Dogon Alien “Mystery” Demystified

reply to post by Rilence


You just beat me to it lol..

I'll flag and star it once it gets moved.

reply to post by AGENT_T


You bet Agent T....

This is the kind of quality we get on ATS sometimes, and we a really spoiled when someone makes a post like this...

So much pick and sift thru at one's leisure, so many links, so much supporting material...

A true scholar made this post and he should be recognised as same....I've seem SME's on here produce far less than Mr Kol, not so much in quantity, but in quality...

This man deserves "special" status here IMHO...

Peace

Congratulations! I have not had the time to even do a first reading of the entire posting by the OP due to time constraints. (Medical problems for a family member are taking up a great deal of my time right now.) Though I will give the article and the links a full reading at the earliest opportunity.

I feel that the posters on this thread are completely correct that the OP has indeed put out a most impressive and scholarly work here, one worthy of due recognition in the ATS community. We are indeed "spoiled" when we have such work presented to us.

In the opening statements of the OP there is reference to my earlier presentation on the Dogon, and how I had presented only one side to the mystery, and that is correct. But in my defense, in order to have a robust discussion one should not present every angle to an idea, but rather leave the "opposing" viewpoints room to work. It would seem that I have succeeded in that beyond my wildest expectation.

IsaacKoi, I am open to being convinced that there is little or nothing to this mystery, and look forward with delight to a careful reading of what you have presented here. (The close minded approach to "deny ignorance" is not my cup of tea at all.) I thank you in advance for the work and time you have put into this work, and am honored that I have provoked you to such a feat.

NGC2736

Edit to add: I would hope that a mod would be so kind as to move this thread per the OPs request to a forum that is appropriate; perhaps where my own original work was placed, or wherever it is felt that it will gain the greaatest exposure.

As a side not: I am also giving this a star and a flag on the grounds of the work involved and the intellectual approach of the OP in this matter.

[edit on 11-1-2008 by NGC2736]

Yep for sure Agent T

This is truly one of the classiest posts ever made on this board, to be sure...I do hope it is only a matter of time before it becomes so...And the powers that be afford Mr Koi the title of SME or something else...

He truly deserves is, IMO...

The only worry I have for this post is the average ATS community isn't capable o f understanding the info, or can't be bothered going thru it...

Either scenario would be scary for me, and I'm sure the OP and those who enjoyed his well thought out and researched post...

If this place is dumbed down by its recent expansion so much, that amazing posts like these are overlooked by the general populace of ATS, what hope does this board have when it comes to "quality" posting in future ?

I mean, given the total lack of response thus far, why would Isaac Koi bother to post such an amazing work in future ?

IMO, the Amigos should get behind these people and advertise said posts far and wide to attract even more people here, whatever they are into...

Please Amigo's, take this awesome post and put it out there...

Peace

Ah...the article at last. Shame this was refused as an ATS-Premium article, because it is PREMIUM.

I look forward to adding to this discussion very soon.

Just like to thank the OP for this post, this will keep me busy for a while
will add input once all infomation has been digested
great stuff

p.s
cant believe it was not accepted in the newsletter

The Dogon mystery has always been something that was at the back of my mind, because it just seems like it was the strongest evidence in regards for unearthly communication in the past. Anyway I rather skimmed through the article and figured that there were quite a number of flaws in the original account claiming the Dogon had superior knowledge about the Sirius system.
Although now I wonder what Temple's agenda may have been...

Wanna thank the poster for posting what looks like it could have been a well selling book
Your research is ABOVE AND BEYOND what i expect out of most posts anymore.
It was a good read and looked to be backed up with good sources.

Thanks again .

-MD

Thank you, IsaacKoi for this excellent piece of work. I have read some of your other writings and am very impressed with all of them. Quality work.

Wow! This should be a premium article for sure. The time and research you put into this is amazing.

This is going to be fun to read and think about. Thanks!

Starred and Flagged.

I would give you the way above award is it was still around.

IsaacKoi, very enlightening article.

I was wondering, has there ever been any physical anthropological or archeological evidence that would date from a significant amount of time before the Griaule contact that would corraborate precontact knowledge of the Sirius particulars. Drawings, symbolism, idols, relative religious practices, any similar claims in the region from other tribes in the Mali area?

Was all of this all based on Griaules relating the supposed oral history of the Dogon with no corroborating physical evidence? I cant see how Griaule and co. could have thought that these people had held this knowledge tightly throughout their history, from antiquity without expressing this knowledge in some physical form, art, something. Or was this posited as a trivial knowledge of the Dogon, implying that is was not such a big deal to the Dogon to have ever wasted time on creating any type of physical imagery from antiquity relating to this specifc knowledge based on this reverence or at minimun, stark recognition of Sirius and its machinations by the Dogon.

Great article though, arent many here that I enjoy reading more than once.

Kudo's for the work involved in this post, OP. It is a very well done piece.

However, I do not believe that if European adventurers in the last century found the Dogon and managed to communicate with them they would be talking about astronomy. They would have to establish some way to speak and comprehend each other, and then sit down and discuss the positions of the stars for God knows how long before it would become part of the Dogon ffolklore..it is too far fetched. I do not believe it.

The knowledge the Dogon have came from far away and long ago...not from travelers meeting an unknown tribe for the first time. Astronomy would no doubt be the last thing that these supposed Europeans would be interested in. Cultural and other realities would get put down in any anthopological study, and it makes no sense that the Dogon would have integrated new info so deeply into their culture and history.

Thats my view anyway.

My congratulations! Extreme quality, super interesting subject to debate,tons of pure well organized information... a true Prime art work.
You Sir, must be distincted in any way possible in ATS. Great job!

Star+Flag

I guess at the end of the day its all meaningless..after all we're sitting here no better off, no disclosure, no ET technology to save us from wars or energy problems..2012 anyone?

Isaac, that was an amazing post! Top of the line stuff!

However, why are the Dogons alone being connected with Sirius? Historically, many cultures have attached special significance to Sirius and the Orion belt. Take the ancient Egyptians for example which are several thousand years older than the Dogons. What did THEY know about Sirius?

As an example, check out the diagram below that shows the external shaft geometry of the Great Pyramid, where one shaft points to Orion and the lower shaft exactly to Sirius!


Courtesy: Crystalinks

What was the connection? And why Sirius? Was there an alien link with older civilizations much before the Dogons came on the scene? Was knowledge about the Sirius system passed down to them? Is it possible that the Extraterrestrials were from this star system who brought with them knowledge, culture and awareness resulting in the flowering of a modern civilization??

I feel, since the Dogons were descendants of the Egyptians, knowledge of Astronomy in particular the Solar System and Sirius was passed down to them, but partly forgotten due to the passage of time. But as to how the Egyptians acquired this knowledge is the moot question! Is there an extra- terrestrial link here?

Mike.

I read most of your article (not the entire thing though, as Im familiar with most of its contents).

I´ll just say this: You did an excellent job.

The reason I never used "The Sirius Mystery" in my own writings on ancient astronauts is because it was never strong enough evidence for me. A shame that skeptics take it as "the strongest piece of evidence" only to debunk it. It is not the strongest piece, its one of the weakest, as you have shown here again.

However, mikesingh makes an interesting point about other references to Sirius and the Dogon possibly having gotten their information not from modern westerners but from the ancient egyptians.

Originally posted by mikesingh
why Sirius? Was there an alien link with older civilizations much before the Dogons came on the scene?

Hi Mike,

Thanks for the kind words (from you, and from other members) about my article.

One potential explanation for myths relating to Sirius in various cultures is quite simply - it is the brighest star in the sky (excluding our Sun, which has also been the subject of myths/worship in numerous cultures).

Also, you may have seen this part of my article, which includes the following:

“It’s appearance in the dawn sky marked the beginning of the Egyptian calendar – and warned of the impending summer’s heat and Nile floods” (Oberg, 1982, page 122).

These could explain why Sirius appears in various myths, and also why the Dogon may have discussed Sirius with any Western contacts prior to the 1930s.

Of course, there are other potential explanations...

Kind Regards,

Isaac


[edit on 11-1-2008 by IsaacKoi]

Originally posted by eyewitness86
Kudo's for the work involved in this post, OP. It is a very well done piece.

However, I do not believe that if European adventurers in the last century found the Dogon and managed to communicate with them they would be talking about astronomy. They would have to establish some way to speak and comprehend each other, and then sit down and discuss the positions of the stars for God knows how long before it would become part of the Dogon ffolklore..it is too far fetched. I do not believe it.

Hi eyewitness86,

Thanks for the kind words about my article.

As for your point "European adventurers" finding the Dogon and managing to communicate for a considerable period prior to any discussion of astronomy, one of the points made in my article is that the contact was much more developed and sustained than mere visits by "European adventurers". For example, there were French schools in the area from 1907 onwards, so the contact need not have been limited to a brief discussion while some adventurers walked through a village.

Anyway, I'm glad you enjoyed the article.

Kind Regards,

Isaac

I applause the effort you made for the ATS community.
However I disagree with your points, you can't demystify a tribe's knowledge by simply saying that there is a (very remote) chance that white explorers came and taught them what they know.
And why in the blue hell would they lie? I think they aren't after fame and profit like we are in the west, well at least not in that period of time! And they can't confuse previous white men with alien gods or they would have treated the 2 french scientists the same.

Bravo Isaac!

Having worked in a major Crown Court here in the UK for 10 years, I consider myself privileged to have heard many "silks" present their cases in a manner that had drawn the admiration of many. Your argument was both sound and precise. Until I read your argument, I must confess, I did have strong beliefs in this particular subject, that it was more real than fiction, but now you have given me a good case to challenge those beliefs. Well done Sir!


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