Bring On The New World Order.... seriously though...

I don't fear the NWO. I actually wouldn't mind seeing a change in the way countries are being run by governments. I think the change might be good.

Also, how would the implementation of the NWO affect the U.S.'s problem with illegal's and the whole immigration nightmare?

Since its one Government for everyone, would there still be independent nations, would you have to live where you are or could you simply move somewhere else with no problems of immigration?

I'm not really serious about my first paragraph in this thread, I just wanted to pull a full chains on here, but I seriously wonder how the NWO would change immigration / illegals etc.

your thoughts?

they'll probably round them up and wisk them off to incinerators.

Seriously though. Earth needs a change but a Totalitarian police state isn't the change we're looking for. It's not going to be any picknet whatsoever. What this Earth needs is something like in Star Trek. A true United People instead of being turned against one another.

Originally posted by elevatedone
I don't fear the NWO... I think the change might be good.

You said you weren't serious about that paragraph, elevatedone. May I be serious about it, then, if you don't want to? I honestly think a 'new world order' might not just be good, but our only chance of long-term survival as a species on this planet.

There's a slight problem of definition, though. This oh-so-fearsome New World Order seems to mean different things to different people. Some see the NWO in the ongoing processes of globalization and corporatization. To them, manifestations of the Order are caused simply by members of the international elite doing what anyone would do in their position, ie acting to maintain their power and privileges -- working together towards a single objective when it suits them, but competing against each other just as often.

If this is the New World Order, then it's been around for as long as there have been people. It's just a manifestation of the fact that the lucky, the talented and the ruthless will always rise to the top of the heap, and then do everything in their power to stay there. No conspiracy, just natural social selection.

Others, though, see an active conspiracy with a specific agenda, which is being carried through at every level from the local to the geopolitical. The agenda involves the subjugation (and often, the extermination) of large swathes of the human race in order that the conspirators may lead lives of grotesque opulence. In some variations of this conspiracy, the conspirators are aliens or harbingers of the Antichrist with an agenda far beyond simple greed.

I believe there are excellent reasons why this kind of NWO can't exist, but there are other threads on which that subject can be debated; I don't want to raise it here. Instead, what I would like to suggest is that a world government, preferably of a federal structure with extensive devolution of powers at every level down to the grassroots, is not just absolutely essential, but the only possible alternative to a long slide back into barbarism and superstition. And this kind of world government is what people like Rockefeller and Fukuyama and Gorbachev were looking towards when they spoke of a new world order.

Now "world government" is strong term, likely to inspire ferocious opposition from nationalists and regionalists of all stripes, and besides, a world government isn't really achievable in the near to medium term. So the visionaries refuse to speak of government, but look instead at a loose affiliation of nation-states and jurisdictions that have all signed up to certain agreements regarding international law, human rights and so on.

This is, in fact, the world order that has been a-building (with frequent and often disastrous setbacks) since the fifteenth century or so, the world order whose development accelerated so enormously (along with still more frequent and yet more disastrous setbacks) in the twentieth century, and whose creation has for the first time become, in the twenty-first century, actually capable of achievement. And which is, in my humble opinion, mankind's (and very possibly the planet's) only hope for the future.

To answer your question about the movement of peoples; free movement across borders was common in all parts of the world until the nineteenth century. It will become so again with the advent of the New World Order. And so it should.

Yes, indeed, bring on the NWO.

[edit on 9-5-2006 by Astyanax]

Uh they say that there will not be independent countries anymore. Well there could be borders and names but they have to take orders from the UN though. So if the UN said to take 100 million Indians because India is too populated then the US would have to do that and like it! Have a nice day!

Originally posted by denythestatusquo
Uh they say that there will not be independent countries anymore. Well there could be borders and names but they have to take orders from the UN though. So if the UN said to take 100 million Indians because India is too populated then the US would have to do that and like it! Have a nice day!

Of course if this were the case, they would only be doing this to spread out the population evenly so that there was not an overabundance in one area. Following this same logic, you could safely assume that they would not dump 100 million indians in teh U.S. because that would then create a similar problem to the one they just dealt with. The logical idea would be to spread them out evenly, if you had to do so at all. This is the more plausable solution anyway. As for the NWO, I agree that humanity would be better off under one united rule, but only if it could be, as was mentioned, under the rule of a people's government. A sort of worldwide Senate, so to speak. Can't see many problems associated with that, more than minor ones that would only require adjustments, and I can see many benefits. I agree with Astyanax, bring it on.

Yeah I’ve thought the same thing about it not being such a bad thing. But since they are going to kill 80% of the world population it kinda made me rethink my rethink.

[edit on 9-5-2006 by Vision Ammunition]

Originally posted by denythestatusquo
So if the UN said to take 100 million Indians... then the US would have to do that and like it! Have a nice day!

Are you American? Allow me to assume that you are. Well, ask yourself: is this the way the United States government works at present? Can the federal government force whatever it likes on the states? Of course not; states have rights. The scope of those rights may be arguable, but that's democracy. A world government need not be any different. We're talking about a democratic, devolved system of government here, not a globe-strangling tyranny.

Even so, you raise a valid point. If all the world were a democracy under one government, a billion Indians would always outvote three hundred million Americans (and 1.2 billion Chinese would, too). The trick, then, would be to get people to stop thinking along nation-state lines and vote as individuals, according to their interest. This is partly a matter of careful planning and partly a matter of time. Incidentally, it should not be very difficult in the case of India, since family, ethnic, religious and other affiliations trump nationality for (I suspect) the majority of Indians. Maybe we should talk about moving 100 million Japanese instead?

If there really is a New World Order, then this is reconceptualization of nationality is just the sort of issue it should be addressing right now. And those who want to see a new world order (without the initial caps) should be thinking about it too.

In which context, denythestatusquo, I really must ask you: what's so bad about 100 million Indians anyway?

Originally posted by Astyanax
What's so bad about 100 million Indians anyway?

No reply.

Why am I not surprised?

You'd proabably get Brits, there are more off us to a square mile than in China, China has a lot of people but a lot of space.

Believe me NWO is not what you want. It doesn't need you but only the elite few. people who work with them are fools. They will just kill you off like the rest of us later. NWO is a Dictatorship, they do not have your own interests in mind but their own facist ideals.

Originally posted by TristanBW9456
Believe me NWO is not what you want. It doesn't need you but only the elite few.

You mean it's a meritocracy. What's wrong with that? Are you one of those who believes elitism is a dirty word?

no but i'm against Slavery. I don't get what you like about nwo. Do you work for them or something. Do you think that they will be "nice" to you because you are spreading this crap. Do you think that they wont kill you or put you in concentration camps. They say the founding fathers are terrorists, those that know about them are terrorists, gun owners are terrorists, J-walkers are terrorists, we are all terrorists to them. They have kids go around and tattle on people for hundreds of dollars, They arrest and brutalize law abiding citizens.

Originally posted by TristanBW9456
I don't get what you like about nwo. Do you work for them or something. Do you think that they will be "nice" to you because you are spreading this crap.

None of the above. I simply don't believe, not for one scintillating sliver of an instant, that a conspiracy of the sort you describe as the New World Order exists. It has no reality except in the minds of people who, finding it hard to cope with the fact that they, personally, will never make it past the first few rungs on the ladder to genuine wealth and power, need to find a scapegoat for their own lack of success. These are people who can't face the fact that they don't have what it takes, so they blame their failures on a conspiracy of the rich, privileged and powerful. That is the true origin of the NWO fantasy -- it's hardly a conspiracy.

TristanBW9456: if you're a young person, then the sooner you kick this stupid idea out of your belief system and replace it with hard work and faith in yourself, the sooner you'll be on your way to finding out how the world works and being able to play your part, however modest, in moving and shaping it. You won't need to believe in the stupid New World Order any more. If you're an older person, then I suggest you forget about blaming others for your troubles and try to make the best of whatever you have -- if it isn't already too late.

This kind of advice is rather patronizing, I know, but it is honestly and genuinely offered. If you find it offensive, my most sincere apologies. I can't think of anything more positive to offer you.

Let me just add (to repeat myself) that although a power-conspiracy NWO does not exist, the world is in dire need of a genuine new world order of the sort I mentioned in my first post above. And it seems -- wonder of wonders, miracle of miracles -- that it is slowly beginning to happen. And people like myself -- people who are sick and tired of violence, superstition and wilful ignorance -- are very much a part of it. So in that sense, yes, I do work towards (if not for) a new world order. So should you.

Dont worry I'm not offended... We just have different beliefs.

Oh and by the way: I'm too young for it to matter what I believe in

[edit on 5/16/06 by TristanBW9456]

No Iraq war.

No Iranian crisis.

No Darfur genocide.

No Israel.

No Palestine.

No tyrants declaring war on their own subjects in Ethiopia, Myanmar, Nepal and Uzbekistan.

No kleptocrats robbing their subjects blind in sub-Saharan Africa.

No spit-flying fanatics rousing their subjects to suicidal rage against the Infidel.

No failed states.

No frozen winters for Eastern Europeans who don't do what Russia tells them.

No international conflicts.

No famine.

No protectionism.

No travel restrictions.

No silly conspiracy theories about the New World Order.

Yet their isn't one... And anyway is anything in the world proper... And there will always be spit flying fanatics and international conflicts... what you said about israel and palestine.... tell me that was about the conflict between them....

Originally posted by TristanBW9456
What you said about israel and palestine... tell me that was about the conflict between them...

Didn't quite understand what you meant by this.

I really don't want to get into the Israel vs. Palestine question, but I will say this: I don't believe the conflict in that region can be resolved by the main actors alone, no matter how much international assistance they are given and how much pressure is put on them. I do believe the solution will be something that transcends the concept of nation-states as we know them.

It needs a higher, transnational authority to bring about a solution like that. One with teeth, unlike the UN. The (nonexistent) thing some people call the new world order might stand a chance.

Despite what the majority is saying about the NWO and it's alleged "agenda" - I have to side with Astyanax on this one.

Under a controlled consumer-oriented program, the majority of need/wants of the general populace would be fulfilled and it would open our lives up to more intellectual and personal pursuits.

It's a shame most people only think of the NWO and Illuminati in terms of a "fear of slavery", "mind control", the Bush Administration and the various propaganda sites on the internet.

It's time we evolved out of this mentality and began to accept this societal evolution as a reality, and redefine it in a more positive light.

Complete Globalization is not that far off, but if you're going to continue to "blame" external organizations for everything outside your immeditate realm of influence you're going to find yourself in a very small and undesired segment of the populace simply on your attitude alone.

Just an observation, not an attack.

Originally posted by elevatedone
I don't fear the NWO. I actually wouldn't mind seeing a change in the way countries are being run by governments. I think the change might be good.

Also, how would the implementation of the NWO affect the U.S.'s problem with illegal's and the whole immigration nightmare?

Since its one Government for everyone, would there still be independent nations, would you have to live where you are or could you simply move somewhere else with no problems of immigration?

I'm not really serious about my first paragraph in this thread, I just wanted to pull a full chains on here, but I seriously wonder how the NWO would change immigration / illegals etc.

your thoughts?

When man gets to much power he tends to go insane...
Thats all I say to this matter...

[edit on 21-5-2006 by muglert]

When man gets to much power he tends to go insane...
Thats all I say to this matter...

[edit on 21-5-2006 by muglert]

I couldn't have said it better myself. There will never be one all-powerful, all-knowing wise government. A good example is to look at why socialism/communism always fails to work.