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Wisdom: The Holy Spirit

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posted on May, 5 2006 @ 02:52 AM
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In "The Wisdom of Solomon" (The Apocrypha), Solomon advises the reader to make "wisdom" your first wife. He constantly refers to wisdom as "she" and "her" and as, get this, "the holy spirit". He says she was God's first creation (which we all know was light).

"And with thee (God) is wisdom, which knoweth thy works, and was present when thou wast making the world... Send her forth out of the holy heavens... that being present with me she may toil with me, and that I might learn what is well-pleasing before thee. For she knoweth all things...and in my doings she shall guide me in her glory...thou gavest wisdom, and sentest thy holy spirit from on high... and it was thus that the ways of them which are on earth were corrected... and through wisdom they were saved..."

Perhaps this is the divine feminine the Church fears?

-S




posted on May, 5 2006 @ 08:04 AM
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Yep.
also call Sofia, Venus, Diana, >>>>>>>
The Mother Goddess , Shakana( that is likely spelled wrong).



posted on May, 5 2006 @ 10:37 AM
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That is such a beautiful and valid book of the bible, IMO! I truly don't understand the arguments against the apocrypha that protestants seem to feel are justification against reading them.

It seems Wisdom should be our mother (as opposed to the Earth --carnal-mindedness, that is) and God, our Father:


External source: KJV, Public Domain
But wisdom is justified of all her children.
(~Luke 7:35)


These words of Christ's are, to me, an authentication of the book 'Wisdom.' It's a definite possibility that it was included in the old scriptures which provided His early education as a Jew and the Holy One of Israel.


External source: KJV, Public Domain
For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.
(~Luke 21:15)

Wherefore, brethren, look ye out among you seven men of honest report, full of the Holy Ghost and wisdom, whom we may appoint over this business.
(~Acts 6:3)


My theory/understanding:
Mary Magdalene represents Sophia...
The poem 'Thunder, Perfect Mind' was among the Nag Hammadi texts. If you've ever heard the Meredith Brooks song that goes: 'I'm a bitch, I'm a mother, I'm a child, I'm a lover, I'm a nightmare, I'm your dream...' then you might, perhaps, like me, see the similarities in the fullness of personality (soul) that is expressed.

Jesus was the 'Word.' I perceive this as being the name spoken when the Ultimate Mind (God) had His first thought.

And Jesus spoke of Himself in the context of being 'lightning from the east.' (fire and water is lightning--God's burning spirit combined with the human soul).

What is the 'voice' of lightning? Thunder, of course.

God is the origin of the thought, manifested as the Word of Truth, and transmitted with the voice of Thunder (wisdom which creates the 'perfect mind.')



posted on May, 5 2006 @ 04:33 PM
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Actually, The Apocrypha is contained within the High Anglican Bible. You can find it in any Anglican Church (I'm not talking about the gnostic apocrypha like the Gospel of Thomas, Mary, or Judas).

-S



posted on May, 5 2006 @ 04:51 PM
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Originally posted by Savonarola
In "The Wisdom of Solomon" (The Apocrypha), Solomon advises the reader to make "wisdom" your first wife. He constantly refers to wisdom as "she" and "her" and as, get this, "the holy spirit". He says she was God's first creation (which we all know was light).




There is a problem here. The Holy Spirit was not created. The Holy Spirit is God and has always been. He had no beginning and will have no end. So that is why this book is not accepted by all. It contradicts who God is.

If you have a spouse, normally spouses live togther and see each other everyday and communicate with each other. You are to treat wisdom that way. Live with it all the time, let it be a part of you. The Holy Spirit imparts wisdom. He is the giver and wisdom is a gift.



posted on May, 5 2006 @ 05:15 PM
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Originally posted by Savonarola
Actually, The Apocrypha is contained within the High Anglican Bible.

I didn't know that. I've got a Douay-Rheims for that purpose, myself.


You can find it in any Anglican Church (I'm not talking about the gnostic apocrypha like the Gospel of Thomas, Mary, or Judas).
-S


Right--I'm with you. Could you fill me in on the Anglican Church? Its origins and what-not?



posted on May, 5 2006 @ 05:27 PM
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This is an almost blatant reference to the Gnostic Sophia, as stalkingwolf
pointed out.

Shekinah is the Hebrew version of the feminine Shakti of the Indus Kush.

Chokmah or "Wisdom", on the Tree of Life is "God the Son"; but also has a feminine attribute(Seshat in Khemet I believe, Lakshmi in India) as seen in the Tarot of Kabbalah:





The Holy Spirit is Jehovah-Elohim, the Demiurge Architect of the Universe; also Abba(Shiva) and Aima(Parvati), represented by the Star of David or the Seal of Solomon:








For more on this, study "The Pistis Sophia Unveiled" and Gnostic Kabbalah.






[edit on 5-5-2006 by Tamahu]



posted on May, 5 2006 @ 05:37 PM
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Originally posted by Savonarola
You can find it in any Anglican Church (I'm not talking about the gnostic apocrypha like the Gospel of Thomas, Mary, or Judas).
-S


Looking back at the posts, I understand what you were clarifying, my apologies for not being clear in what I was saying.

Certain scriptures are 'approved' by various groups of human determination, and others are supposedly declared false information.

But whose is it, really, to decide? Why would God send us the Spirit of Truth if we weren't going to be able, then, to weed out truth from falsehood, in all areas of our life?

Is it really 'God-fearing' to trust men about what God says, or is it demonstrative of great faith to venture out, alone as far as human company but accompanied by God's divine and perfect guidance, and find all that is in this world that manifests God's glory in a recognizable fashion?

I've read countless sacred texts and so-called apocrypha. Always depending on God to guide me and using the canonized bible (revealed version, that is) as the yardstick
of evaluation.

There is much truth to be found in the world's writings. And of course, much delusion. Then again, a good portion of the responsibility for both lies within each seeker's human heart.



posted on May, 5 2006 @ 05:40 PM
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Originally posted by Tamahu
For more on this, study "The Pistis Sophia Unveiled"


Yes! Pistis Sophia, which translated, means 'faithful wisdom.'

The Bride.



posted on May, 6 2006 @ 11:00 PM
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Originally posted by queenannie38

quote: External source: KJV, Public Domain
But wisdom is justified of all her children.
(~Luke 7:35)



www.pe.../pdf/Luqach7.pdf


"And wisdom is justified by all its works." (Luke 7:35 from the original inspired Aramaic of the Pe#ta)

# = sh + it , the website automatically censors even valid words that contain sh + it .


[edit on 6-5-2006 by Paul of Nisbis]



posted on May, 6 2006 @ 11:01 PM
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Originally posted by queenannie38

Originally posted by Savonarola
Actually, The Apocrypha is contained within the High Anglican Bible.

I didn't know that. I've got a Douay-Rheims for that purpose, myself.


You can find it in any Anglican Church (I'm not talking about the gnostic apocrypha like the Gospel of Thomas, Mary, or Judas).
-S


Right--I'm with you. Could you fill me in on the Anglican Church? Its origins and what-not?


The Aprocryphical/Deuterocanonical Books

What is the Bible?

The Holy Bible, King James Version mentions who removed the apocrypha from the Bible (though some High Anglican churches still contain the apocrypha in between the old and new testiments).

Hope this helps.


-S



posted on May, 6 2006 @ 11:25 PM
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Originally posted by queenannie38

Originally posted by Savonarola
You can find it in any Anglican Church (I'm not talking about the gnostic apocrypha like the Gospel of Thomas, Mary, or Judas).
-S


Looking back at the posts, I understand what you were clarifying, my apologies for not being clear in what I was saying.

Certain scriptures are 'approved' by various groups of human determination, and others are supposedly declared false information.

But whose is it, really, to decide? Why would God send us the Spirit of Truth if we weren't going to be able, then, to weed out truth from falsehood, in all areas of our life?

Is it really 'God-fearing' to trust men about what God says, or is it demonstrative of great faith to venture out, alone as far as human company but accompanied by God's divine and perfect guidance, and find all that is in this world that manifests God's glory in a recognizable fashion?

I've read countless sacred texts and so-called apocrypha. Always depending on God to guide me and using the canonized bible (revealed version, that is) as the yardstick
of evaluation.

There is much truth to be found in the world's writings. And of course, much delusion. Then again, a good portion of the responsibility for both lies within each seeker's human heart.


The Cainites were a gnostic sect saw many evil biblical characters (like Cain, Samson, Judas) as good - because they defied the malicious god Yahweh (whereas they believed a nicer, kinder God was above even him). The dangers in gnostic apocrypha is that is, in essence, a mystery religion - that is, only some initiates, taught secret mysteries, are worthy of redemption. The rest of us non-initiates are doomed for our ignorance. Gnosticism is a selfish, elitist system.

At the crucifiction, the curtains at The Temple were "rent in twain" (ie, everything is revealed to all - no secrets). Don't hide your lantern. Tell everyone. That's the difference between gnosticism and Christianity.

So who decides what's truth and what's best for mankind? Hopefully the guys-on-the-watchtower-with-better-vision-than-ours, the parents-that-keep-us-from-burning ourselves-on-a-hot-stove, the whistleblower-in-the-Whitehouse-that-lets-us-know-the-dirt-on-our-poiliticians type priests. Hopefully.

-S



posted on May, 7 2006 @ 10:19 AM
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Originally posted by Savonarola
Hope this helps.


-S


Yes, thanks for your time, Savonarola.



posted on May, 7 2006 @ 10:27 AM
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Originally posted by dbrandt
The Holy Spirit is God and has always been.


Check your bible. The Holy Spirit is not God, but of God, from God. For us!



posted on May, 7 2006 @ 11:28 AM
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The carnal mind is enmity against God. (Rom. 8:7)


Here is more info on WISDOM.....and what the early Church fathers taught.

old Testament WISDOM

Great reading ......



In the first centuries of Christianity the Church writers and Fathers of the Church responded broadly to the philosophical ideas of their time, and they themselves used the concepts which had been worked out by philosophy. Why?

"I have no greater joy than to hear that my children walk in truth," writes the holy Apostle, John the Theologian (3 John 4).
"I have written briefly, exhorting and testifying that this is the true grace of God wherein ye stand," says the holy Apostle Peter in concluding his catholic epistle (1 Peter 5:12).
The Teaching of the Wisdom

IX
helen



posted on May, 7 2006 @ 02:12 PM
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Helen, I enjoyed reading your first link.

I liked this, in particular:


External source:
However, it would be a mistake to think that Biblical wisdom is the wisdom of earthly prosperity. The Bible sees true wisdom in humble devotion to God in the most severe sufferings and in recognizing the unfathomable nature of God's ways when suffering innocently.


The word 'Sophia' is not a female name (although we have derived a name from that word, it was a word first and a name second, like many names). It literally means 'wisdom' in Greek.

To present this concept, for the sake of discussion, in a somewhat nebulous antrhomorphized fashion, is not any less valid than when we call God 'he.' The bible calls God 'He' and it also calls wisdom 'She'. But we also know that God is 'Pure Spirit' and therefore gender is not even a factor, beyond seeking clarity in conversation.

God has all qualities and is all things. Wisdom is one of these things. God being a creator corresponds not to our male gender or female gender, but rather the combination of the two. The same two that were made in the 'image of' God's 'likeness.' Modern christianity discounts all femininity in relation to God--except Christ's mother, Mary, (and what's been done in that area is far more of an error than understanding God is complex and full, even when we think about 'male' and 'female' qualities or aspects).

The 'Church' puts itself as the 'divine feminine' it seems, calling itself 'Her' and all the associated references that go with.

I say this is because the 'Church' does seek to displace our own seeking of God's divine wisdom independently, instead saying that we must seek God through 'Her' which is not the case, biblically or empircally, and of course, the reasons this might be so have been discussed at length on this forum already.



posted on May, 7 2006 @ 09:16 PM
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Thank you queenannie!!!

I get soooo upset when people have a spiritual discussion and the inevitable "why can't God be a woman?"... "I think God must be a woman..." etc...

As if God has a penis or a vagina...

Father, Abba (daddy) is an endearing term, reminding us of his loving, protective, and corrective nature (power). The Holy Spirit, as a feminine term, might speak more of education, wisdom, and correct uses of power.

Male and female are probably the best for us to identify with the spiritual.

-S



posted on Jan, 1 2008 @ 05:33 AM
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A come back thread!
Inspired by Who is Melchizedek
What is WISDOM?
Is it female?
yes!
Does this prove women can become priests?
No!
Christ chose 12 Apostles....all of them being male!
So, who is WISDOM?
Almost all of the Old Testament is a Pre figuration of Christ and His Church, The Prophets(lesser and greater)all spoke of the coming Messiah and how He was to come into the world.....
let's see,


Wisdom went forth to make her dwelling among the children of men, and found no dwelling place,
Wisdom returned to her place, and took her seat among the angels (1 Enoch 42)


If Adam was the first Man CREATED
Jesus Christ becomes the Second Adam(not created)Immanuel translates God is with us)
If Eve was the first woman created
The Theotokos(Mother Of god)Virgin Mary becomes the Second Eve......
WISDOM is the Theotokos.....
there are numerous references pointing to the Theotokos being WISDOM..
where shall WISDOM be found
helen


EDIT.....added reference

[edit on 1/1/2008 by helen670]



posted on Jan, 1 2008 @ 06:05 AM
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I have wondered about "church" being feminine term especially since the church is referred to by Paul as "bride" of Christ. Otherwise there would be an argument for gay marriage right?



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