What's Next from Microsoft? Viral Digital Rights Managament.

Yes, that right. They are finally going the rout of Sony. But the diffrence here, instead of infecting the core of your system with a rootkit, they are going to unilaterally install DRM software on any and all music tracks played on their "new" music player called Zune. Including Creative Commons tracks whose license specifically prohibits the usage of Digital Rights Management on all CC tracks.

www.boingboing.net...

More Arrogance from the IP Cartels. When is it going to stop?

That Zune name also sounds awfully like Dune. He who controls the bits controls the world.

[edit on 16-9-2006 by sardion2000]

Arrogence? Maybe it's to stop piracy so you can actual earn profit s

How does this, in any way whatsoever, stop piracy? It seems to me, the more they clamp down, the more paying customers slip through their fingers. I'd rather pay an Indie artist 10 bucks directly and not have to deal with DRM then risk having my Free and Legal Creative Commons tracks locked down by some egomaniacal megacorp.

[edit on 16-9-2006 by sardion2000]

Originally posted by PisTonZOR
Arrogence? Maybe it's to stop piracy so you can actual earn profit s

I gotta agree with this. Why the big stink over file sharing? Because its illegal, no more no less!

Its not just about big business making bigger business. Small labels and niche genres are finding it impossible to make a profit. Many scenes are drying up, because the current climate simply doesn;t allow feasible CD production on the small scale, or digital downloads to make money.

Do u have any idea what its like for a full-time niche record producer (i.e. not getting airplay or TV play) to earn a living off £3 a track (don't even jest about 99p per track)? Getting, say, 50 or 100 tracks downloaded a month? Let alone the less established artists?

People seem to roget that filesharing MP3s DOES have a massive impact on the music, but not for the big labels (i.e. Virgin, EMI etc). The impact is very real, but its hidden from the public eye. Theres no publicity for the niche genres anyway, so u don't hear about them drying up as they simply can't afford to make music any more.

I don't really have a problem with the odd bit of file sharing. After all, it vcertainly has its benefis. I for one have been introduced to a few genres of music I would never had been introduced to would it not be for LimeWire or the likes. But this "hey man, its a victimless crime" ethic followed by 100% of ur tunes being downloaded for free is certainl;y affecting people. People don't make a great deal off records (enough to pay the bills), who are literally having the food taken off their tables as they can no longer afford to work in their profession...

EDIT: I don't really agree that this draconion approach is the right approach, but it has to be dealt with eventually, if we genuinly want the music industry (on the larger scale) to survive

[edit on 16-9-2006 by john_bmth]

Originally posted by john_bmth

Originally posted by PisTonZOR
Arrogence? Maybe it's to stop piracy so you can actual earn profit s

I gotta agree with this. Why the big stink over file sharing? Because its illegal, no more no less!

Actually in my country it's only illigal to upload music.

Its not just about big business making bigger business. Small labels and niche genres are finding it impossible to make a profit. Many scenes are drying up, because the current climate simply doesn;t allow feasible CD production on the small scale, or digital downloads to make money.

ROFLOL! Indie music has been booming lately. Check out EMusic, it's an indie music distributor. They have absolutely no Digital Rights managment whatsoever. They are the second biggest online distributor of music, tracks cost on average 25 cents, and their library is full of stuff that the big labels will never touch because it's not sellable(by them, they only know how to promote a product, not art), so the stuff ain't tainted. Check it out. That's a business model I can get behind.

Okay now we are off topic, the issue here is that Microsoft is violating Copyleft licencing of Creative Commons tracks. Have any comments on that?

[edit on 16-9-2006 by sardion2000]

Originally posted by sardion2000
ROFLOL! Indie music has been booming lately. Check out EMusic, it's an indie music distributor. They have absolutely no Digital Rights managment whatsoever. They are the second biggest online distributor of music, tracks cost on average 25 cents, and their library is full of stuff that the big labels will never touch because it's not sellable(by them, they only know how to promote a product, not art), so the stuff ain't tainted. Check it out. That's a business model I can get behind.

[edit on 16-9-2006 by sardion2000]

Since when has indie been niche? It gets tremendous airplay on prime time TV. Please, get ur facts straight. I wasn't talking about Indie (currently the most popular genre in the UK at the moment)

Jazz isn't niche? Classical isn't niche? EMusic is devoted to Indie musicians. The majority of whom on that site are into Jazz, Classical, Metal, etc. I think it's you who should get your facts straight.

Here is the definition of an Indie music production company: A production company independent of major film studio financing. And since the Major record labels control 80 percent of the maket, anything else IS NICHE!

Now that we're done splitting hairs, care to get back on topic which is: MICROSOFT VIRAL DRM INFECTS FREE AND LEGAL Copyleft tracks.



[edit on 16-9-2006 by sardion2000]

[edit on 16-9-2006 by sardion2000]

Originally posted by sardion2000
Jazz isn't niche? Classical isn't niche?

Not when they're selling millions of units world wide! I;m talking of REAL niche, niche in both poularity and record sales. Please, stop naming multi-million pound industries as niche.

DRM, filesharing and its impact are tightly coupled. U can't talk about one without the other, otherwise there wouldn't be a problem in the first place.

Okay, you don't seem to want to talk about the topic so I'm ending this conversation.

If you want to talk about MICROSOFT VIOLATING CREATIVE COMMONS LICENSING, then I'll respond.

There is nothing wrong in filesharing itself, I hate to see protocols like bittorrent getting slamed as "illegal" if thats the case we should treat http the same way after all its not like you cant get pirated material over http/ftp.The fact is alot of artists give away music for free, the british band blur has gone on record saying "download our album" and theres alot of other artists with that mentality.What microsoft are trying to do is bloody illegal slapping protection on creative commons music.

File sharing will not destroy the music industry just like the whole "recording songs off the radio crisis" a few decades back.

The impact is very real, but its hidden from the public eye. Theres no publicity for the niche genres anyway, so u don't hear about them drying up as they simply can't afford to make music any more.

Show me one music genre thats died because of filesharing.

I appologise for talking about DRM in a thread about DRM. I;ll leave now.

actually, i dont see this lasting. lets face it, microsoft does not have the authority to apply DRM to any art witout the artists permision. it will get slapped down.

in this case file sharing is irrelevant, its about who has the authority to DRM someone elses work

Originally posted by john_bmth
I appologise for talking about DRM in a thread about DRM. I;ll leave now.

Later Cartman, I'm sorry you didn't want to discuss the real issue here (which isn't DRM, but Microsofts use of it)

in this case file sharing is irrelevant, its about who has the authority to DRM someone elses work

THANK YOU! That was my point that I was stumbling to make.

Show me one music genre thats died because of filesharing.

That's not the point of this thread. This thread is not about filesharing.

[edit on 16-9-2006 by sardion2000]

That's not the point of this thread. This thread is not about filesharing.

Fine.I was just asking him to back up his claims, dont let me step on your toes though, your right the subject of DRM has nothing to do with filesharing what so ever.

You know whos going to stop them ?

Same people who cracked DRM

Why bother getting so emotional about it ?The ycan try all they want, there are loads of talented people out there who will gladly fight back.At some point or other MS will just start loosing more and more money with this and then they will stop it by themselves.

Are they trying to make sure this bombs because no computer litterate person is going to want to do that.

Say you copy your music across to it, it gets infected with DRM.

Then your hard drive dies so you think youll be ok as all you have to do is copy it straight back and it will work, but no, the DRM kicks in and your own legal music is useless on your own hard drive.

Stay well away. Mind you, putting RFID chips on hd dvds so they can track them is going to be even worse for the cinsumer.

Sorry for being a bit snappy guys, it's just this stuff really pisses me off.

www.zuneinsider.com...

Here is a response from a Zune developer.

"I made a song. I own it. How come, when I wirelessly send it to a girl I want to impress, the song has 3 days/3 plays?"

Good question.

There currently isn't a way to sniff out what you are sending, so we wrap it all up in DRM. We can’t tell if you are sending a song from a known band or your own home recording so we default to the safety of encoding. And besides, she'll come see you three days later. . .

So that's Arrogant, Egomaniacal, and Condescending.

Here is a protection scheme I would be able to get behind.

German Web Music Store Uses Watermarks, Not DRM

One other thing. When are they gonna realize that you CANNOT LOCK DOWN A TURING MACHINE!?! It's impossible to completely lock it down because that just isn't the way it was built.

[edit on 16-9-2006 by sardion2000]

I wanna thank ya for bring this issue up, because I was thinking about getting the microsoft's obviously copied ipod product. I am going to stick with what I have always had which is the creative music players, never like IPOD myself either.

People who says that you need to buy their player ? Hurt them where it hurts most

Dont forget we have the money they want

I hope that these corporate idiots figure out sooner then later that illegal piracy helps sell more copies of thier product. Its like free advertiseing and these people want to cut thier own throats. Guess it will be funny when they acctualy fight for the rights to copy. Morons !!!