Video of iranian made VA-111 Shkval missile

Originally posted by Mehran
Also the missile we made is faster than Indias brahmos

.

I'm sorry, I think you misunderstood. The Brahmos is supersonic at Mach 2.8
Thats almost kilometer/second, which is more than 3000km/h.
Also it is a cruise missile (ASCM) and not a torpedo.

And what's all this about US satellites picking up 'magnetic' emissions from submerged subs?
And source(s) on that?

mehran

what exactly are you proud of? your country's ability to develop weaponry? this to me does not make sense as i live in a free society (your posts are obviously not from iran) where i can pursue my dreams.

hope to be proud of the day that iran becomes a state that does not supress individual opinion.

until then you are proud of a nation that is controlled by religious zealots.

ruin

Originally posted by darth ruin
mehran

what exactly are you proud of? your country's ability to develop weaponry? this to me does not make sense as i live in a free society (your posts are obviously not from iran) where i can pursue my dreams.

hope to be proud of the day that iran becomes a state that does not supress individual opinion.

until then you are proud of a nation that is controlled by religious zealots.

ruin

oh snap!!!

you show him

Isn't every nation proud of their military achievements? Thats all I remember about the cold war when growing up. The US military was damn proud of the fact that they could potentially blow the world 500 times over.

Look at the US military budget now. They must be damn proud of themselves. Personally I think Iran should be allowed to develop weapons. I mean the Israelis have sold billions worth of tech to China so clearly they are just being hypocrits threatening Iran just because they can. Irans under the gun and facing pre-emptive nuclear aggression. I think it's clearly justified that they have a right to defend themselves. Nobody wants to die laying down. Everyone wants to go standing up and they have that right.

Lets not actually get into a military hardware argument either because thats how the US has made alot of it's money over the years. Having companies go into different countries turning the populations against one another and making a big buck off each side. Lets not all jump on Iran for expressing the right to defend themselves against NATO and Israeli aggression.


Alot of the Bush's family fortune comes from money made by making weapons for Hitler in the run up to the war afterall.

Forget Iran or North Korea. Israel is the country I trust the least with nuclear weapons.



[edit on 4-4-2006 by Crazy_Mr_Crowley]

persoanlly i rate the Spearfish - something about 81 knots and a range of 30+ miles
as better than the mk-48ADCAP


might be me though


damn those `heavy` class torps are heavy(sic) - that thing weighs more than my car (2 tons)!!

Originally posted by Harlequin
persoanlly i rate the Spearfish - something about 81 knots and a range of 30+ miles
as better than the mk-48ADCAP

Intersting your source claims it can only travel 12.5 miles at 81 knts ( high speed setting ). However it is quoted as being able to travel 65km at 60 knts here www.naval-technology.com...

Either way, the Spearfish and Mk-48 make the Iranian torpedo look like a joke.



[edit on 4-4-2006 by mad scientist]

Spearfish has been around for years - there are many rumours that the mk-48 is just a copy


although a small launch buggy type system for the rocket torp would be interesting - another type of torp mine maybe?

Originally posted by Harlequin
Spearfish has been around for years - there are many rumours that the mk-48 is just a copy

On the contrary the Mk-48 has been around far longer. The oringinal Mk-48 was first deployed in 1978 and the MK-48 ADCAP was deployed in 1990.
The Spearfish on the other hand was first deployed in 1992.

i think alot of people are missing the point with this torpedo the iranians are most likly to use it from small light weight attack boats.

who knows, iran could possibly even have a small basic stealth boat with basic angles and RAM paint on it which is designed to launch these torpedos and possible some small light weight anti-ship missiles.

from the video they actually launched the torpedo from the back of a small boat. maybe thats how they will use it. and to the people who keep on acting as if there navy is unstopable this is not true any ship can be sunk if the enemy put enough effort into the attack. those ships are only designed to detect certain threats if the enemy pull a uniqe manuver the ship wont be able to detect the threat until its too late.

link for video:

www.iranfocus.com...


and its a DOH from me about the mk-48 - i think i was thking about another torp


edit:

whats hillarious is that alot of places are reporting that the russians STOLE the the `clearly american tech` and gave it the iranians

[edit on 4/4/06 by Harlequin]

mr crowley...

i am proud of the fact that we can defend ourselves and that we can vote out those that we perceive don't provide that defense for it's citizens.

as far as trust in nations that have nuclear weapons, ask yourself this question......

what countries that have them have actually used them in the last 50 years?

what do the majority of these countries have in common?

i think that a nuclear iran is a tad more risky to the world than a nuclear israel, india, pakistan, russia, china, north korea, usa, and such.

ruin

Originally posted by iqonx
i think alot of people are missing the point with this torpedo the iranians are most likly to use it from small light weight attack boats.

who knows, iran could possibly even have a small basic stealth boat with basic angles and RAM paint on it which is designed to launch these torpedos and possible some small light weight anti-ship missiles.

Well, radar isn't the only sensor the US NAvy uses, due to the tirpedos short range, they could track incoming threats with EO ir IIR sensors. Also as the boats have to come so close, the USN radars would be easily able to overpower any stealth that ould possibly be built into the boats. The torpedo also has a small warhead about 200kg. When the USS Cole was attacked, it was with 500+kg of HE.

from the video they actually launched the torpedo from the back of a small boat. maybe thats how they will use it. and to the people who keep on acting as if there navy is unstopable this is not true any ship can be sunk if the enemy put enough effort into the attack. those ships are only designed to detect certain threats if the enemy pull a uniqe manuver the ship wont be able to detect the threat until its too late.

The torp has a range under 7500 yards and it's unguided. Any boat coming that close would be seen as a potential threat. Not only that the torpedo would have to be launched much closer to guarantee a hit. at it's maxiumum range it would take about 70 seconds to reach it's target. A ship travelling at 20 kts will travel 700m in that time, as the torpedo has no guidance, the probablity of a hit are far less.

I guess it's time to point out the following ( again):

The Immutable Nature of War

Wake-up call

Ex-General:War Game Rigged

War games rigged?

The carrier myth


www.abovetopsecret.com...

If the will to win is there and the country in question is willing to invest/lose as much as it takes to achieve said victory they may be beaten but never occupied successfully

Now i have my doubts about Iran in terms of will to sacrifice ( not something i would consider when fighting North Koreans for instance) and technical capacity ( unlike say the Israeli's) but i do believe they have the hatred ( the older people; and for good reason) for America to motivate them for some time. If they could get in a few early blows ( to make them believe they are not as badly led as last time round) with these types of weapons then this wont be ODS 2 imo.

Given that i have rather little faith in America's capacity to ward of anything but a small number of anti ship missiles i think the scenario as above might yet turn out to be more truth than fiction.

Stellar

[edit on 4-4-2006 by StellarX]

It's no "accomplishment" by your country to build this, or any of the other "high tech" crap that Iran's boasting about these days. When you buy something from another country undisclosed, and claim you made it, everyone in the world knows to wave the BS flag on that one. Iran has nothing to be proud of, except sleazy ties with cash-strapped, anti-US Russia.
BTW... nice "stealth" boat. I can buy one as a kit plane online as well. www.hovercraft.com
Congratulations - wood doesn't reflect radar like metal, hence, a "stealth" kit plane. What'd your country invest? A $20k mail-order? whoo hoo! Not to mention all the other crap on there, (along with the exposed propeller! - a giant reflector) it'll reflect radar anyways. Oh, and don't forget all the other US airborne and space based full-spectrum sensing equipment usable to detect aircraft like that. It's no different than a car travelling down the road - and that can be seen by JSTARS, and transmitted to everyone on the battlefield. Oh, and don't forget the CBG's AEGIS escorts!
Iran can push the world a little at a time... but eventually, it will be "dealt with," one way or another. You're no match for the US, on ANY grounds... even with Russian showpieces that you claim credit for.
Oh, and while your little suicide boats are trying to get within the 7,500m range required for the sh**val, they'll be killed by a host of other US defences, not to mention the 55,000m range of a standard torpedo. Perhaps Germany will share its underwater missiles that it has designed specifically to kill the Sh**val.
Keep pushing your luck... Hitler tried it, and look what happened. You may have allies, but you're still outclassed by a LONG shot. Oh... where's the Iranian space shuttle? Or are you just going to buy the old Buran, and call it indigenous? Iran would still be in the stone age if it weren't for oil money and Russian technology. Maybe we'll just have to put it back into the stone age.
Certain countries may be a threat to the US on a grand scale, but Iran is not one of them. Go back to your pathetic nut-case fringe-of-reality terrorist state and hang out with your good buddy 'ol Kim Jong.

Originally posted by Mehran
Some of you guys have not seen the missile being tested but this is a video forum a different forum. it is a big accomplishment for us making our own missiles and one that is like this makes me proud of my country

. it is so fast that not even the camera man could keep it up with it. Correct me if im wrong but iran is the second nation to have missiles like this and the only one in the world that re-engineered VA-111 shkval. Like i said Iran in missile technology is more advanced than any other middle east country.

Link

Iran says fires sonar-evading, underwater missile

TEHRAN (Reuters) - Iran has test-fired a sonar-evading underwater missile that can outpace any enemy warship, a senior naval commander told state television on Sunday during a week of war games in the Gulf.

Western nations have been watching developments in Iran's missile capabilities with concern amid a standoff over the Iranian nuclear program, which the West says is aimed at building atomic bombs. Iran says the program is only civilian.

Analysts say the United States could take military action against Iran if it fails to resolve the nuclear dispute through diplomatic means. Iranian commanders say their armed forces are ready to respond to any attack.

Iran earlier in the war games said it tested a radar-evading missile and Sunday's announcement is likely to add to Western worries. Iran has a commanding position over the Strait of Hormuz at the entrance to the Gulf, a shipping route through which passes some two-fifths of all the oil traded in the world.

"This missile evades sonar technology under the water and even if the enemy sonar system could detect its movement under the water, no warship could escape from it because of its high velocity," Revolutionary Guards Rear Admiral Ali Fadavi said.

[edit on 2-4-2006 by Mehran]

[edit on 2-4-2006 by Mehran]

[edit on 2-4-2006 by Mehran]

[Mod Edit: Link format - Jak]

[edit on 3/4/06 by JAK]

Originally posted by mad scientist

Well, radar isn't the only sensor the US NAvy uses, due to the tirpedos short range, they could track incoming threats with EO ir IIR sensors. Also as the boats have to come so close, the USN radars would be easily able to overpower any stealth that ould possibly be built into the boats. The torpedo also has a small warhead about 200kg. When the USS Cole was attacked, it was with 500+kg of HE.

well IR and EO Sensors are not that great at scanning the ocean and even then they can pick up taregt about 10km away. also about a "stealth boat" a stealthed boat based around the concept of deflection and radar absrobing would be almost invisible even to the most powerfull radar at 10km in the sea. the size of the boat the iranians used to launch the torpedo would be very difficult to detect and/or locate by the ship simply becuase of the ocean waves and the way the ship is so close to the surface of the ocean.

Originally posted by mad scientist


The torp has a range under 7500 yards and it's unguided. Any boat coming that close would be seen as a potential threat. Not only that the torpedo would have to be launched much closer to guarantee a hit. at it's maxiumum range it would take about 70 seconds to reach it's target. A ship travelling at 20 kts will travel 700m in that time, as the torpedo has no guidance, the probablity of a hit are far less.

well first of all we dont really know if the torpedo is guided/unguided the assumption that its unguided is based on the idea thats its a complete copy of the russian version. so lets say it is unguided obviously there not going to fire it at the ship if the ship is moving they will fire ahead of the ship or in the direction of the ships movment to compensate for the movement of the target. im sure the iranians are not retards and are capable of making war time desisions.

Originally posted by TorqueDawg
It's no "accomplishment" by your country to build this, or any of the other "high tech" crap that Iran's boasting about these days. When you buy something from another country undisclosed, and claim you made it, everyone in the world knows to wave the BS flag on that one. Iran has nothing to be proud of, except sleazy ties with cash-strapped, anti-US Russia.
BTW... nice "stealth" boat. I can buy one as a kit plane online as well. www.hovercraft.com
Congratulations - wood doesn't reflect radar like metal, hence, a "stealth" kit plane. What'd your country invest? A $20k mail-order? whoo hoo! Not to mention all the other crap on there, (along with the exposed propeller! - a giant reflector) it'll reflect radar anyways. Oh, and don't forget all the other US airborne and space based full-spectrum sensing equipment usable to detect aircraft like that. It's no different than a car travelling down the road - and that can be seen by JSTARS, and transmitted to everyone on the battlefield. Oh, and don't forget the CBG's AEGIS escorts!
Iran can push the world a little at a time... but eventually, it will be "dealt with," one way or another. You're no match for the US, on ANY grounds... even with Russian showpieces that you claim credit for.
Oh, and while your little suicide boats are trying to get within the 7,500m range required for the sh**val, they'll be killed by a host of other US defences, not to mention the 55,000m range of a standard torpedo. Perhaps Germany will share its underwater missiles that it has designed specifically to kill the Sh**val.
Keep pushing your luck... Hitler tried it, and look what happened. You may have allies, but you're still outclassed by a LONG shot. Oh... where's the Iranian space shuttle? Or are you just going to buy the old Buran, and call it indigenous? Iran would still be in the stone age if it weren't for oil money and Russian technology. Maybe we'll just have to put it back into the stone age.
Certain countries may be a threat to the US on a grand scale, but Iran is not one of them. Go back to your pathetic nut-case fringe-of-reality terrorist state and hang out with your good buddy 'ol Kim Jong.

you seem to be a very angry insecure person. may want to try and relax. Iran has some very good kit you cant call it crap. they produce some decent stuff and these are a threat iran has 280km cruise missiles and has other torpedos as well with long range. this torpedo is just another torpedo in the collection to provide a more complete defensive capability.

so people need to stop acting as if iran will just use 1 type of weopon they have many and will use a combined offensive to provide a complete defense of there country so dont expect a small boat to come near a carrier battle group instead expect a rain of anti-ship cruise missiles combined with long range torpedos and small attack boats with this torpedo and then you get the real picture.

Germany has had theirs for a couple of years now, guided as well.
as reported on out own ATS
www.abovetopsecret.com...

www.worldaffairsboard.com...

German companies have developed a highly advanced new supercavitating torpedo known as the ‘Barracuda’.

Built by Diehl BGT Defence, and Altas Elektronik the previously top secret Barracuda travels at over 800km/h, faster than the Shkval, and is fully guided, capable of twisting and turning in on its target at high speed!

Recently unveiled in May at IMDEX 2005 in Singapore the Barracuda has already undergone a whole range of successful tests. The designers of the prototype Barracuda boast that its capabilities are unmatched, claiming the design is 10 years ahead of American research. It is claimed the Barracuda is maneuverable enough even to home in on, and knock out an incoming Shkval!
..................................
and this is about Shkval II

Development of the Shkval has continued through the 1980’s and 1990’s to the present day. Very little information is available about the Shkval II, the existence of which was made public by the Russian government in 1998. Rumours state a top speed of possibly 450+ mph (720 kph/h) and a vastly improved range, believed by some to be in the region of 60+ miles (100 km). The fact that the Shkval II is guided renders it vastly superior to the original Shkval. The Shkval II is thought to be able to supercavitate, then if need be slow down and reacquire its target, before speeding up and homing in for the kill. Yet newer techniques developed by Ukrainian scientists are believed to offer the possibility for high speed supercav guidance and maneuvering.

some more info from www.defensetech.org...

The American Supercav and the Russian VA-111 Shkval are both high-speed supercavitating torpedoes, 250 mph class (more recently, there are also the English MK70 SpearFish TL8 and the German Barracuda). They don't use blade propellers to move, but powerful powder rocket motors. A fewer part of the generated hot gas is also projected in a front outlet on their nozzle, and the water in contact is vaporized, surronding the entire body, creating very low drag, thus high speed capabilities.
Russia has sold about 40 Shkval-E to China in the 90's.
www.periscope.ucg.com...

But think this is old tech: Shkval is more than thirty years old... Its developement program began at Soviet Research Institute NII-24 in the 60's, and a LOT of work, completly different, has since been done. In particular with magnetohydrodynamic torpedoes, made in the 80's, that literally suck water amount of the body and all along of it, with strong electromagnetic forces.
The Russian MHD torpedo codename would be translated in English as "the Big One" or "the Fat One".

MHD torpedoes can travel at very high speed under water such as 1700 mph, because drag is not just reduced as supercavs, but completely eliminated. The drag is even negative, providing up to 70% of thrust thanks to MHD apsiration (around 30% provided by the rocket engine).
MHD propulsion requires large amount of electric power, and the very clever idea of these torpedoes lays in the way how the current is generated: they don't stock it in batteries, nor any capacitors. They create it in situ, extracting electric charges from the exhaust hot (very hot) gas, with an efficient MHD converter that relies on electrodes and magnetic coils. Due to the temperature, the whole system has a very short lifespan (10 seconds or so) but who cares since with such ultra speed you need 3 to 6 seconds to destroy submarine nuclear platforms ? The enemy just cannot react quickly enough.
Now, think that US Navy has since replaced copper coils by superconducting coils, and you can imagine where they are today. Think that the limit is the sound barrier under water and that this speed, unlike in air, is... 3315 mph.

As for transposing this supercavitating device in air for high speed bunker penetrators, this is a little weird. Perhaps they use a plasma torch in front of the missile (as the gaz in front of these old torpedoes). The best and most efficient way would remain using an antimatter-plasma torch, but... ;-)

while i agree with your sources hoever in an exercise of this size certain thigs have to be scripted van riper. While the style of warfare negeates much of the tech,firepower, logistics,speed etc advantage the us would have its unconventional and would only work in certain countries. In certain scenarios where more sppedis involved u cant just rely simply on low tech such as ina country the size of china,russia,us,or canada or similar size. fast attack boats are good great for nullyfying us amphibious assaults however i dont see how it would threaten AC carriers which operate thousands of miles away guarded by sestroyers,battlships,other small boats, helicopters etc and using standoff weapons. Im not rying to contradict the source just trying to point out how it wont always work and under the proper conditions u ca seriously upset us assaults such as amphibious assaults,land forces etc. But i dont see how it has anything to do with the AEGIS u stated. Sure it has flaws and a success rate of only 75% where mass attack would get past it however as sysytems progress it should get alittle beeter like 7 percent. nice post anyways.

Iranian version of shkval appears to be longer in length, though it certainly resembles the Russian missile. roughly 30% longer. Iranian version may well have a longer range or a more powerful warhead.

I read somewhere that Iran could have obtained the top-secret torpedo technology from ex-soviet Kyrgyzran or China. and there was another speculation that it resembles german advanced supercavitating torpedo known as 'Barracuda'.

have a close look.

Russian Shkval:

Iranian version:


Edit: fixed links to pictures

KEEP IT REAL

[edit on 5-4-2006 by proprog]

^^^ You do realise that we can't see those pictures, we aren't members of that forum. Maybe you should host them on www.imageshack.us....