True, it may be a fake. Just so they can use the UN to manipulate the US and other countries for charities and for funds, etc. Which for the people is good, but they still end up holding on to the dicatorship. Honestly, I still have no idea what to think of the bomb they blew up.

I don't see why North Korea would say they exploded a nuclear bomb if they had not, except of course to make other countries fear them and take them seriously, though I think they would have thought about the consequences of it and if the world found out it was a fake.

Either the bomb was a fake, or the U.S. and our allies want it to appear so. Why, I don't know.

I don't know if sanctions could be justified, since we do not even know what the nature of the weapon they tested is still, after all this time.


The world just gets crazier...

I may be mistaken here, but aren't most nuclear tests conducted in a manner that ensures the greatest capability of recording and analyzing said results?
i.e. underground (a dense substrate provides more accurate seismic readings), oceanic (strategically placed bouys and airborne monitoring devices), surface (well, I think we've all seen videos from those).

What I find odd is the Global variance of opinion as to "just what the hell took place".

The US seems to be [publicly] scratching it's head. Russia has reported that it was in fact nuclear, and possibly as large as 15Kt. China intially came to a nuclear conclusion, but has since seemed to back away from such.

It's not rocket science, here. Well, actually, it is ... but I think you get my drift.

Reportedly the test was conducted in a region with less than optimal geographic properties (i.e. soft substrate). Which leads me to wonder ... WHY?

If it was truly a Test, to determine the capabilities of a virgin nucular (sic) state, then wouldn't you seek a more optimal location to ensure the ability of monitoring/recording said results?

Unless, of course, it was simply another opportunity to stand on a soapbox and, yet again, spout threats to the world, in the hopes of using such as a bargaining chip. The squeaky wheel comes to mind, here.

Void of military action, which doesn't seem the desire nor best interests, by concerned parties, I see a situation where Only a unified Voice/Reaction would possibly achieve resolve.

Personally,
Regardless of what the initial intent may have been, I feel that Lil' Kim needs to be held accountable and his provocative actions firmly addressed.

IMO, the "boy who cried wolf" needs to be brought front and center and dealt with, whether to his liking or not.

Just sayin'
$.02

NK said there were no leaks straight after the test.

I think this is the US's only way of trying to get out of their predicament (ie, if they dont invade, they are liars about WMD. If they do invade, there will be massive losses) by insisting there is no nuclear bomb so no action is necessary.

Originally posted by Flyer
NK said there were no leaks straight after the test.

I think this is the US's only way of trying to get out of their predicament (ie, if they dont invade, they are liars about WMD. If they do invade, there will be massive losses) by insisting there is no nuclear bomb so no action is necessary.

Then the other countries have also join the American conspiracy to keep this quiet since they also said that they detected no radiation which could mean no nuke test, or at least failed to detonate properly.

Originally posted by deltaboy
Then the other countries have also join the American conspiracy to keep this quiet since they also said that they detected no radiation which could mean no nuke test, or at least failed to detonate properly.

You misunderstand.

NK said there was no radiation leak. Now the US says the same. I think they will use that info to say there was no nuclear detonation so now action is necessary.

I hope that clears it up for you.

Originally posted by Flyer

You misunderstand.

NK said there was no radiation leak. Now the US says the same. I think they will use that info to say there was no nuclear detonation so now action is necessary.

I hope that clears it up for you.

Post the link to the source, so I can see where NK says it.

So the test is conducted deep underground and they used a very low yield bomb so how would the radiation escape?

Originally posted by 12m8keall2c
It would seem prudent that the results of such a Test would be universally verifiable. No?

Otherwise ... what's the point? <-- my question, here.

This is such an excellent point, but alas, not many seem to be getting it.

Let me try:

If NK was trying to "show off" their nuclear capability, then why-oh-why would they try to conduct their test in such a way that no one could verify that it actually took place???

Originally posted by centurion1211

Originally posted by 12m8keall2c
It would seem prudent that the results of such a Test would be universally verifiable. No?

Otherwise ... what's the point? <-- my question, here.

This is such an excellent point, but alas, not many seem to be getting it.

Let me try:

If NK was trying to "show off" their nuclear capability, then why-oh-why would they try to conduct their test in such a way that no one could verify that it actually took place???

Its likely that originally they were trying to disguise the true yield of their device. The fact that verification is taking some time it probably a bonus to them. It keeps the 'enemy' guessing about NK's real nuclear capabilities, and also increases widespread international speculation; which in turn raises NK's international profile.




zero lift

I think that this government should be extremely careful as to what they say. Those people are nuts and are already peeved off that we do not believe it was a nuke.

Are we trying to hide something for political reasons? Are we right? I dont know.

I think however, we should be very careful as to our approach to them- Lest they decide to launch something our way to verify that they have nukes. That would not be a pretty sight.
Diplomacy is extremely desirable in this situation- but look at our leaders!
They wouldnt know diplomacy if it crawled up their pant legs and bit them.

zero lift,

I certainly cannot and will not debate you on that point.

My personal thoughts are Very similar to that which you purport.

While it remains "undefineable", it also remains in question. What better way to play your cards?

Quite the tenable "bargaining" chip. No?

Well, looks like the White House is confirming radiation at the test site.

No story link to give you, but it's all over the MSM, hit up CNN or somesuch.

Originally posted by Astygia
Well, looks like the White House is confirming radiation at the test site.

No story link to give you, but it's all over the MSM, hit up CNN or somesuch.

I'm seeing it now. So much for containment of radiation that NK says it contained. No matter how secure it is, it would be leaked even if underground.

Originally posted by 12m8keall2c
zero lift,

I certainly cannot and will not debate you on that point.

My personal thoughts are Very similar to that which you purport.

While it remains "undefineable", it also remains in question. What better way to play your cards?

Quite the tenable "bargaining" chip. No?

Theres also the fact, 12m8keall2c, that NK have raised prevarication to a fine art. They love the 'long game'.

I remember reading an account of the 1950s Korean War peace talks, and NK always tried to drive their opponents up the wall with demands about: the size of the room where peace talks were to be held; the size of the table; the height of the table; etc.

Anything that would annoy their opponents.



zero lift

Well, if the device misfired, the explosives would have blown the fissionable material all over the place instead of compressing it into the critical mass required for nuclear detonation. If that misfire happened, I would think there would still be plenty of radiation around the site.