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If McCain had/has PTSD, should he be president?

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CX

posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 01:41 PM
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John McCain's suicide attempt and his resulting PTSD

I found this whilst looking into what treatment John McCain underwent after his POW experience.

My intentions were to put to people, that if a veteran with PTSD should be denied a gun, as is the case now in the US (probably UK now too), should someone with a history of PTSD be allowed to run a country and have a say in the use of the huge arsenal that the US has?

I can't say for sure that this article has any truth in it, i can only post this and let people give thier opinions. Maybe someone can advise further if this "US Veteran Dispatch" is reliable or not?

I found this bit quite interesting...


What McCain's promoters have carefully edited out of their McCain-for-president equation is his post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD).

Department of Defense psychiatrists have evaluated McCain for PTSD several times, the results of which remain locked by privacy laws.


How come his results are locked by privacy laws, yet any other vet in the US now will have thier results shown when it comes to owning a gun?

Do they not have privacy laws relating to thier treatment then?

One rule for one and one for the other?

CX.




posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 03:14 PM
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Originally posted by CX
My intentions were to put to people, that if a veteran with PTSD should be denied a gun, as is the case now in the US (probably UK now too), should someone with a history of PTSD be allowed to run a country and have a say in the use of the huge arsenal that the US has?


It is not illegal for veterans with PTSD to own guns in the US.

If McCain has PTSD, he has managed to build a political career that anyone would envy, regardless of his party affiliation.

It would be ridiculous to expect that McCain has not had to overcome some issues regarding his captivity and torture, however, it has not been determined that he has a clinical diagnosis of PTSD.

Not everyone gets PTSD and as McCain was as old as he was during his captivity gives him some immunity to the disorder, at least statistically.

Given the circumstances of his captivity, it would not be surprising that he might have attempted suicide. Few people know that extent of hopelessness and distress.

What McCain has done since his return is infinitely more important that what might have happened to him in Hanoi, although overall, his conduct while a POW lends much to his reputation as being a strong-willed person of high integrity and character.

Just having a temper does not make anyone unfit to be president or much of anything for that matter, except possibly the priesthood.

You would do well to do some homework, looking further than one highly biased article, before you smear people with clinical diagnoses or malign those who have PTSD.


[edit on 2008/4/20 by GradyPhilpott]



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 03:45 PM
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so let me get this striaght....if mccain was president, and the north koreans started to get a little crazy...as they have done in the past, and said to mccain "we'll do to you what the north vietnamese did", you wouldn't get just a little bit nervous?



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 03:53 PM
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PTSD is not the reason to not vote for Mr. McCain.

But him being owned by the oil companies just Like Pres. Bush is.

Think gas prices are high now....

If you like Bush then you should Love McCain also.



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 04:35 PM
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reply to post by jimmyx
 


Maybe it works both ways too.
If having PTSD makes people think that person is crazy, they may think twice before doing anything that might piss that person off.
I think I'd rather have someone in office that rouge nations will fear than have a Prez that would revert this country back to a "paper-tiger".



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 04:38 PM
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Who ever you lot choose, is your choice. What has post traumatic stress got to do with it.

Do you think obama still holds grudges too, or do you think he is an angel?


CX

posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 04:42 PM
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Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
It is not illegal for veterans with PTSD to own guns in the US.


Ah, sorry, my mistake. There have been so many threads regarding the banning of vets suffering from PTSD from having guns, and so many members up in arms about it, i thought it was actualy law. As i see, it is only proposed. Time will tell though and i think we all know how that will probably end up.


If McCain has PTSD, he has managed to build a political career that anyone would envy, regardless of his party affiliation.


Granted, whether you like the guy or not, he has indeed done this.

What i was getting at, is IF he has PTSD, why should his details be kept private and be offered a "free pass" because of who he is, whilst the rest of the sufferers have limitations put on thier lives?


Not everyone gets PTSD and as McCain was as old as he was during his captivity gives him some immunity to the disorder, at least statistically.


I understand this, the reason i mentioned it was because of the article. I also stated that i'd like to know how reliable this Veteran's dispatch" is, only way i'm going to find out is to ask those i think might know best.


Given the circumstances of his captivity, it would not be surprising that he might have attempted suicide. Few people know that extent of hopelessness and distress.


Fair one. Yet i know that many people who have attempted suicide don't just get over it as easy as some would like to think. Emotions relating to that darkest of times do not always go away, hence the wondering about why McCain's records are not allowed to be viewed due to privacy laws.

How well a guy has done in his career is not always a sign that he is totaly fine underneath.

I'm not putting down people with a mental illness, i just wonder what with all the digging into the other candidates pasts, whether people would vote for someone with PTSD?


Just having a temper does not make anyone unfit to be president or much of anything for that matter, except possibly the priesthood.


Sorry but i'd have to disagree with you on that one. Having the balls to be assertive enough to run a country is fine, but having a president with a known temper?

Imagine a president with a temper being woken at 3am by that all important phonecall?


I know of soldiers that have left the forces in a bad way after N. Ireland, and a couple even hinted at going into politics, like Paddy Ashdown did in the UK after service with the SBS.

That said, although they are doing ok today, if you'd have asked them to vote on the Good Friday Agrement and set free half of the guys that murdered our friends......thats a situation in which i know thier experiences would hinder such a decision.

The same could be said with PTSD.


You would do well to do some homework, looking further than one highly biased article, before you smear people with clinical diagnoses or malign those who have PTSD.


I'm not saying i know everything about PTSD, but i promise you i do not have to my homework on PTSD. Enough said.

If you read my post, i said.....


I can't say for sure that this article has any truth in it, i can only post this and let people give thier opinions. Maybe someone can advise further if this "US Veteran Dispatch" is reliable or not?


This was the first article i found on the subject and posted it for opinions.

I posted it as i know ATS members are very educated in what is a reliable news source is these days. As a trusted member of ATS, if you say that the Veterans Dispatch is a crap spewing source with it's own personal agenda, i'll take it on board.

In no way have i smeared anyone with PTSD on this thread, i would'nt do that for many reasons. I bet that even veterans with PTSD, having known how the condition can effect them, would be concerned if there was any doubt that McCain had PTSD as a serving president.

Thats not a slur, or a smear. I have a lovely neighbour with alzheimer's, kindest woman on the planet who i'd do anything for.....but i'd be concerned if she ran for president! Thats not smearing people with alzhiemer's

My grievance is with why certain people because of thier status, should be allowed to sit in a postion of authority which could be a million times worse than letting someone with a mental illness own a gun.

Anyway, thanks for the reply.


I just thought that it was a subject worth debating just as much s the other stuff they are digging up about the other candidates, as it could effect the way they run the country.

CX.



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 05:25 PM
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I have PTSD

I have had it sense 1983

I have been a Marine Sniper, Law Enforcement Officer, SWAT Team Member, SWAT Team Leader, Police Sniper, Community Police Officer, Mountain Bike Officer, Uniformed Narcotics Officer and Senior Member of a State Law Enforcement Agency.

I have done OK by all accounts

McCain will as well

Semper


CX

posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 05:32 PM
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Well then Semper, with a job history like that, how do you feel about being stripped of the right to own a gun because you have PTSD?

CX.



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 05:38 PM
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reply to post by CX
 


I don't think it will ever happen...

I know everyone was all up in arms over it, but what you will find is that a lot of Congressmen are Veterans..

Also Vets are a HUGE voting block and we all know what happens when you upset a voting block...

Plus you have to consider such things as Patient Confidentiality. After the Marines, I went to counseling on my own and continued that for a number of years through my police career until I was better able to "deal" with that issue considering in my career choice drugs were not an option...

There is no real way to determine which vet has this problem and which one does not short of having all combat vets tested and what expense would that be to the government?

Semper



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 05:56 PM
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Originally posted by whaaa
PTSD is not the reason to not vote for Mr. McCain.
But him being owned by the oil companies just Like Pres. Bush is.


And OILBAMA He has his hands in the Oil-cookie-jar as well.

As for PTSD and McCain. It IS something that should be looked at.
However, when looking at it, it is clear that it is very well under control.

As POTUS (or a potential POTUS) his medical records and medical state
should be open for everyone to see.



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 06:06 PM
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reply to post by CX
 


I apologize if I misconstrued your point.

McCain has endured more in his life than most will endure in several lifetimes. He proves his mettle every day he endures the difficult campaign trail.

He has comported himself quite well, even if he has been quick to anger in the past.

I've known a lot of good leaders who could get pretty angry under the right circumstances.

Nothing has been revealed about McCain that would indicate that he is unworthy to be the Commander-in-Chief.

That's the bottom line, regardless of what his opposition might claim.

[edit on 2008/4/20 by GradyPhilpott]



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 06:08 PM
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Here the deal. McCain will pick a wildly popular running mate. If elected, his medical records will be made public and he will announce he is not running for re-election for health reasons but his Veep will run for office. GOP gets 12 years out of it.



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 06:20 PM
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Originally posted by kosmicjack
Here the deal. McCain will pick a wildly popular running mate.



Who might that be? Condi, the Hukster, Newt



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 06:27 PM
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reply to post by whaaa
 


Maybe Condi, independent whites will feel better about their McCain vote (and that is who everyone is targeting) and maybe some African American females will crossover. However she is too much up GWB's butt and not exactly likable.

Maybe some unforseen GOP hipster that will steal votes from the indys and the middle. Huckabee, no deal - his Christian drumbeat will scare off swing votes. Romney, not likable enough. Guiliani - crazy. Thompson - too old.

No, it will be a relatively young person, as McSame's age is the primary objection for many voters.



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 06:45 PM
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well, I'm assuming anybody whoes ever fought in a war and seen real combat the way McCain has would have such a disorder. I'm not exactly a fan of the guy, but remember, we've had many presidents with experiences similar to McCains, and PTSD wasn't a known disorder.
I don't like McCain, but if I did, this wouldn't change it.



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 06:48 PM
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Originally posted by kosmicjack
reply to post by whaaa
 


Maybe Condi, independent whites will feel better about their McCain vote (and that is who everyone is targeting) and maybe some African American females will crossover. However she is too much up GWB's butt and not exactly likable.

Maybe some unforseen GOP hipster that will steal votes from the indys and the middle. Huckabee, no deal - his Christian drumbeat will scare off swing votes. Romney, not likable enough. Guiliani - crazy. Thompson - too old.

No, it will be a relatively young person, as McSame's age is the primary objection for many voters.


if anything, I'd hope it were thompson since he seems like an honest "here's how it is, here's what I'm gonna do about it" kinda guy. thats what I want in a politican.



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 06:52 PM
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reply to post by kosmicjack
 


Watching the news, I see Condi in Iraq in an unannounced visit. Photo op perhaps to show leadership qualities. I'm layin 8 to 5 that it's a Condi/McCain ticket. Stay tuned for more Condi.

I find it hard to think of US elections as much more than entertainment, like "American Idol" but with a pseudo political twist. The tragic part is that American kids are dieing while they play their silly games.



[edit on 20-4-2008 by whaaa]

[edit on 20-4-2008 by whaaa]



posted on Apr, 20 2008 @ 07:11 PM
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Condoleeza Rice is the Secretary of State. She doesn't need to take trips to a war zone to demonstrate her leadership. That's the very nature of her job, which she seems to have done quite well.

Many politicians express no interest in an office, only to seek that office later.

The thing about Rice is that she expresses no interest in politics.

She has a very comfortable life waiting for her in California and I don't see her even being asked to join the ticket.



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