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LCS Competition

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posted on Dec, 6 2005 @ 11:16 PM
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The US Navy's Littoral Combat Ship (LCS) is their future surface combat ship, it will be close to the shores and be stealthy.

The Navy has chosen 2 companies to go head-2-head, to see which one is better, Lockheed Martin & General Dynamics.



Lockheed is sticking with the proven design of a mono-hull, while General Dynamics is going with a more exotic trimaran-hull.
The Navy has given them the money for both companies to build 2 “Flight Zero” ships. The Navy is expected to order 50-60 of them, with a total price tag of around 12 billion.
The first ship from each builder is currently under construction, Lockheed will have their first one done by December 06’, and General Dynamics will have theirs done by October 07’.

Current designs from both teams will carry a 57mm naval gun, along with .50 cal machine guns and NETFIRES anti-armor/ anti-personnel missiles. The ships will also rely on their onboard MH-60 Helicopters and Fire Scout Helicopters - a program DID has profiled in-depth; a Sparton Unmanned Surface Vessel (USV) - also profiled by DID; and a variety of Unmanned Underwater Vessels (UUV) forunderwater operations. UUV’s currently being tested for use with the LCS include the Bluefin 21 advance surveyor, WLD-1 which tows AQS-20 mine-hunting sonar, and others.
Defensive systems will include automated chaff/flare dispensers, plus a Raytheon RIM-116 RAM (Rolling Airframe Missile) launcher.

General Dynamics LCS
Lockheed Martin LCS
Navy's Official Litoral Combat Ship Site
Up-to-date info on LCS


So, which one do you like better?
And which one do you think should be proclaimed the winner?



EDIT: please move this into "Military and Government Projects".....thanks.

[edit on 6-12-2005 by Murcielago]




posted on Dec, 6 2005 @ 11:29 PM
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Uh this is the Aircraft page.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 12:37 AM
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I like the General Dynamics design.

And yes it is in the wrong forum



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 12:46 AM
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I think it comes down to capability, versatility, and functionality. Lockheed is definitely my vote.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 01:07 AM
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Now, it is a cool picture & a cool concept, but wrong forum, but at the same time, if Lockheed made or designed it, technically he got the right forum, at least from it being from an airplane desinger.

Cool pic. I know when I got a post on the wrong forum, they didn't move it, they yanked it altogether.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 02:06 AM
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I vote for GD, just because I know some relatives that will make gobs of money!!!


OK, for real, I just want the BEST one to win. It seems the GD one is more stealthy and more technologiclly advanced (based purely on the surface of course) while the LM one seems to be more reliable an predictable.

I hope the USN picks the best one, considering all factors.

My prediction is that they take the LM one, because as a rule, the USN is very conservative.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 02:23 AM
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I've heard that the tri/catamaran designs have a rough ride in heavy seas, but are faster, and more stable in shallow water ops. Not to mention that the GD design just LOOKS cooler.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 03:39 AM
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Here in the uk we had a trimaran aircrat carrier proposed but of course stuffy old Britain soon killed that off and chose a more conventional design, so if only for that reason I would like to see GD's proposal win if it proved some people wrong (I loved the carrier design). However I don't know if it was rejected for sound reasons or not so I'm orobably not best qualified to choose


I tried to find an image of the design to illustrate this post but it seems to have vanished, however here is another trimaran ship for the Royal Navy that was scrapped this year





posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 03:43 AM
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I really think the main problem with the trimaran config is that it has't been done before.


As far as I know, every nations Navy takes a very cautious and conservative aproach to radical design. I really think there either needs to be a breakthrough demonstration of the design, or a gradual intigration of such designs.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 03:48 AM
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They've had the catamaran that they've been playing with out here for over a year now. It's been VERY sucessful in everything they've used it for. Hopefully that will get some of the stick in the muds out of the way and let them take the trimaran for the LCS.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 06:30 AM
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Lockheed have made a stealth boat known as the 'Sea Shadow'. Wasnt there a stealth boat in the bond film 'Tomorrow never dies'. I remember seeing it on the screen, It was actually bigger than the real life existing sea shadow.



posted on Dec, 7 2005 @ 04:15 PM
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Yes, I I know its the worng forum (as I stated with the "edit" on the first post.) Seems like th mods move the ones I dont want moved.....and when I want it moved there nowhere to be seen.


anywho.....I like the trimaran design better, because of several reasons, like it can go faster, and its wider for more room, and is more stable in calm seas as well as rough seas, for those ocean going trips. I think its about time for a little change-up, instead of the same ol' same ol'.



posted on Dec, 9 2005 @ 12:09 AM
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Funding have been approved to buy versions of both. In the end both ships may be built.



posted on Dec, 9 2005 @ 12:24 AM
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Wasnt there a stealth boat in the bond film 'Tomorrow never dies'. I remember seeing it on the screen, It was actually bigger than the real life existing sea shadow.


That was a French Lafayette Class frigate I think.
An interesting ship, I believe the Taiwanese and Saudi's have purchased some as well.



posted on Dec, 9 2005 @ 12:50 AM
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Originally posted by jetsetter
Funding have been approved to buy versions of both. In the end both ships may be built.


wouldn't that be more expensive though?

The navy has givin them the money for 2 ships per company...then i'm assuming they will do a head to head competition like the AF does with jets...and pick which ever one is superior.



posted on Dec, 9 2005 @ 01:37 AM
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Originally posted by Murcielago

Originally posted by jetsetter
Funding have been approved to buy versions of both. In the end both ships may be built.


wouldn't that be more expensive though?

The navy has givin them the money for 2 ships per company...then i'm assuming they will do a head to head competition like the AF does with jets...and pick which ever one is superior.


Interesting comparison...

I hate to say it, but I think we are going to see a repeat of the ATF program, where the YF-23 was "better" in most high end areas like stealth and speed, but the LM design is deemed safer, and gets the nod.

Hopefully, the GD design will be so superior that the USN can't not pick it.



posted on Dec, 9 2005 @ 04:52 AM
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The UK concept sketch of a trimaran carrier was never anything more, the navy never considered it seriously. The triamaran pic that you put up is a concept sketch of what a frigate might look like from when we were bulding RV Triton (which proved trimaran hullforms work). The project that you talked about was the FSC (future surface combatant). It is not scrapped but on hold most likely till mid way through the next decade (uk gvmt cuts again) t would be nice to see GD win it but as has been said navies generally like what they know, which suggests LM may get it.

It should also be noted that the UK companies that worked on Triton are also lending their support and experience on designing and building trimarans. (albeit quietly, it is seen as a negative to have too many non US companies in your team)



posted on Dec, 9 2005 @ 01:46 PM
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AMM
I hate to say it, but I think we are going to see a repeat of the ATF program, where the YF-23 was "better" in most high end areas like stealth and speed, but the LM design is deemed safer, and gets the nod.

I hope not.

Although perhaps thats why Lockheed went with the monohull instead, since they knew the Navy had more faith in them.
Since LM's original LCS design was a catamaran.




posted on Dec, 10 2005 @ 01:27 AM
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Originally posted by Murcielago
I hope not.

Although perhaps thats why Lockheed went with the monohull instead, since they knew the Navy had more faith in them.
Since LM's original LCS design was a catamaran.


Wow, that is even more evidence IMHO...

LM may be on to something with the conservative designs...

Since the US Army Camanche/Crusader and the US Navy A-12 programs have all been canned along with the USAF ATB/ATF programs getting a fraction of the units they wanted, I think LM has realized that the military branches want there billions of investment dollars to actually make it to the battlefield in significant numbers. In some ways, it is just smart business. I just hope this ultra-conservative trend doesn't take away to much performance.



posted on Dec, 10 2005 @ 02:07 AM
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I would go with Lockheed Martin's design, it will definitely handle better in rough water. The shallower draft is also a bonus, it should also be able to turn much faster.



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