Removal of the Right to Bear Arms

reply to post by andre18


How old are you? This country is founded on the precepts of the Constitution and Bill of Rights. That's the basis of our laws and our societal foundation. Despite what others will have you believe, the second ammendment clearly states the right of the PEOPLE to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. The same wording is used in several other places as well. If you still doubt research the writings of the founding fathers on this issue.

Legal gun owners are not the cause of gun crimes in this country. All of the recent shootings were perpetrated by mentally ill people. Let's address the real cause, shall we?

Originally posted by lifestudent
reply to post by andre18

 

A recent relevant post on this is here: www.abovetopsecret.com...

If most people could truly defend themselves, there'd be a lot less motivation for criminals to attack anyone. In fact, if everyone had an infinite ability to defend themselves with capability equivalent to ANY possible attack, the world would be a very peaceful place pretty quickly.

I'm skeptical that the recent spate of strange, phychotic behaviors are just a "natural" occurance. As long as we fear that the average citizens and people around us are all unstable and ready to snap, we don't have to trust them with a conversation or our common ground of belief in changing the government, let alone a gun. All the criminals already have guns. Why will disarming everyone else make the world safer for people who care to improve it?

couldn't agree more mate, but hes 18 by the looks of it.

"give me your guns and we'll look after you" once you hand em over
"hold on a minute? we could have defended ourselves a minute ago?"
now you need the state to look after us", and all they do it crapp on everyone. and then who are all the FEMA camps for?

i think it would be great to have no guns at all, but then like the other guy said, then you'll be getting killed by knives and cleavers.

an unarmed man in America is also called a mark.

This is so funny.... people think that taking away guns would leave them powerless and venerably defenceless.......

Let’s look at countries with gun bans......Australia:

Third most liveable country on the planet.....

www.infoplease.com...

We are according to you....utterly defenceless, yet less crime......

Doesn’t Canada have the same amount of gun loving people as America...but then why 11,000 ...? Canada is something like 600....... Big difference.....WTF is going on?

This is like the nuclear weapon thing......we wont have nukes if you don't, dismantle yours and we will THEN (after you do it first ) dismantle ours....

Are you all fn children.......guns are designed to kill things...to kill......since when is it justifiable to own a device that is purposely built to kill..(people)..?

We need nukes to defend ourselves from others with nukes.....take away the nukes, no need to build nukes......it's amusing how America is pointing the finger at Iran.....yet America themselves have got so damn many already...... WTF.....

Over the years I keep laughing at what Bush comes up with next…..no reason to go into the Middle East, yet they’re still there now…and goes against UN…then has the audacity to tell North Korea to stop going against the UN….like………. WTF……?

reply to post by andre18


andre18, America probably wishes to stay as number one in politics. That's most likely why.

[edit on 12-12-2007 by TheoOne]

If you outlaw guns, the only people left with guns are outlaws. Period.

This is the most basic logic and we have relied on it since the constitution was written. We cannot allow ourselves to be vulnerable to others simply because we want to 'play nice'.

What scares me is when Americans talk about giving away their weapons like it's an all-for-one one-for-all scenario. You go ahead and give up your right to bear arms, don't expect anyone else to do the same.

I believe it is a blatant move by the government to totally disarm their "subject" so they can easily walk into whatever town or village and start enforcing their rule without fear of repercussions.

The main reason why people get mugged or robbed is because the thugs assume that they have the upper hand or advantage and begin to rob or mug you with lets say a knife. But, when they discover that you have a knife also or better the playing field becomes even and therefore they usually run off because they almost always expect you to have total fear and surrender. Same strategy with the government, they can only come marching in when they are sure that everyone is totally disarmed and weak and scared. So they have to do everything in increments.

As for the few lone shooters, I can almost assume that they were the recipients of the very same technology that is discusses here within these forums about ads being beamed into your mind. I am almost certain that certain agencies are using this technology to pinpoint a subject and start breaking their minds down to become their vessel to do their bidding (shootings) and then this in turn will advance their agenda.

I'd rather die on my feet fighting for my universal right to defend myself then to be on my knees to some FAT retarded Gov. agency and surrender.

Just my .000000000000002 cents..

[edit on 12-12-2007 by shadow_D]

If somebody ever broke into my house with a knife, I would sure hate to have to try and stop them with another knife. I'd much rather prefer to shoot them. If somebody broke into my house with a gun, why, I'd still prefer my own gun!

If you still aren't convinced, look what happened in New Orleans. Katrina hit, the guns were taken from anyone who owned one legally. What happened after that? All the gangs with unregistered or hidden weapons were free to literally go around raping and pillaging the city. Yeah, let's make sure that happens every time there's a disaster stretching emergency personnel to thin!

That, however, is beside the point.

The U.S.A is slowly starting to stand for The Ultimately Suppressed Autocracy. The reason citizens are given the right to bare arms is not to hunt, or even to protect their homes from intruders. It's to protect them from the government, and make sure they remain the ones with the power. It's barely working as it is, take away the guns and American democracy will fail completely.

Anyways. To be somewhat more on topic, I doubt these shootings are connected to any government conspiracy to turn people against guns. They're too random, and they've all been carried out by random nobodies who are mostly insane.

Now, the press on the other hand, might be out to take advantage of these shootings to sway public opinion against guns. This would be nothing new, and most anyone with a brain has always just accepted that mass media loves to portray guns in a negative light.

The shooters are most likely not part of any conspiracy to get us to give up our guns, but those reporting the shootings? They'd like nothing better.

When our guns do get taken though, it's not going to be some controversial law or court ruling at risk of being repealed as soon as the next group of politicians come along. It's going to be as a response to some manufactured disaster (or maybe they'll just wait patiently for a real one) ala Katrina but on a nationwide scale.

Then they'll come door to door, confiscate all the guns, and before you even have the time to challenge it in court your gun will have been destroyed by the confiscators, lost in some storage facility, or maybe they'll just flat out refuse to give it back based on the almost certain fact that most people will have no proof of which guns are theirs.

They've used all three techniques to keep residents of New Orleans from reclaiming their weapons, and they'll try it on the rest of us too.

This is why you need to act NOW to make sure that you have proof of ownership of YOUR EXACT FIREARMS. Keep four copies of it: One for home, One for your vehicle/emergency kit, One in a safety deposit box at the bank, and one with a trusted relative or friend out-of-state.

>>>>Revoking the right to bear arms is one of the most tragic mistakes a country can make. I have a feeling the media attention being given to these random attacks are in an effort to push the liberal agenda to revoke the right to bear arms.

LIBERAL? Excuse me, but you have righties/con's in on this too. I am liberal and I do not support the alleged attack on our constitutional rights. Please be more careful where you swing that big paint brush!

Ronald Reagan once said he was going to make "liberal" a dirty word. Well with him and all the lock & stock party line toeing ditto heads and spin doctors (Limbaugh, Liddy, Beck, all those Faux folks, the Gingrich and Lotts, along with all the Amway people and the neo-con groups) have worked their asses off to convince you of it. For the rest of us, who don't buy their tired old crap, it gets kind of old when you continuously toss out that loaded word. We understood this back in the early nineties and eighties in fact, now it's time you guys catch on and quit running the smear campaign for these idiots.

God, guns, and gays, got these crooks (Shrub and big Dick) into power, and you guys on the right bit it off hook line and sinker. Are you going to yet again?

Originally posted by shadow_D
I believe it is a blatant move by the government to totally disarm their "subject" so they can easily walk into whatever town or village and start enforcing their rule without fear of repercussions.

man......I really feel sorry for people who think the police or better yet the military, are going to come along if guns are banned and take control over the citizens....where the public will be defenceless and the government will be able to impose ridicules laws....

This is almost embarrassing ......how can an adult think like this....? What, you think a group of villages aren’t going to be able to rebel against the police without guns.......name one time where guns were used to rebel against the police.......We don’t use guns anymore.. We’re not in the American Revolution anymore. We use peaceful resolutions to figure stuff out.

There is such a thing as writing a letter; having a public hearing, a march protest, etc......I don't remember when guns were used to solve anything....

You wonna go back to the American revolution against the British....that was in 1776.....hundreds of years ago....we have moved on....well hopefully some of us have.......Vietnam war.....using weapons to kill so many innocent children and women etc more of a culling then anything else...

"estimates of civilian fatalities range from 2 to 5.1 million"

en.wikipedia.org...

“enforcing their rule without fear of repercussions. “

police: “check it out, they’re utterly defenceless, not a single gun, lets make up some crazy rules that only suits us, and hell it’s not like they’re going to do anything about it, what are they going to do without guns….?”

Is it that everyone’s paranoid? That you think everyone’s out to get you or something……lol, you got Mexicans in the south…and Canada in the North….what you think you’re gonna have a war with them……….?

That is actually impossible as both Canada, and North and South America have already signed an agreement that will unit these three countries as one currency called something like the Amero…….which will take away the constitution, something like the Euro dollar…so no more crap about what it says in the constitution about bearing arms, as it will be scratched soon enough……

Resist gun control with every cell in your body, NEVER EVER give up the means to protect that which is your right and duty to defend !

This madness was imposed on my country and these are the results....

www.iol.co.za...
www.iol.co.za...
www.iol.co.za...
www.iol.co.za...
www.iol.co.za...
www.news24.com...
www.iol.co.za...
www.news24.com...

These are news from the past 2 WEEKS....not months, not years, these things happen daily.

These types of attacks would not occur if the criminals/perps feared those they were about to attack. Knowing that if you stand a very good chance of receiveing a gaping head wound would deter just about anybody form nefferious activites.

Without that fear they are free to act with impunity.

Originally posted by andre18
That is actually impossible as both Canada, and North and South America have already signed an agreement that will unit these three countries as one currency called something like the Amero…….which will take away the constitution, something like the Euro dollar…so no more crap about what it says in the constitution about bearing arms, as it will be scratched soon enough……

Judging by your posts, I assume you think this globalist bull# is a good thing...

Sorry dude but you are ignorant.. lets put criminals aside, and lets put the government aside, and lets say that America is going to be invaded by the Japs, or the Chinease, or who the mexican drug cortel.. and lets say the military cannot react in time because we are over seas.... do you think that any country could ever invade America?????


If you aswer yes you are stupid... because we have a 300 million man Army. A couple weapons in every home.. and I know that if any person tried to invade America, they would have to fight every American here.. because we all have guns...

Guns do not kill people... people do. And if you think that you could remove all guns.. then you are dreaming.. sure in a perfect world 1 minus 1= 0.. but this is not a perfect world. we dont think that we are defensless with out a gun.. but there is an old saying.. never bring a knife to a gun fight...

This Is America, you may not like it, but we have guns.. and lots of them. and that will never change

Hi andre18, I appreciate your views and respect your perspective, but you don't have to be paranoid to see what is happening around you. If you are in an area that is literally untouched and still a Norman Rockwell painting, then that's great and I envy you.

Unfortunately, I've lived long enough and having served in the Military to know who the "system" works and I can assure you that "writing a letter" is just to keep you occupied while another part of the agency steals your property from under your feet if they so choose too.

Please keep writing those letters and see what has changed in the Bush administration, or the War in Iraq or even on Terrorism. If you owned a gun legally and they came for no reason, like in Katrina (New Orleans), and took them without due cause or process, what do you think will happen while you are writing your letters and your household and family are now totally vulnerable again the roving gangs.

Nowadays, as you stated about marching and demonstrating, you can't even do that either without having applied for the proper permits and even then, you can only stay in a certain area known as a free speech Zone!! Who the hell has ever heard of such nonsense.. IF you get a chance, can you please write a letter about that too as it is also illegal..

My .0001 cents..

I’m not an American so I am not going to preach what America should do.

I come from a farming and hunting background and responsible gun use was paramount with my upbringing. It was sad that when the gun laws came into Australia and my father had to turn in his pump action shot gun, since it was his fathers and it was such a beautiful wood grained weapon.

My father had one of those bumper stickers (I have a gun and I vote too).

I agree that people should be able to defend themselves in their homes. I also agree that guns don’t kill people, people kill people mentality.

But…

I also don’t think that weapons should be sold free and without some sort of registration and a cooling off period should be mandatory. I also agree that certain weapons should not be sold to the general public, for example automatic weapons.
I also agree that certain people should not be allowed to own weapons at all for example highly violent criminals and mentally unstable individuals. I also think a mandatory short training seminar in gun safety wouldn’t go astray either.
Having a gun on ones person in the public to be legal is a catastrophe in the making. If an area has a high rate of crime police should be able to be given rights to spot search anyone and everyone and include jail time for having a gun on ones self.

People who put bats or knives on the same killing level as an automatic weapon are disillusioned.

People who think they can defend their homes IF the US army wanted to take it are disillusioned. Americans especially should be aware of their own military power and hopelessness against it…..


Do you have the right to own a gun… sure but not all guns, not at public places, not immediately and certainly not if you have a violent criminal record or mental illness.

Cheers.

Originally posted by MuLongQun
I’m not an American so I am not going to preach what America should do.

Too bad more posters don't take this attitude.

Originally posted by andre18

man......I really feel sorry for people who think the police or better yet the military, are going to come along if guns are banned and take control over the citizens....where the public will be defenceless and the government will be able to impose ridicules laws....

I feel sorry for anyone naive enough to think anything other than that would happen if guns were banned.

This is almost embarrassing ......how can an adult think like this....? What, you think a group of villages aren’t going to be able to rebel against the police without guns.......name one time where guns were used to rebel against the police.......We don’t use guns anymore.. We’re not in the American Revolution anymore. We use peaceful resolutions to figure stuff out.

Yeah, when the government is ushering us into FEMA camps at gunpoint, we can fight them off with peaceful resolutions

There is such a thing as writing a letter; having a public hearing, a march protest, etc......I don't remember when guns were used to solve anything....

If you write a letter, what mystical force compels anyone to open it once they no longer fear the citizens? Why allow public hearings, or marches, or protests when nobody has the power to make you let them do it?

You wonna go back to the American revolution against the British....that was in 1776.....hundreds of years ago....we have moved on....well hopefully some of us have.......Vietnam war.....using weapons to kill so many innocent children and women etc more of a culling then anything else...

We're not talking about guns in the hands of soldiers over in Vietnam. We're talking about citizens having the right to protect themselves from the emergence of a tyrannical government. Vietnam has nothing at all to do with this, do try to stay on topic, please?

“enforcing their rule without fear of repercussions. “

police: “check it out, they’re utterly defenceless, not a single gun, lets make up some crazy rules that only suits us, and hell it’s not like they’re going to do anything about it, what are they going to do without guns….?”

Who's to stop them? The government already makes up such rules. They already hold the attitude that we can't do anything about it. Only a complete FOOL would allow them to take that idea even further.

Is it that everyone’s paranoid? That you think everyone’s out to get you or something……lol, you got Mexicans in the south…and Canada in the North….what you think you’re gonna have a war with them……….?

What if we do? Who's to say that 30, 40, 50 years from now, Canada and Mexico will still be our allies? Remember when Iraq was our ally? Remember when Iran was our ally?

That is actually impossible as both Canada, and North and South America have already signed an agreement that will unit these three countries as one currency called something like the Amero…….which will take away the constitution, something like the Euro dollar…so no more crap about what it says in the constitution about bearing arms, as it will be scratched soon enough……

And when that happens, you bet your sweet bupkiss there'll be a war between Canada, the US, and Mexico. A war to preserve the Independence of each of those three countries. Disband our Constitution? Not until we're completely powerless to stop you from doing so...

uh...

...oh, wait.

That's exactly why they want our guns.

reply to post by andre18


I don't think that too many Americans are going to turn in their weapons in exchange for pencils to write letters with. Somehow, when a gun is needed to get a point across, it has more meaning than a pencil. Like say, in a home invasion scenario.

The average gun toting person in America is not planning on fighting a war with the gun, but I am sure they will if it comes down to it.

You seem to be equating a persons constitutional right to bear arms with an act of war. Owning a gun for personal protection has not been the cause of any war you listed.

We could debate the "guns or no guns" subject all we want, but the bottom line is. We can own guns and we do own guns, That is how it is. I was born with that right and I live with that right and ill die protecting it. It is what it is, and nobodys ever taking my guns.

Nice job mattifikation and Enthralled Fan!! Thanks for spending a lot more time replying to the various sections of 18's post, mattifikation. I just couldn't be bothered and answered very generally.

I agree with the other poster to which there should be legal purchases of guns and proper training and respect for such weapons. But, I've lived long enough to see that our basic human rights are being slowly but surely dwindling away. Slow enough where most people just don't notice or just plain deny that it is actually happening.

The old frog and the slowly boiling water syndrome.