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Will the Real William Shakespeare Please Standup




Topic started on 17-12-2005 @ 02:21 PM by Cicada


Here's an interesting little article I found on The Supernatural World site about the true identity of Shakespeare:

The 'Real' Shakespeare

The authors of the book contend the real Shakespeare was the Elizabethan figure Sir Henry Neville. Without the book itself it is hard to really consider their argument but the mystery of the authorship of Shakespeare's plays is a great topic for discussion.

For those unfamiliar with the issue, Manly P. Hall makes a very good presentation of the matter in "The Secret Teachings of All Ages" where he contends quite convincingly that the esotericist Sir Francis Bacon, author of "The New Atlantis", actually wrote the plays.

Bacon, Shakspere, and the Rosicrucians

Here's the Droeshout portrait of Shakespeare and Hall's comments on it from the above linked chapter:




There are no authentic portraits of Shakspere in existence. The dissimilarities the Droeshout, Chandos, Janssen, Hunt, Ashbourne, Soest, and Dunford portraits prove conclusively that the artists were unaware of Shakspere's actual features. An examination of the Droeshout portrait discloses several peculiarities. Baconian enthusiasts are convinced that the face is only a caricature, possibly the death mask of Francis Bacon. A comparison of the Droeshout Shakspere with portraits and engravings of Francis Bacon demonstrates the identity of the structure of the two faces, the difference in expression being caused by lines of shading. Not also the peculiar line running from the ear down to the chin. Does this line subtly signify that the face itself a mask, ending at the ear? Notice also that the head is not connected with the body, but is resting on the collar. Most strange of all is the coat: one-half is on backwards. In drawing the jacket, the artist has made the left arm correctly, but the right arm has the back of the shoulder to the front. Frank Woodward has noted that there are 157 letters on the title page. This is a Rosicrucian signature of first importance. The date, 1623, Plus the two letters "ON" from the word "LONDON," gives the cryptic signature of Francis Bacon, by a simple numerical cipher. By merely exchanging the 26 letters of the alphabet for numbers, 1 became A, 6 becomes F, 2 becomes B, and 3 becomes C, giving AFBC. To this is added the ON from LONDON, resulting in AFBCON, which rearranged forms F. BACON.


For those unfamiliar with the fascinating figure of Francis Bacon:

Francis Bacon

Here's the Wikipedia article on Neville:

Sir Henry Neville

And one on the issue in general:

Shakespearean Authorship



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reply posted on 17-12-2005 @ 04:27 PM by Sparkie the Wondersnail


I believe the works of William Shakespeare were written by a collective..

The works seem to me to be too numerous for a single person to write and perform during one lifetime. The actors then got together, worked out the kinks in the production and after it was performed a few times before an audience written down in folio form.

Most plays when they are first written, don't quite work until they have been worked on by a company of actors to work out logistical problems and such. It seems that the amount of work done on these plays to take them to the current form that we have would have required this process to make sure that all the jokes worked in the proper places, that actors who played multiple roles could get to their assigned spaces etc.

But again its only my opinion.

[edit on 17-12-2005 by Sparkie the Wondersnail]



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reply posted on 18-12-2005 @ 04:31 AM by Mayet


I like Manly P's overlay of Franics Bacon and William Shalespeare. It was well done and his whole theory was foood for thought.
manly P had some great ideas in that book .. Gave me years of starting points to investigate as well.



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reply posted on 18-12-2005 @ 11:25 AM by yeahright


Good issue.

My personal favorite candidate is Edward de Vere, the Earl of Oxford.

www.shakespeare-oxford.com...

I first became familiar with this topic some 20 years ago when my favorite editorialist, Joseph Sobran, wrote extensively about it in his column.



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reply posted on 18-12-2005 @ 10:48 PM by Cicada



originally posted by Sparkie the Wondersnail
I believe the works of William Shakespeare were written by a collective.


It's a possibility but I don't think the fact that the author(s) was prolific is really evidence of that. Think of Steven King (I'm not comparing King to Shakespeare). Some artists are just tremendously productive. Bacon has a lot of legends surrounding him, but he does seem to have been one of those multitasking Renaissance men (like Da Vinci or Van Eyck). There are many playwrights who would take offence at your suggestion that the writing of a successful play is dependent upon the cast and crew. At any rate, the Shakespeare folios don't feature complex blocking, set descriptions, etc. Here's an example from the 1623 First Folio:

The Tempest

Mayet,

You've got to love Hall. His argument is still the most compelling one to me as well as it deals so intimately with actual printing ciphers in the folios, and as a component of the Rosicrucian mystery the matter gains something of an understandable motive.



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reply posted on 19-12-2005 @ 12:06 AM by bsbray11


Thanks for posting this, Cicada. I never really suspected anything like this, but always wondered why the lines on Shakespeare's tombstone sucked so badly. I've heard that maybe he didn't write those himself, but now, I'm thinking, maybe he did after all.

At any rate those books listed on that link sound like they're definitely worth my checking out. Again, thanks man.



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reply posted on 19-12-2005 @ 12:10 AM by Beelzebubba


My pick is Christopher Marlowe.



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reply posted on 20-12-2005 @ 12:38 PM by Cicada


Here's a link to the oldest continuously running society dedcated to the Shakesperean authorship issue, the Francis Bacon Society Incorporated.



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reply posted on 30-8-2007 @ 04:35 PM by Francis Bacon


To The Readers:

Here's a little family secret:

Note that the title page of the 1623 First Filio (shown) contains a very typical cypher of the times. Good cyphers were cleverly hidden in plain sight.

At the very top of the 1623 First Folio page is the cleverly cyphered name of Francis BACON.

Look very, very closly at the Bard's name:
Mr. VVILLIAM SHAKESPEARES

Notice that a double "V" is used instead of a contemporary "W"?

To an astute codebreaker of the author's day, that is a subtle visual clue to de-cypherer. To whit:

Your attention should be drawn to the fact that the first five letters of VVILLIAM's name are commonly used Roman Numerals:
V=5, I=1, L=50. Thus, VVILL sums up to be an Arabic/decimal value of 111: V+V+I+L+L =111

So, the whole name transforms by substitution into:
Mr. 111 I AM SHAKESPEARES

Two very common cyphers of the day where the Simple Cypher:
A=1, B=2, C=2, etc. (There were only 24 letters in the Elizabethan alphabet of the day: I & J were combined as were U and V. );
and the Kaye Cypher (This link clearly explains and authenticates it)
Note that Bacon = 111..... WOW!... magic!

Mr. BACON I AM SHAKESPEARES

or now, more completely from whole text of the title page:

Mr. BACON I am SHAKESPEARE's Comedies, Histories, & Tragedies...

Coincidence? ya, right!

-- Francis Bacon of Tupelo
francis.bacon@gmail.com



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reply posted on 30-8-2007 @ 04:50 PM by Silk


Im surprised Marlowe hasnt got a mention yet ?

but hey your doing the tourist trade in Stattford upon Avon out of business (after they nearly got Mary Ardens house wrong)


(I profess a vested interest - but it is a lovely town to vivit and we do have the birthplace and some amazing pictures of the man himself considering non exist)

[edit on 30-8-2007 by Silk]



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reply posted on 30-8-2007 @ 05:00 PM by Freeborn


Well I'm going to post something quite contentious and controversial....
I believe William Shakespeare wrote Shakespeare's plays.
Sorry, got no evidence to substantiate.

Seriously though,
Try as I might, and I have tried on several occassions, I honestly struggle to understand any of it.

The only play I slightly understand is Macbeth, and that's only because I studied it for my O Level and my teacher walked us through act by act.



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reply posted on 4-9-2007 @ 07:06 PM by Francis Bacon


Macbeth, eh?

Here's the ol' 111 Kaye cypher encription yet again!!

The three "VVItChes" chant thrice:

"Fire burn and Cauldron bubble."

V+V+I+C = 111

Kaye Cypher: 111 = Bacon
Simple Cypher: 33 = Bacon

Another coincidence, right??!!

ya, sure.

Again yours,
Francis Bacon, Tupelo MS



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reply posted on 9-9-2007 @ 03:10 PM by trek315


Here's yet another article with possibilities.

news.aol.com...


The "real" author has been identified by various writers in the past as Christopher Marlowe, Francis Bacon, or the Earl of Oxford, Edward de Vere.


The piece goes on to mention several noteworthy individuals from the past who have had doubts.


The declaration names 20 prominent doubters of the past, including Mark Twain, Orson Welles , Sir John Gielgud and Charlie Chaplin .


I had never given thought to questioning the author of these works but, as the article points out at the end, I suppose that is the point; We should question things. I think the value in something like this does indeed come much more from the pursuit of the truth than from whether or not the real author or authors are ever discovered.



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