Russia: Poland risks attack because of US missiles

reply to post by dariousg


Leaving Oil aside, somewhat, Russian trade deficit is a mere 1.3 billion compared to the ~750 billion that the US boasts. There is really no way for us to ever, realistically, get this figure under control. We've lost the majority of our export manufacturing base. Now i'm not saying that Russia is the golden boy or anything, but they've maintained reasonable trade deficits, and we have not. We are already experiencing a ~5% inflation rate, not considering food/energy, which everyone knows would put us at a much higher rate.

About the only 'booming' industry we have is the military industrial complex, which might explain our love of staying at war. We're a service based economy now, all of the manufacturing of 'goods' are now in the hands of India/China/Japan. We still have a strong agriculture base though (IMHO).

People loosing equity in homes, most Americans in debt for 15-30 years, paying for outstanding wars, low interest rates. Unemployment is on an upward slope, ~6% right now. Americans are being pressured to keep consuming, because if we start to save we go into a deep recession, maybe worse.

All of these stimulus packs, and corp. bailouts are just going to make things worse for us in the long run. We're living beyond our means, with a currency that's only as good as it's exchange rate. The dollar is at an all time low and energy is at an all time high (with a short rally as of late).

Inflation is going to be the killer in the next couple years, regardless of another silly war.

I'm sure things in Russia aren't exactly 'peachy', but they seem to have been living within their means and slowly building back up their strength. All the while we appear to be fine on the outside, but on the inside we're being slowly hollowed out until we will soon collapse.

IMHO of course...


I'm sorry i realize now this is very much off topic. Feel free to move it, delete it or whatever, i should have taken it to u2u.

My Bad yo!

[edit on 15-8-2008 by Blacknapkins]

Originally posted by swesais
Well I live next to Russia,and my country have suffered enough of those oliberators. Believe me,Russia is the same USSR that she was 18 years ago. Those generals, and all other military stucktures are the same as in USSR, only they call them self diferent. FSB is the same KGB, the same personal, the same methods. And of course moust post Soviet countrys like mine will always choose oposite of Russia. And not because we so much like Western,but because we have seen what is Russia ans russians capable. This is teh reason why all ex-soviet country want to be in NATO and why they want missiles and foreign army in its own land!!!

More people should read this and think about it. People in western countries have no idea how life was for all the ex-soviet republics like Georgia. And, may i add, also for all the other countries in the shadow of Russia, like Poland or my own country, not just the soviets.

All these countries have to face a choice. Either Mother Russia or NATO and EU. And trust me, in most cases its not out of love of NATO or Bush they strive hard to be accepted, but just out of fear of Russia.

[edit on 15-8-2008 by Wallachian]

Originally posted by namehere
missile shield in poland a threat? how? is everyone forgetting that most russia ICMB's are aimed north and east? NOT west..

but even then, poland would not be safe in a russian missile barrage with that system anyways; do you think it impossible for russia to disable this system in the event of war or to overwhelm their country?

lets not forget who we are talking about here.

Exactly, why put defense missile system on the west side bordering Russia when it should be put in Canada to meet the missiles head on. On the topic of geography, we can say for sure its the most logical choice when the distance is shorter than going across the Atlantic.

reply to post by deadline527


I agree whole heartedly!

How would YOU feel being pushed into a corner(as Russia has become) and that corner getting smaller and smaller,by the minute , a Nuclear shield is almost the same as atomic weapons.If it cuts the odds of Mutally Assured Destruction in the favour of the USA .I would consider it to be Much more dangerous than any Nuclear Missles could ever be because , what keeps the world from nuclear war is just that M.A.D, nothing else. So my fellow Humans We are a step closer to anihilation thanks to some American think tank or some General in need to prove his wasted life!

Originally posted by Daedalus24
reply to post by ragnarak

 

Again, putting a missile defence in Poland is very different from putting nuclear-capable strike bombers on our doorstep. We're not supplying Poland with nuclear capability, just with a missile that can shoot and intercept ICBMs heading to well lets' say, London, or Paris, or Washington D.C. in that chance that they do launch them. This will give us crucial moments to strike back. It's merely a counter measure, not a first strike weapon.

Actually this is not what the Missile defence net is all about.

What the US is doing is placing radar laser systems so as to triangualte launches of ICBM's with enough resolution to target their air based Laser system to destroy any ICBM's lauched over the designated area.

Why Russia doesn't want this is obvious. Enough installations around Russia means their International missile systems are rendered useless.

The truth is, these are the moves necessary to be made before war in Iran can begin.

Without the correct set of circumstances, war in Iran could get very ugly. However, if you put a cork on the enemy’s pikes you won't get stung when they strike back.

The chess game began years ago and only now are we entering the end phase of the game.

Beware all that think USA and Russia will not go at it... they will.. just nukes are off the table until it becomes a case of survival of the home land.

In other words, USA and Russia are both willing to go to war against each other in a third country, but if either were to trike each other directly then nukes become an option.

Let's all hope it doesn't get to that point.

Power to the People!!

NeoN HaZe

I will give you explanation for Russia's "rhetorical" hardtalk.

There will be soon political and military takeover in Russia. Group of high ranked military officers are executing a plan to re-organize leadership in Russia and pretty much same time re-organizing borders of NATO's spreading. Group will be filling the gap which left some years ago when Putin and the Yedinaya Rossiya party has decide over the military officers that Putin's poodle, Medvedev will be the next president.

This could be begin of new Cold War or something else.

World, as we know it, never will be the same.

Best Regards,
Лужко́в

[edit on 15-8-2008 by son of PC]

Lets rewrite this under login account.

I will give you one explanation for Russia's "rhetorical" hardtalk.

There will be soon political and military takeover in Russia. Group of high ranked military officers are executing a plan to re-organize leadership in Russia and pretty much same time re-organizing borders of NATO's spreading. Group will be filling the gap which left some years ago when Putin and the Yedinaya Rossiya party has decide over the military officers that Putin's poodle, Medvedev will be the next president.

This could be begin of new Cold War or something else.

World, as we know it, will never be the same.

(OF COURSE. I CANNOT WRITE THIS AS A TRUTH SO LETS ASSUME THIS IS FICTION)



[edit on 15-8-2008 by northwoods]

Discussion going on here as well.
www.abovetopsecret.com...'

reply to post by kaspermartyrphantom


Actually this post was started prior to yours. So I suggest you close off your thread and join this one.

All the best,

Power to the people!

NeoN HaZe

Russia can get ticked off all it wants. It's the choice of Poland to host the defense shield. Russia can say "oh I don't like that", well tough. It's not their choice in the matter, sure they can give an opinion, but that's about it.

Same goes for putting bombers in Cuba, the US can gripe about it all they want. Not up to the US to choose who puts them there. It's up to the government in Cuba.

Now I do think that the defense shield is quite a bit different than offensive bombers in Cuba. However, I honestly think that with how far the US has come (at least militarily) then bombers in Cuba shouldn't even be a threat.

I guess this is really pointless anyway .. I mean what country couldnt cook up a nice EMP weapon .. If Russia was smart they would just get a few as close to these as possible and sit on em ...


That way if anyone first strikes em . . They can EMP around all the shields and there useless.

There has got to be an open sewer system close enough to most of these systems .. Even if not . An EMP only needs to get close.

I look at it like this. I totally feel for the Russians on this one, what with all these missile defense units popping up around them, they can't help but feel like they are being targeted or boxed in. But all in all being as I am American I much prefer that we have such counter measures were there to be any kind of attack, we would be prepared rather than sitting with our thumb in our butt.

But I also wonder that our intentions arn't really a "just in case" approach, this could very well be a strategic plan to control Russia so we can go about our business being the boss. Not fair and I would be really pissed off if I were Russian. But I'm not and if someone has to be the boss, better us then them I suppose.

Gosh wouldn't it be sweet if we could all just get along . Too bad the world is a highly unstable place and though we may not be what the world needs most, we are what the world deserves......-Batman

Originally posted by Neon Haze
reply to post by kaspermartyrphantom

 

Actually this post was started prior to yours. So I suggest you close off your thread and join this one.

All the best,

Power to the people!

NeoN HaZe

ACTUALLY...

Mine was posted on this date: posted on 14-8-2008 @ 07:00 PM
Yours was posted on this date: posted on 15-8-2008 @ 06:30 AM

So there Poindexter. Next time, follow the link and check before you let your fingers make an idiot of you.

[edit on 15-8-2008 by kaspermartyrphantom]

I have done a quick search, and I can't find an answer to a question I have.

What exactly stops this shield from being used offensively, i.e. by either reprogramming guidance systems, changing warheads.

Can anybody give me an answer to this.

I know that Russia is p#$s that the shield could render their missles worthless (but have been told that it is designed to protect against rogue states), but what assurances have they been given that it can't be re-tooled (for want of a better word)

Originally posted by Wotan
Its quite simple really .... Why dont we invite Russia into NATO as a partner nation ..... no more cold war or posturing ...... simple.

The answer to that is simple, If they actually offered it to Russia, i'm pretty sure Russia would fall over laughing, they have stated before that they want nothing to do With NATO.

Originally posted by ZeroKnowledge
I never saw any Russian attempt to get Poland at least partly more friendly , just threats, oil games and other threats. Russia (Russian empire, USSR) has a tense history as far as Poland is concerned. Instead of easing it and creating more economical ties - threats. Then they wonder about US missiles in Poland?

I think everyone should sit back and look at who is starting all these conflicts. US backed Georgia bombs a city of Russian civilians, and now US missles in Poland when they knew what the Russian reaction was going to be. It seems to me like they are poking the bear trying to get it to fight... and its working

reply to post by kaspermartyrphantom


who cares who broke it first? Your post was about the missile deal being put into action, mine was hours after about the threat from the Russian general. Two different discussions about two different stories.
also, my post, not his, and no need to call him an idiot.

[edit on 15-8-2008 by Daedalus24]

[edit on 15-8-2008 by Daedalus24]

Russia is not innocent and neither is the US. There are 2 sides to this coin so let's explore this further more.

Russia feels that the US is surrounding it and if the US attacked then Russia would be powerless. This is like a kid going into a fight surrounded by his opponents friends. I shouldn't happen.

The US feels they can have more defenses against Iran and terrorists if they should ever get a bomb capable of reaching the west. However I do think that
there is a hidden agenda to why they are placing missile defenses around Russia.

This should be a political move and not a military one. I am going to side with
Russia on this one. Russia wants to be able to defend itself just like the US.
You wouldn't like it if China built anti-missile defense systems in Mexico and Canada.