that the USAF, with uncommon humor, even roped off a vacant plot at the 1988 Edwards AFB Air Show with a sign identifying the "F-19 Flying Frisbee." But when the much-heralded stealth fighter was designated F-117A and was anything but smooth, the F-19 idea lost most of its lustre, and folks generally accepted that the designation had been purposely skipped when F-20 showed up.

Yet, much like with those little green men they scraped off the Roswell landscape, folklore and wishful thinking took hold, and there came many reports from "usually reliable sources" who saw the real Testors F-19 flying around in remote desert regions usually off-limits to reliable sources. (Because of the popularity of the designation, the USAF Museum's Internet page lists a "Lockheed F-19 CSIRS," but its link connects the F-117A.) (� K O Eckland)"

Interesting Link: www.csd.uwo.ca...

Originally posted by Shugo
I know... but, since when were all of the AirForce, Navy, and the rest of the government worried about 13 designations.

I still don't buy the F-13 conspiracy... I'm looking further into it.

The decision not to use the number 13 has nothing to do with a conspiracy. It's based on superstition. There is a difference. The government has been worried about it as long as the people they lead have been worried about it. They are representative of us. Or at least that's the theory...

Like TDF said, it's the same reason hotels don't have a thirteenth floor or rooms numbered 13.

[Edited on 25-3-2004 by DeltaChaos]

Thanks a lot ShadowMan... some great info there.

I had heard of the F-19 actually going to be an F-19 as previously posted, (with the description of the model).

Delta... then what superstition has the government ever believed in? And if it's courtisy, when did the government begin caring about courtisy?

No problem, as i keep looking i keep getting some good information for you Heres a link to the paper model of the f-19 and some more information on it
www.fiddlersgreen.net...
When you get to the page after your done reading you can click "f19 main page" at the top and you can "buy and download" the paper model i guess if you like it that much

Wanna fly the f-19? heres the simulator takegame.com...

[Edited on 25-3-2004 by ShadowMan]

Nice stuff. I'm not interested enough in the models to buy it though I seem to have 4 die-casts now.

I do see some differences between how this model which is described, and the models that I have.

The model has a relation and apperance to Aurora XST.

Description:

Long and narrow... with point round front flaps (wings, whatever) near the cockpit.

The wings are a rounded delta that fold down a decent way and the ends about 170 degrees.

Very short tail fin wings.

And the 4 engines on the top of it.

No idea right at this moment... what the heck it is supposed to be. But, like I stated I was told the F-19 Tomahawk.

I haven't found a description matching this either.