Time travellers from the future 'could be here in weeks'

They need to have writers with a physics background write these, instead of some New Age hack.

It's completely misinformed to think that the Hadron super-collider is related to or will contribute to a method of 'time travel' as we think of it in the sci-fi sense or what we see on TV.

From Wiki:

When activated, it is theorized that the collider will produce the elusive Higgs boson, the observation of which could confirm the predictions and 'missing links' in the Standard Model of physics and could explain how other elementary particles acquire properties such as mass.[3] The verification of the existence of the Higgs boson would be a significant step in the search for a Grand Unified Theory, which seeks to unify three of the four fundamental forces: electromagnetism, the strong force, and the weak force.

Though one might be able to show particles exhibiting FTL travel in normal media, it will not allow information nor objects to travel back and forth in time.

Though it may enable scientists to form more coherent theories about the elementary composition of matter, it will not explain quantum physics, nor provide us with a "time machine".




[edit on 9-2-2008 by Badge01]

OK, here's what the HSC is designed to do.

It is theorized that back at the time of the Big Bang, certain primordial particles existed which gave rise to the particles we see now and when the Universe cooled.

They plan to accelerate particles using energies that have not been possible before now. They expect that this will cause two Quarks to combine on impact to produce a "W" particle and a "Z" particle and then, according to Richard Feynman, these two particles will combine to form a neutral Higgs boson.

Since so much energy is released when elementary particles split (as in the Big Bang) you have to find a way to generate nearly that on a nano-level to get particles to re-combine. To do this you need bigger and bigger 'accelerators'. The energy will be on the order of 10 Giga-Joules, or equivalent to 2.5 tons of TNT (but in a small space).

From this they can deduce other -theories-, such as facts about the Higgs boson (size, weight) and facts about Baryons. They can also deduce theories or start to answer some questions about string theory, symmetry, and gravitons.

Here's a good Wiki page

One way to think of it, is say you see an atomic bomb detonated. Now from this knowledge and from examination of other blasts, deduce what the original bomb looked like. Well in order to do that you'd try to re-assemble the bomb from what's left.

Of course that would be a ridiculously difficult, if not impossible task.

It's not like when you can re-assemble a pipe-bomb and compare it with other pipe bombs on CSI. While we've seen other pipe bombs, in this analogy we have no idea what the original (bomb) particle looked like. We don't know what it weighed or what particles composed it.

Though an important start, the results of the Hadron Super-collider will not do much more than help to assemble some better theories and by carefully reading the pattern of particles splitting off, make some educated guesses about the basis of the Standard Model

HTH.



[edit on 9-2-2008 by Badge01]

The danger of the HSC

One of the products of the collisions generated may be what theoretical physicists call Strangelets. These are composed of random parts of quarks, and is a hypothetical object. It may consist equal numbers of up, down, and strange quarks.


If the strange matter hypothesis is correct then if a strangelet comes in contact with ordinary nuclei (such as the Earth) it could convert all the ordinary matter to strange matter as an unstoppable chain reaction.

In the final outcome all the atomic nuclei on Earth could be converted,

Earth could be turned into a large, hot ball of "strange matter".

Bear in mind this is all a hypothetical situation and strangelets are considered a 'radical theory'. We have no idea if strangelets even exist. There is some thought that neutron stars could be composed of this substance but no direct evidence.

The danger is based on the idea that by creating such high energies in a particle accelerator you may be risk generating other high energy particles which may not disintegrate or reach the ground state immediately. If they don't they could set off a chain reaction by reacting with other normal nuclei.

Wow ! that i so spooky You just typed word for word what i was going to say.. J/K

Thank you for that explanation, i think that is the first time someone has explained it in a language i can understand, This is the kind of physics that gives me migraines if they are confuzing, sometimes you come across someone who can explain better..

Originally posted by Now_Then

Originally posted by Sickscent
I've never heard that time travelers travelling into the past could only go as far back as the time that the first time machine was built.

Yheah, that's pretty much a cardinal rule. I'm gonna have to read a bit of stuff over again to have an understandable point ~ but!! the long and short of it is if you turn a time machine on (the hadron collector could do nicely) then a message (that has been sent err. 200 years hence?) would be received (possibly) at the time you flicked the thing on (as that would be the first possible opportunity).....

Don't expect a Delorean to bust outta nowhere with a midget and a loon inside

any possible time travel would only be limited to data (if at all)... still would be nice to hear from the ungrateful great great grand genetic experiments

Maybe Titor is a "text" from the future...and not a " in the flesh" time traveler?...just thinking out loud

I like that Year Zero description as someone pointed out.

Something tells me when they turn this device on, anything from the future that has ever attempted to go back in time is currently in limbo, waiting, and will finally be released, like tons of unread email messages waiting in your inbox.

That would make 2008 the dead end year.

Don't flame me but - exactly how would the HSC benefit humanity? I mean, versus turning us into a hot ball of strange matter if it doesn't work out?

The way I see it we cant be sure 2008 is year zero.

How do we know some ancient civilization didnt have this technology a million years ago.

Maybe 2,000,000 b.c. is year zero. Im bettin year zero has come and gone many times already.

if time even exists,and then if time travel is possible it would be a mistake to assume humans would create the very first time machine.this universe is 14 billion years old remember.and theres perhaps an infinite number of of other universes,which coudle be so old as to boggle the mind.

what id do is travel back to the first alien time machine of this dimension,say 10 billion years ago,send a portible time machine towards where earth would be,go back to the future and then travel back to the time machine which i sent towards earth!!
,probably already been done if time travels possible.

also if LHC is recreating on a miniscule scale the conditions of the big bang(i hate saying that),then theoreticly one could travel in time back to the singularity that created the big bang and conquer the universe!,probably already been done too

reply to post by welivefortheson


I'd suggest you try to read through those linked Wiki articles, because you're trying to draw conclusions from faulty premises.

All they are doing is colliding some particles. Anything that comes from it will be done by analyzing the particle trails and the results. It won't do anything that is directly related to 'time travel'. I think the original writer of the article had little or no background in physics and gave the wrong impression, using fanciful models as seen in Movies or on TV, or something.

The Wiki pages give some idea on what questions some of this research may help answer. Some of the benefits of this research might be totally unrelated to the experiment. For instance they may develop advanced methods of building underground structures, or containment vessels.

It may help them rule out various theories on dark matter (if such a thing exists), rather than answer anything.

Remember, we probably can't reproduce the big bang or anything close, just an approximation, and they hope the energies will cause particles to form and see this by looking at their decay, making deductions based on the decay trails on a piece of x-ray film.

We can't know for sure what the earliest conditions were. As I mentioned in earlier posts, the answers may be -outside- our system. Since we're within our system, it could be that we can't know about things like 'branes' - we can only theorize.

It may be that we are never able to prove what Gravity is, or adequately describe Time. It's quite unlikely that we, three-dimensional beings, can step outside that and be able to manipulate time or gravity. The best we might be able to do is make better theories.

reply to post by Badge01


yeah i know man,i was just speculating with my overactive imagination as is my gift!

i dont even believe in time let alone time travel!,its all a psychological illusion as far is im concerned!.

but hey,i wish it were true,i hail you time travelers of the future!,reading these words 500 years from now like some ancient relic of the dark days!!!,come to me!,bring me women,flexible and by the dozen!!!!!!

reply to post by Badge01


This is Above Top Secret not Mensa; expect to find a lot of highly imaginative people looking for a place to push the limits of thought and mind. I read about the experiment and you are correct, but this is ATS and when people want to talk about John Tetor and time travel disasters, this is the place and that’s what makes it so fun. If I want a dose of reality I will read the paper. Too often I see semi-genius curmudgeons scaring off good people like John Lear and other highly imaginative individuals.

jojo

IQ-126 (average)

Dr. Mallet already made a time machine using lasers.
So did Time travelers had a chance to contact us but didn't

YouTube Video

"1 point 21 jigowatts!!!"

How is smashing atoms together really fast anything like a time machine?

I'm confused.


Where's Bill Nye when we need him

If you're just talking about the concept yes, time machines already exist.

The experiment was already done a couple of years ago and some scientists proved that the laser light they emitted was actually received before it was sent. It was published on Nature, the most relevant scientific journal we have today (I'm proud to have one article there on a different field).

I do not remember the details but this was just some nanoseconds variation. Light was sent to the future. The receptor machine acknowledged the light reception before it was sent by the emitter machine.

Now, if we talk about going back thats another story.

we don't really know much about time, as other posters mentioned, we don't even know if time exists, or if it just individual perception.

that being said, i THINK what is being supposed by the OP and the author of the article, is that the energy produced by the machine COULD POSSIBLY be enough to cause some kind of distortion or rift or hole in time/space based on theoretic perception of what time space may or may not be, as an inadvertant secondary effect of the experiments.

that's the problem with theoretical physics; it is all theoretical. if time exists in some euclidean sense, as the majority of physicists describe it, there is as of yet any reasonable explanation as to why we can only move in one direction.

i personally feel that time is a product of perception, that it occurs as a physical perception of external phenomenon. experiments have shown that perceptual time CAN be slowed to a point where rapidly flashing images that normally can not be discerned can be percieved and remembered by an individual. we also know that there is a cognitive delay between when something happens, and when our brain percieves it to be happening, not much of what, but enough time for our brain to sort out the signals it recives from senses, and correlate them in a recognizable fashion.

perhaps time has a lot to do with this perception of reality on an individual basis.

i remember reading about this, and also reading about a similar experiment years ago, in which photons were fired individually in two streams, one clear to a detector, the other with an object in front of it, and a methodology was found by which the object oriented photons were travelling through the object and hitting the detector quicker than the photons with the clear path. anyone remember what i'm talking about? are these two related?

Originally posted by novrod
If you're just talking about the concept yes, time machines already exist.

The experiment was already done a couple of years ago and some scientists proved that the laser light they emitted was actually received before it was sent. It was published on Nature, the most relevant scientific journal we have today (I'm proud to have one article there

on a different field).

I do not remember the details but this was just some nanoseconds variation. Light was sent to the future. The receptor machine acknowledged the light reception before it was sent by the emitter machine.

Now, if we talk about going back thats another story.

reply to post by DimensionalDetective


I, too, had scoffed at the John Titor stuff. Over the last few days, with the Caucas Results, etc, I could see how some of the things could really be true. Everywhere I go, people are upset about Obama, about Hillary, about John McCain, about the illegal aliens having rights, etc. People are snapping at each other over their political views. It's really creeping me out! I just really have a bad feeling that America is sinking fast!

You're right dominusluciferi but the experiments address different questions.

Does light travels following a straight line? No, it bends like a wave (according to the article you mention).

Things get strange when you repeat the experiment with electrons instead of photons... that experiment was done many years ago and it's rather strange. If you have a plank with 2 holes (left and right, with independent detectors on each one) and aim for the one on the left what do expect to measure?

Both detectors receive the electron... How can 1 electron can be in 2 places at the same time? Magic Physics...

The other article is really about timing. It "proves" time travel may happen.

[edit on 10-2-2008 by novrod]

I was on Understanding Islam Community read different topics and such (very good site check out ) and came across this Is Time Travel Possible?

one thing is for sure, everybody loves to speculate on time travel! I myself have been tempted to dig a deep hole and put a box (that will hold up for eons) and put a letter in it asking for a visit from a time traveler (maybe in the letter tell them to meet me at a specific place on a certain date etc..) I also wonder if anyone here has read "Ligthning by Dean Koontz" If you haven't you should it is one hell of a book that involves "time travel" very hard to put this book down once you start and thats no lie!!

anyway here is the link to the time travel questions at (SOURCE = Understanding Islam Community ) TIME HAS COME TODAY