SCI/TECH: The Gift of ADHD

Originally posted by National Security Agency
I know someone with Asberger's.

It's Asperger's Syndrome and this disorder is no joke. In many cases, a very intelligent mind is trapped in an world unable to communicate effectively, often frustrated because they cannot express adequately what they experience.

You should learn a little about what find so hilarious.

www.udel.edu...

www.google.com...

[edit on 05/3/10 by GradyPhilpott]

In many cases, a very intelligent mind is trapped in an world unable to communicate effectively, often frustrated because they cannot express adequately what they experience.

You just summed me up between ages 13-17 perfectly. I remember those years well unfortunetly...

I'd like to add that I too think alot of times ADHD has been and is misdiagnosed. I think children are often over medicated as well, and I strongly feel that in milder cases the over medication is due to the parents and teachers not wanting to deal with the difficulites that may arise. I mean no offense to anyone, I myself have a boy who I had to withdraw from preschool because his teacher found it too difficult to tend to his spirited nature. His teacher then suggested that my child has ADHD. Were currently working with him hoping we dont have to resort to medication. But we also realize that there might come a time when he must be medicated.

Considering that ADHD is a fiction invented by the pharmaceutical companies to sell drugs, all of this is totally interesting. Oh it is a gift! Well it is totally normal behavior, part of your individuality. All normal young mammals portray "rambuncious behavior," puppies roll around and play, young lions explore and go from one thing to another, as is evident to anyone who has any observational powers whatsoever.

Lazy educators want order at all costs however, and those in power want order at the expense of the actual health of normal kids. It is abnormal to sit still and learn, and to obey all commands. I can think of no more suffocating an experience that the demand for absolute "good behavior and focus," from the young.

And so the elder carried forward his normal behavior, thinking it was a handicap, but he was totally right about the creativity and energy part of it. Yeah ADHD is a gift, it is the gift of fiction transporting itself into the drugging of America, it is economic and cultural theft. And strangely while ADHD is actually a culture of propaganda for profit, people can use it on their own and call it a "gift," or a "talent." Wonderful, but the truth is so much better.

[edit on 10-3-2005 by SkipShipman]

Skip, I have to disagree with you. When I first started into Martial Arts there was this kid in my class who was just off the wall. You could not get him to sit still for a second and was very violent as well. The parents told me he had ADHD and I could tell(they refused to medicate him as well.. he got kicked from the Kung Fu class as he was waaay too disruptive...). There are truely serous cases out there they are just very very rare. I have only encountered it twice. The other case is actually in my extended family, they refused to give him drugs as well but what they did was send him to Military School for 2 years, I believe they copped out even worse but who knows it may help. It's not finished yet...

Originally posted by SkipShipman
It is abnormal to sit still and learn, and to obey all commands. I can think of no more suffocating an experience that the demand for absolute "good behavior and focus," from the young.

It may not be natural to sit and learn and obey all commands, but for children, such is a important component of socialization into an orderly society. Being able to exhibit good behavior and focus is absolutely essential to success in our society, so that is not the problem.

Part of the problem, as you note, is lazy teachers, who would rather have a doped up kid than a behavioral problem in the classroom. You can't really blame a teacher who needs to educate a classroom full of kids, though.

The real problem lies with parents who don't make sure that their children have the requisite skills to enter into the classroom experience and who become beligerant when a teacher brings behavioral problems to their attention.

Most kids who have these problems don't need drugs they need guidance and there is precious little of that in the chaotic culture we are passing on the them.

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Some of these problems are behavioral and cultural, true. But many really are physical. We have changed our world. It's now full of chemicals and radiation and other contaminations that our bodies just are not equipped to handle. So, just as we changed our world, it's changing us too.

Some of these changes happen at the cellular level, some in porteins, some go straight to the genetic code. They are real. And sometimes, these changes affect the way kids brains are hard wired.

...Lots of kids who appear to have behavioral problems are brilliant, bored and just not stimulated enough. Some are brats who need a good talking to. And many simply cannot control their behavior to suit our society because they are not wired that way.

We have changed our own wiring. And in many ways, I don't think it's fair or right to try and force kids into a mold that they are not built to fit.

Just my 2cents.



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Originally posted by GrendelsBacon
I would like to speak from personal experience. I have ADHD, and an IQ of 182, which is hindered in some ways by the ADHD, but it is also complimented. I have been told by others, and have noticed myself that it allows me to be quite responseful, and has enabled me to multi-task extremely well. I agree more with those that call it a blessing, and feel sorry for those who aren't able to realize the blessing that they have been given. Not a day goes by where I am not thankful for my ADHD, I don't know what I would do without it. I was more able to channel more energy into my work when I was medicated for it, but I was very reclusive and had no social ability.

Grend,

I had the same problem on the meds, I could focus better, but I was in a near constant state of panic/anxiety, so I hid and didn't talk to people unless I had too.

Next...

ADHD has been a curse for me in the respect that all I ever wanted to do was fit "inside the box" just like everyone else. However, my distractability has lost me just about every job I have ever had. So I had to force myself out of the box, and now I have been slowly doing creative work. In fact I just was working on the set of a movie Called "Siren" which is being filmed here in Vegas. I not only was an extra but it was a tight set, and everyone was really friendly including the lead actors. By the end of the shoot everyone knew each other, and I got some extra kudos for helping organize the other extras, and made sure they all got into make-up.

-ADHDsux4me

As more and more children are being labeled ADHD, I would think that teachers WOULD be able to handle a room full of children. Perhaps an aide would be beneficial for all? I think in some cases poor parenting is probably to blame, but certainly not in all. The right kind of guidance in the right direction is a must.

Here is a link for you guys,

www.adhd-report.com...

I haven't read it all yet to have a full view of what is being said, but it does look like an eye opener.

Look guys, the makers of ADHD have brought you such ridiculous disorders such as "Mathematics Disorder." Don't believe me look it up, it's classified as a disorder. If I have a hard time learning French, do I now have a French disorder? I mean what in the crap is a "Mathematics Disorder." "Excuse me doctor Bigbookofdiseases could you pass me some of the Mathematics pills." Why should anyone follow the advice of such institutions, when they are cataloging every little nuance of a difficulty into a disorder or a disease. (Definition of nuance - A subtle or slight degree of difference, as in meaning, feeling, or tone; a gradation.)

Dark curtains are being pulled over your eyes, concealing the truth, the time to wake up is now.

Troy

I agree up to a certain point that ADHD should be medicated, but it all really depends on the person affected.
I have ADHD and was diagnosed early on in my life at approximately 7 - 8 yrs old before doctors put a label on it and also before much was known about it.
It was called hyperactivity then.
I am mid 30's now and was taken off my medication before my teenage years because, well it really didnt do anything to help me except control my moods, basically drugged me into submission.
I have done more to help myself control this then any pill ever could and even with my attention span being shorter than a ferret I still was valedictorian of my high school class.
So I dont agree with doctors and the drug industry saying that this cant be controlled without medication, it all depends on the environment a person grows up in and how much help and support they receive

Having ADHD is both a curse and a gift.

Having this myself I can tell you what most of the people on here is true..things that may seem hard to some seems easy to me.

When they tested me for it they had me put puzzles together,do math equations in my head,and would have blocks with red and white on them.they would show a picture that the blocks can make then timed me on making the same pictures.All these were easy to me.

All I do every moment I'm awake is think,but I find that I dwell on the same subjects,religion mostly or the existence of god to be more accurate.Only reasoning I have for why I think of that the most is because it's the biggest puzzle that noone has been able to sovle....yet.

And to me that is the curse,not being able to shut my brain off ,I have to take a sleep aid way more often than I would like to just to sleep. another bad side is the amount of thoughts that can go through my head at once,at any given moment if you were to ask me what I'm thinking I'll give you several answers.

I've found that while most peeps with this disorder are rather gifted in the smarts department,others may not be as smart but have a gift with mechanical things like electronics.My friends' oldest son is this way,he isn't the brightest kid in his class but he can take a VCR or DVD player that doesn't work take it apart,tinker with it,put it back together and it works!Now mind you this boy is 11,I've watched him do these things since he was able to hold a screwdriver.

Another curse and I think this one is the worse is the inability to keep my focus on one task.It's almost impossible for me to do just one thing without having other things going on around me...for example when I was 16(I'm32 now)I worked in a family resturaunt,I wasn't able cook one meal at a time without screwing it up somehow...but have 9 tickets on the wheel and all 9 orders cooking at once and I was in heaven and every order was perfectly prepared,I can't sit in a class or meeting without a piece of paper to doodle on so I can concentrate on what's going on in the room.

And to the person that wondered about ADHD and allergies...the only things I'm allergic to are poison ivy,which doesn't affect me as much now as it did when i was a kid,and mayo(although the mayo one could be all in my head)

And to Thichheaded(SP?) fleas actually live quite a bit longer than a week. depending on temperature and other things,they can in fact live up to a year ,and the female(which 2 of every 3 fleas are female)can lay eggs for over 3 months.

Hope this info with the rest of the other posts from peeps with it helps people without ADHD understand alittle more.

Simon B

Originally posted by Patriot36
I have done more to help myself control this then any pill ever could and even with my attention span being shorter than a ferret I still was valedictorian of my high school class.
So I dont agree with doctors and the drug industry saying that this cant be controlled without medication, it all depends on the environment a person grows up in and how much help and support they receive

I agree totally Patriot36...When I finally learned that I could control it instead of it controlling me I found that I could help myself in ways no doctor or pill could.

The bottom line is that any supposed defect, weakness, or disability, if viewed right is the seed of an equal advantage,whether it s ADHD, Bi polar, blindness etc. If you know how to control your perception, any perceived weakness can become a strength.

So said Aristotle, which could be ascribed to the behavior of Socates before him.I first became very suspect of this "ADD" label when I heard Eli Lilly had developed Strattera and was sending their pep reps out to pitch...I mean provide "expertise" to help doctors identify symptoms of this "growing social phonemena.Since when did pharmco sales reps attain their PHds to be the leading authorities of the medicine world.

Two years ago, a drug called Strattera became the first ADD medication approved specifically for adults. Drug maker Eli Lilly is trying to reach out to the 8 million adult Americans it believes are suffering from ADD. The drug was launched amid heavy publicity - television ads, radio spots and print ads - directing adults to be screened.

A Recent 60 Minutes ADD Report

Don't get me wrong, I know every parent wants their child to excel to their highest potential in the classroom and in life but at what detriment to the child's personality, natural disposition or character do these chill pills offer.Everyone possesses wonderful idiosyncracies that make us individually unique and life so interesting.I would hate to see Big Pharma profiteering from zombifying the Leonardo da Vinci's of our world for no other reason than simply feeding their insatiable greed by falsely alarming parents,misleading "normal" adults,or further vexing the already insecure with the intentional mis-marketing of this thinly veiled eugenics campaign, aiming to streamline society's myriad behaviors into some evil uniformity of predictable,docile,tunnelvision automatons with limited specialties.Kind of reminds me of that old Life Cereal commercial slogan "Unless they're WEIRD, your kids will eat it!" A good man/woman may know their limitations as the platitude may say,but the great rarely do; spontanaiety,impulsiveness, animation,etc. are natural and can display a simple zest or curiosity for life, intuitive improvisation is a trait of genius, not a disease as Pharmco wants others to believe.I personally never believe anyone advocating or attributing a certain mood=doom theory,there's always an agenda somewhere, and rarely can it be compared to,say, a Salk-Polio vaccine but that won't deter Drugs'R' Us from trying their mightiest from every conceivable angle to assuage the masses otherwise.Maybe where 2 minds think the same,1 is not needed.For certain, you won't see them pushing any remedy for megalomania or other miserly, greed-symptomatic "disease" they exhibit, never letting a lucratively marketable pill go unrewarded.

Until I see more compelling evidence to the contrary,I'm inclined to agree with this Dr. Fred A. Baughman Jr even though I haven't fully read his book yet:

ADD isn't an infection, so we can't make a vaccine and immunize the children. Be forewarned that ADD is not a real disease, but rather a contrived illusion of a disease, a marketplace tool, so you can keep your child from contacting it.

Diseases are natural occurrences caused by infections, toxins, abnormal genes, cancer, etc., and are characterized by definite, detectable physical abnormalities. They are diagnosed and described (in journals) by scientific physicians caring for affected patients.

What kind of "disease" is this ADD -invented in 1980 in-committee, at the American Psychiatric Association? What kind of science is this? Despite regular announcements that its "biological roots" have been discovered, no proof exists of a definite abnormality. It remains an illusion of a disease--a powerful, dangerous illusion. For parents to believe otherwise and allow the "ADD" label to be affixed to their child signals the end of normal childhood. Henceforth they are "diseased".

Should they manifest inattention, carelessness, disorganization, forgetfulness, distractibility, daydreaming, drowsiness, butting, blurting, climbing, fidgeting, talking, inability to be quiet, wait or say - Eureka! - "ADD" - a "brain disease", a "chemical imbalance of the brain" !

Next they [Psychiatrists] would "balance" the "chemical imbalance" of the brain, and CHADD (Children & Adults with ADD) and it's benefactor--pharmaceutical giant...

How could this be ? How can a behavioral check-list or any paper-pencil test prove the presence of a brain disease. The answer is that none can. Not ever ! That too, is deception.

For a physician to knowingly misrepresent a condition as a disease when it is not, is a flawed informed consent and is malpractice.

Whether your child will be considered normal or not is what is at stake. like it or not, you must question all that they do. You sent your child to school to learn to read and for education and that is what teachers are there for, not to practice psychology and psychiatry.

•There is no solid evidence that ADHD is a genuine disorder or disease of any kind.

•There is a great deal of research to confirm that environmental problems cause ADHD-like symptoms.

•A very small number of children may suffer ADHD-like symptoms because of physical disorders, such as lead poisoning, drug intoxication, exhaustion, and head injury. Physical causes may be more common among poor communities in the United States.

•There is no proof of any physical abnormalities in the brains or bodies of children who are routinely labeled ADHD. They do not have known biochemical imbalances or "crossed wires."

•ADHD is a controversial diagnosis with little or no scientific or medical basis. A parent, teacher, or doctor can feel in good company when utterly dismissing the diagnosis and refusing to apply it to children.

More on Ritalin, ADD?etc. here

Parents/Adults will base their decisions on what conclusions they arrive at, but should always trust their own instincts rather than rely on the interests that seek to control them.

[edit on 11-3-2005 by Vajrayana]

mwm1331

The bottom line is that any supposed defect, weakness, or disability, if viewed right is the seed of an equal advantage,whether it s ADHD, Bi polar, blindness etc. If you know how to control your perception, any perceived weakness can become a strength.

You got it.

Originally posted by Vajrayana

I first became very suspect of this "ADD" label when I heard Eli Lilly had developed Strattera and was sending their pep reps out to pitch...I mean provide "expertise" to help doctors identify symptoms of this "growing social phonemena.Since when did pharmco sales reps attain their PHds to be the leading authorities of the medicine world.

Unfortunately, most doctors "continuing education" after graduation comes from drug reps. It's an absolute travesty.

I would hate to see Big Pharma profiteering from zombifying the Leonardo da Vinci's of our world for no other reason than simply feeding their insatiable greed by falsely alarming parents,misleading "normal" adults,or further vexing the already insecure with the intentional mis-marketing of this thinly veiled eugenics campaign,

Astute observations as usual.

But only partly right. ...From allergies and asthsma to pregnancy-induced high blood pressure and pre-eclamsia, obesity, SIDS, migraines, cluster headaches and more - many disorders that started appearing in the mid-1900's and have since become epidemic - were all originally thought to be of "psychological origin" or somehow self-inflicted.

....But - The intel originally owned privately by Big Pharma is now making it's way into the public domain. And surprise, surprise. Misfolded proteins play a major role in virtually all these diseases. Which is why they push meds targeted to proteins.

A 1989 Japanese study based on biopsies for example, found FMD in 100% of diagnosed migraine sufferers. In most cases, the evidence of disease was microscopic - there are no diagnostic blood tests in common use; even arteriography missed the classic lesions.

"All of the (migraine) cases showed pathological findings of fibromuscular dysplasia (FMD)"

"Morphological studies of extracranial arteries in patients with migraine" PMID: 2636957

......So the point is, standard diagnostic tests do NOT reveal the presence of disease or even disease process - never mind cellular or genetic glitches - but a growing body of research does. Yes, many are created by exposure to environmental contaminants.

spontanaiety,impulsiveness, animation,etc. are natural and can display a simple zest or curiosity for life, intuitive improvisation is a trait of genius, not a disease as Pharmco wants others to believe.

Absolutely. Agreed. But it's also true that kids have "changed" and people are looking around for explanations. ...Some of these changes are viewed as "pathological."

Your and my arguments and position are exactly the same - excepting that I recognize the "behavioral changes" very often result from physical changes at the cellular or genetic level.

....I also recognize that some kids live in pain, or with frightening dissociation. In some cases the right medication may be helpful.

...And it all comes down to accurate diagnosis - which is unavailable because the appropriate tests are not covered by insurance. ...The relevant clauses disallow "investigative diagnostic testing" - basically saying doctors must already have an accurate diagnosis, and only use the tests to confirm it.

Until I see more compelling evidence to the contrary,I'm inclined to agree with this Dr. Fred A. Baughman Jr ...:

ADD isn't an infection, so we can't make a vaccine and immunize the children. Be forewarned that ADD is not a real disease, but rather a contrived illusion of a disease, a marketplace tool, so you can keep your child from contacting it.

Re: compelling evidence. Just review the medical literature. Spend some time at the Environmental Genome Project (EGP). You might start with the "molecular epidemiology" section.

True - Big Pharma is trying to make hay with this situation, and their solutions are non-solutions - but they didn't manufacture the pathology.

Diseases are natural occurrences caused by infections, toxins, abnormal genes, cancer, etc., and are characterized by definite, detectable physical abnormalities. They are diagnosed and described (in journals) by scientific physicians caring for affected patients.

What kind of "disease" is this ADD -invented in 1980 in-committee, at the American Psychiatric Association? What kind of science is this? Despite regular announcements that its "biological roots" have been discovered, no proof exists of a definite abnormality. It remains an illusion of a disease--a powerful, dangerous illusion. For parents to believe otherwise and allow the "ADD" label to be affixed to their child signals the end of normal childhood. Henceforth they are "diseased".

One of the primary reasons there is no "proof" of abnormality is the ongoing and entirely synthetic prion controversy. ...Admitting that infectious prions exist and are epidemic puts corporate industry in line for some bone-breaking liability charges. ...So the official position is that prions aren't infectious, and that new diseases are psychological, self-inflicted and a matter of personal responsibility.

...That's the platform of the thinly veiled eugenics campaign you reffered to above. The strategy is simple: prevent accurate diagnosis, deny the reality.

How can a behavioral check-list or any paper-pencil test prove the presence of a brain disease. The answer is that none can. Not ever !

True. But it's all that is available.

For a physician to knowingly misrepresent a condition as a disease when it is not, is a flawed informed consent and is malpractice.

•There is no solid evidence that ADHD is a genuine disorder or disease of any kind.

The evidence is accumulating.

•There is a great deal of research to confirm that environmental problems cause ADHD-like symptoms.

•A very small number of children may suffer ADHD-like symptoms because of physical disorders, such as lead poisoning, drug intoxication, exhaustion, and head injury. Physical causes may be more common among poor communities in the United States.

True. ...Most modern diseases and disorders are "multi-factorial" - many factors play a role and work together to create pathology. Sometimes, removing even one of those factors will solve the problem, pathologically speaking.

•There is no proof of any physical abnormalities in the brains or bodies of children who are routinely labeled ADHD. They do not have known biochemical imbalances or "crossed wires."

What we have here is a logical trap. If there is an admission that children are being 'changed' by the world, then the kids are set up as targets. ....The new eugenics movement wants that to happen, with the proviso that parents and genetics are at fault - the liberals do not want a hint of genetic culpability. Neither camp wants to admit that infectious disease is rampant, and NOT "completely eradicated in the civilized world."

....So non-diagnosis policies are universally supported, and kids are left out in the cold without appropriate supports.

•ADHD is a controversial diagnosis with little or no scientific or medical basis.

Just like Mad Cow doesn't exist in the USA, and new microbial mutations do not make it into the water supply along with arsenic and a variety of other heavy metals. ...Spin - IMO.

.......IMO - a better, more humane strategy acknowledges the existence of these diseases, disorders and changes - and focuses on the positive, like these new books.


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Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
You should learn a little about what find so hilarious.

Hey pal, you need to chill out. My friend is a psycometrist because their condition and because they got it under control. Don't belittle my comments because you assume I am making fun of it. I'm not making fun of the condition, I'm making fun of the pronounciation. Quit taking everything so serious. CHILL OUT, DUDE!

ADHD is a label. The label given to you is suppressive, it says "you have ADHD." It gives Doc Bigneedles a reason to drug you into stupidity. You guys are smarter than this. You don't have to buy into this label.

Heck, you might find something as simple as a lack of B vitamins at the root of some of your problems. This would be a B vitamin deficiency, not ADHD.

Troy

Originally posted by cybertroy
ADHD is a label. The label given to you is suppressive, it says "you have ADHD." It gives Doc Bigneedles a reason to drug you into stupidity. You guys are smarter than this. You don't have to buy into this label.

Heck, you might find something as simple as a lack of B vitamins at the root of some of your problems. This would be a B vitamin deficiency, not ADHD.

Troy

True. Labels can be repressive. But lots of people are really sick - and they're confused because they don't know what's wrong. Too many doctors are telling them it's psychological, or their own fault for some reason - and make it like it's this big personal responsibility. ...But it's not. It's an illness with a physical cause. Sometimes the cause hasn't been discovered, other times it's just ignored. But the people with the symptoms are left hanging - and stepped on - first by being told there's nothing wrong, and then by not being able to get the right help. It's not just - and it really sucks.